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New Immigration Decree, Long Life To King Macri!


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#21
Sockhopper

Sockhopper
Ed Larson,

You need far more than 'enlightenment' and a snarky request framed by your sense of self-entitlement to an answer. Your questions and comments to my post on the UK show a complete lack of knowledge about what the EU is, what a country's membership in it means, what May has done since the article you linked -an old one from last July! You'd need to do intense studying  of all the above and read what's happened each day over the past 7 months. .

I'll tell you only that:
'Brexit' hasn't occurred. The UK is a member state of the EU. Brits are EU citizens.

The referendum was merely an advisory opinion to the government, not one that compels a government to make law or oust informed debate and scrutiny by Parliament,  nor one that identifies judges as evil for respecting and applying the British Constitution.

The UK is suffering its worst constitutional crisis since WWII

  Xenohobia is not being controlled. May ignores it. She's both encouraging and living off dividing British citizens from one another and from non-UK EU residents in the UK. A Polish man residing in the UK was bullied on a bus by 5 passengers to "GO HOME" and forced off the bus by threats of physical injury. Another one had been beaten to death in the street a few weeks before: he was caught speaking Polish. School children arrived at school one day to find notes from classmates asking, "Wnen are you leaving?" although the targets were born in England. A patient seeing his doctor for a health problem asked him casually the same question. An Italian visitor on holiday in the UK was blasted for speaking Italian with her travel companion. Non-UK EU citizens who are experts and profs at the LSE received letters saying their services were no longer needed and that they can't take up a job in the UK which requires their advising the British government on EU law or its systems and practices. (Note: the UK has only 20 trade negotiators. The EU itself has 600. There would be no pubic healthcare in the UK but for the EU resident foreigners in the UK who are 1/3 or 2/3 of its staff.)


I've cancelled a short visit to London. I'm too afraid to holiday in my own country now. Even though one is a British citizen, some are seen as foreigners by Brexiters for knowing any language other than English. If you reply that you're British, you can be called a traitor to British values for having exercised your EU right of free movement incorporated into British law for 44 years now. My husband and I attended university here to learn French and French culture as new retirees. There's too big a risk of my starting to speak in French in the UK before I realise that I am and then, embarrassed,  switching to English.

You'd be better off focusing on the important news provided by 'bajo_cero' and 'steve' about Arg and its severe constitutional challenge to   citizenship - the highest status that each person in the world can have in his life.

#22
fifs2

fifs2

Sockhopper, on 22 January 2017 - 02:39 PM, said:

Ed Larson,

You need far more than 'enlightenment' and a snarky request framed by your sense of self-entitlement to an answer. Your questions and comments to my post on the UK show a complete lack of knowledge about what the EU is, what a country's membership in it means, what May has done since the article you linked -an old one from last July! You'd need to do intense studying  of all the above and read what's happened each day over the past 7 months. .

I'll tell you only that:
'Brexit' hasn't occurred. The UK is a member state of the EU. Brits are EU citizens.

The referendum was merely an advisory opinion to the government, not one that compels a government to make law or oust informed debate and scrutiny by Parliament,  nor one that identifies judges as evil for respecting and applying the British Constitution.    

The UK is suffering its worst constitutional crisis since WWII

  Xenohobia is not being controlled. May ignores it. She's both encouraging and living off dividing British citizens from one another and from non-UK EU residents in the UK. A Polish man residing in the UK was bullied on a bus by 5 passengers to "GO HOME" and forced off the bus by threats of physical injury. Another one had been beaten to death in the street a few weeks before: he was caught speaking Polish. School children arrived at school one day to find notes from classmates asking, "Wnen are you leaving?" although the targets were born in England. A patient seeing his doctor for a health problem asked him casually the same question. An Italian visitor on holiday in the UK was blasted for speaking Italian with her travel companion. Non-UK EU citizens who are experts and profs at the LSE received letters saying their services were no longer needed and that they can't take up a job in the UK which requires their advising the British government on EU law or its systems and practices. (Note: the UK has only 20 trade negotiators. The EU itself has 600. There would be no pubic healthcare in the UK but for the EU resident foreigners in the UK who are 1/3 or 2/3 of its staff.)


I've cancelled a short visit to London. I'm too afraid to holiday in my own country now. Even though one is a British citizen, some are seen as foreigners by Brexiters for knowing any language other than English. If you reply that you're British, you can be called a traitor to British values for having exercised your EU right of free movement incorporated into British law for 44 years now. My husband and I attended university here to learn French and French culture as new retirees. There's too big a risk of my starting to speak in French in the UK before I realise that I am and then, embarrassed,  switching to English.

You'd be better off focusing on the important news provided by 'bajo_cero' and 'steve' about Arg and its severe constitutional challenge to   citizenship - the highest status that each person in the world can have in his life.



Your hysteria is blinding you to reality.  Tm clearly stated this week that all EU law has been instated as UK law. No removal of rights. I was in London before christmas with 2 Spanish friends and one from Peru. They adored it...and if anything we spoke more Spanish than English as we encountered so many spanish speakers in restaurants and shops. You need to look outside your ivory tower of middle class privelege and understand how unlimited immigration has negatively impacted uk cities where even immigrants from India and pakistan from the last century voted brexit in large numbers because the new wave of newcomers do not share their values of inclusion and job seeking. Open your eyes man. Not everyone has a job nor money in the bank at the end of the month yet you expect them to vote a stsrem that promises more of the same

#23
EJLarson

EJLarson
  • LocationTexas and Parque Chacabuco

fifs2, on 22 January 2017 - 03:13 PM, said:

Your hysteria is blinding you to reality.  Tm clearly stated this week that all EU law has been instated as UK law. No removal of rights. I was in London before christmas with 2 Spanish friends and one from Peru. They adored it...and if anything we spoke more Spanish than English as we encountered so many spanish speakers in restaurants and shops. You need to look outside your ivory tower of middle class privelege and understand how unlimited immigration has negatively impacted uk cities where even immigrants from India and pakistan from the last century voted brexit in large numbers because the new wave of newcomers do not share their values of inclusion and job seeking. Open your eyes man. Not everyone has a job nor money in the bank at the end of the month yet you expect them to vote a stsrem that promises more of the same

Sadly, have to agree with this, and not from a distance.  My wife (Argentine-born) and I spent most of last September in the UK.  There wasn't the least sign of hostility (or even curiosity) anywhere we went (Oxford, London, Cornwall).  As is our custom, we spoke Spanish between ourselves wherever we went, and got nary a look - but that's not surprising, because in London/Oxford the English-speakers seemed to be in the minority.  We used public transport exclusively - the bus and underground populations seemed about 60% Asian/African/etc. vs obvious Caucasians.

"I've cancelled a short visit to London. I'm too afraid to holiday in my own country now. Even though one is a British citizen, some are seen as foreigners by Brexiters for knowing any language other than English."  You're obviously very emotionally distressed by all of this but, as I pointed out, in a month of travelling public transport, if any militant Brexiters were on those buses, they were very quiet and in any event, outnumbered.  You should have reconsidered your visit to London.  We had a pleasant time.

"'Brexit' hasn't occurred. The UK is a member state of the EU. Brits are EU citizens."   Of course. No one is confused about this.  The issue is that the government's position is that it is honor-bound to execute the will of the voters as expressed in the vote - which was of course not legally binding, but was the voters' will.  If I understand correctly, the Supreme Court is expected to rule that the government cannot initiate Article 50 to start the exit process without a parliamentary vote.  That is likely to be a circus.  

http://www.bbc.com/n...litics-38710698

So, are there any major politicians/parties vigorously opposing triggering Article 50? If not Labour, who?
-- Ed

#24
Gringoboy

Gringoboy
  • LocationLa Lucila, Buenos Aires

Sockhopper, on 22 January 2017 - 02:39 PM, said:

Ed Larson,

You need far more than 'enlightenment' and a snarky request framed by your sense of self-entitlement to an answer. Your questions and comments to my post on the UK show a complete lack of knowledge about what the EU is, what a country's membership in it means, what May has done since the article you linked -an old one from last July! You'd need to do intense studying  of all the above and read what's happened each day over the past 7 months. .

I'll tell you only that:
'Brexit' hasn't occurred. The UK is a member state of the EU. Brits are EU citizens.

The referendum was merely an advisory opinion to the government, not one that compels a government to make law or oust informed debate and scrutiny by Parliament,  nor one that identifies judges as evil for respecting and applying the British Constitution.

The UK is suffering its worst constitutional crisis since WWII

  Xenohobia is not being controlled. May ignores it. She's both encouraging and living off dividing British citizens from one another and from non-UK EU residents in the UK. A Polish man residing in the UK was bullied on a bus by 5 passengers to "GO HOME" and forced off the bus by threats of physical injury. Another one had been beaten to death in the street a few weeks before: he was caught speaking Polish. School children arrived at school one day to find notes from classmates asking, "Wnen are you leaving?" although the targets were born in England. A patient seeing his doctor for a health problem asked him casually the same question. An Italian visitor on holiday in the UK was blasted for speaking Italian with her travel companion. Non-UK EU citizens who are experts and profs at the LSE received letters saying their services were no longer needed and that they can't take up a job in the UK which requires their advising the British government on EU law or its systems and practices. (Note: the UK has only 20 trade negotiators. The EU itself has 600. There would be no pubic healthcare in the UK but for the EU resident foreigners in the UK who are 1/3 or 2/3 of its staff.)


I've cancelled a short visit to London. I'm too afraid to holiday in my own country now. Even though one is a British citizen, some are seen as foreigners by Brexiters for knowing any language other than English. If you reply that you're British, you can be called a traitor to British values for having exercised your EU right of free movement incorporated into British law for 44 years now. My husband and I attended university here to learn French and French culture as new retirees. There's too big a risk of my starting to speak in French in the UK before I realise that I am and then, embarrassed,  switching to English.

You'd be better off focusing on the important news provided by 'bajo_cero' and 'steve' about Arg and its severe constitutional challenge to   citizenship - the highest status that each person in the world can have in his life.
Are you British, French or what? Too afraid to visit your own country? Oh please!
Either way, you're just scaremongering. Never in any of my visits back home have I either witnessed or heard about that kind of xenophobia or foreigner bashing.
Yes, I'm British too and I do know the problems that the UK has been facing with immigration, but certainly not to the extent that you put forward.
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#25
Bajo_cero2

Bajo_cero2

nikad, on 22 January 2017 - 12:35 PM, said:

In all honesty I don't really care for a person that is a criminal and is not even Argentine.

As I stated before, you do not care because you believe that it does not involve you. But, tomorrow you have a car crash, someone gets hurts, and immigration is able to arrest you, for example.

Or they can deport you even with permanent residency because there is control of a judge.

nikad, on 22 January 2017 - 12:35 PM, said:

I would prefer a law and not a decree, but it will serve the purpose anyway.

In fact, the difference is between a republic and an absolut monarchy.

nikad, on 22 January 2017 - 12:35 PM, said:

Whether a judge is involved or not, I honestly don't care either.

This is not a small thing. The draft allows to deport without even a deportation order. It means that 90% of the forum member can be arrested and deported becouse thry cannot show a DNI while Until now the worst scenario was a green paper that gave you 30 days to apply for residency.

It means that police can ask you for id at the street and in 24 hs you are deported. But you are glad about that.

nikad, on 22 January 2017 - 12:35 PM, said:

Let's stress that this is not about illegal immigrants but criminals that enter the country illegally.

Here you are wrong.

If you read today elpais, the DNM states that the idea is to avoid people who had criminal records to get into the country or to deport them.

It doesn't mean a conviction, even if you where found non guilty. Remember that the FBI criminal check informs about arrests. This is enough.

In NYC you can be arrested for drinking a beer at the street.

http://internacional...557_658530.html

So, if you has any issue 20 years ago, you are going to be deported.

The second mistake is that this draft change from irregular immigration to illegal inmigration and, then, all of you becone criminals.

It also allows to review permament residencies. If you made the Colonia run, then permanent residency can be cancel because they can review you record.

nikad, on 22 January 2017 - 12:35 PM, said:

They can be judged, sentenced and sent to prison in their home countries sponsored by their citizens.

No. This is not the target of the decree. If immigration deports a criminal under procedure here, the criminal judge arrest the immigration agent for obstraction justice.

nikad, on 22 January 2017 - 12:35 PM, said:

I could not care less, and I don't care who does this, if CFK had done it I would have applauded her. I don't honestly see what Peron, the nazis, etc have to do with this. This is Argentina 2017, a country where villas miseria have multiplied x 3 in the last 12 years.

Well, it is all about that. The biggest issue if this country is that judges and the administration enforces the Constitution of 1949 that was nazi.

nikad, on 22 January 2017 - 12:35 PM, said:

This bs that you are talking about is nonsense, no HONEST person, whether they are here legally or illegally will be deported unless they are CRIMINALS with records in the home countries or commit crime here.

You wish. A client of mine was deported 1 week ago even he is honest, and two judges order to do not deport him until the appeal is decide. I witness how the judge was coertioned by immigration. I was shock.
So, the institutional situation is very bad because King Macri is trying to submit the judges.
www.rubilarcitizenship.com
Dr. Christian Rubilar

#26
on the brink

on the brink
Yes, we were SO much better off under Empress Cristina...!   She did not have to "submit the judges" - she simply bought them. :P :P :P :P

#27
Bajo_cero2

Bajo_cero2
I have never see something like that under the former administration.
Is submit the wrong word? I mean someter.
www.rubilarcitizenship.com
Dr. Christian Rubilar

#28
nikad

nikad

Bajo_cero2, on 22 January 2017 - 10:06 PM, said:

As I stated before, you do not care because you believe that it does not involve you. But, tomorrow you have a car crash, someone gets hurts, and immigration is able to arrest you, for example.

Or they can deport you even with permanent residency because there is control of a judge.



In fact, the difference is between a republic and an absolut monarchy.



This is not a small thing. The draft allows to deport without even a deportation order. It means that 90% of the forum member can be arrested and deported becouse thry cannot show a DNI while Until now the worst scenario was a green paper that gave you 30 days to apply for residency.

It means that police can ask you for id at the street and in 24 hs you are deported. But you are glad about that.



Here you are wrong.

If you read today elpais, the DNM states that the idea is to avoid people who had criminal records to get into the country or to deport them.

It doesn't mean a conviction, even if you where found non guilty. Remember that the FBI criminal check informs about arrests. This is enough.

In NYC you can be arrested for drinking a beer at the street.

http://internacional...557_658530.html

So, if you has any issue 20 years ago, you are going to be deported.

The second mistake is that this draft change from irregular immigration to illegal inmigration and, then, all of you becone criminals.

It also allows to review permament residencies. If you made the Colonia run, then permanent residency can be cancel because they can review you record.



No. This is not the target of the decree. If immigration deports a criminal under procedure here, the criminal judge arrest the immigration agent for obstraction justice.



Well, it is all about that. The biggest issue if this country is that judges and the administration enforces the Constitution of 1949 that was nazi.



You wish. A client of mine was deported 1 week ago even he is honest, and two judges order to do not deport him until the appeal is decide. I witness how the judge was coertioned by immigration. I was shock.
So, the institutional situation is very bad because King Macri is trying to submit the judges.

I think you either haven't read the draft or are making some weird conclusions...

1- They are looking to expedite the extradition of foreigners that have committed crimes in the country ( it can take years currently and they want to be able to do it in less than two months )

2- It allows the revoking of residency for those involved in crimes related to drugs, guns and persons trafficking as well as money laundering.

3- Judges will have to inform Migrations about any crimes committed by foreigners and any rulings against them.

4- The idea is to allow Migrations to expedite deportations at the same time that the judicial process is being executed.

5- The foreign person will have three days to appeal any decision. After that period, the foreign person will have another three days to present any legal resource and the judge will have three days to decide and rule.

6- All legal periods will be shortened to avoid manipulation and dilation.

7- To get citizenship, two years living in the country will not be sufficient, it will be required that they have had legal and current permanent residency at the time of applying for citizenship.

Sorry Bajo, but in my opinion this is all good news. I don't see any ghosts or witch hunts really. It really has nothing to do with the examples you gave about drinking beer, etc. It is to prevent narcos, money laundering, trafficking of persons and guns. I highly doubt we have any forum members involved in such activities, whether they are here legally or as perma tourists, they should just keep living their lives and not worry about this.
Dinamo International Movers -  To / From Argentina, USA, Europe and Latin America. Customized, honest and reliable service.

#29
ceviche

ceviche
  • LocationCapital Federal
- To get citizenship, two years living in the country will not be sufficient, it will be required that they have had legal and current permanent residency at the time of applying for citizenship.

I like this rule. Its for the best of the country.

#30
Bajo_cero2

Bajo_cero2
Nikad, you like the new decree, I understood that.
You also prefer dictatorship, I got it!

All the topics you mentioned subjugates the Judges when they must control the President and the Congress. This decree by pass all the controls.

What can go wrong?

My client was deported even his case was appealed (appeals suspends deportation) and a criminal judge ordered to do not deport him until the SC decides (on habeas corpus the first instance judge ruled in 4 hours, the chamber the day after, the chamber of casacion took 4 days and the Supreme Court is fast but he was illegally deported before, so now the process is not expedite and continues at standard speed)

So, as you see the process is fast even with proper Court control.
www.rubilarcitizenship.com
Dr. Christian Rubilar




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