Argentinas Corrupt Penal And Judicial System

[EricBluegrassFiddle]

This was just too good to pass up...

You know here in the Province of Buenos Aires, they have a program called "Casas Por Carceles" - "Houses for Jailcells"

A social program that's been implemented by the completely inept and "totally corrupt" "Ministerio de Seguridad de la Prov de Buenos Aires"

http://www.mseg.gba.gov.ar/mjysseg/SubsecInvestig/ModelosDetencion/programas%20casas.html

Basically inside the pentientary system at different prisons throughout the province they've constructed virtual "houses" in small neighborhood type simulation for certain inmates to live in where they can receive certian kinds of rehabilitative treatments while living there before their eventual release. Many of these inmates are hardened criminals and are serving time for murder and attempted murder, many multiple <----remember this point.

These houses include: stoves and ktichens for cooking, heating, are furnished and also include parrillas....like a tiny resort cabins in Bariloche or some place..

This is my favorite line from the description, quote: "Como se dijo, el propio detenido, quien recibe no solo el confort que brindan estas viviendas sino una posibilidad de incorporar pautas de responsabilidad que le servirán al momento de su egreso institucional"

Loosely translated: "As stated, the detainee, receives not only the comfort that these living quarters provide but also the possibility of learning basic rules of responsible living that will help them when they complete their transition back to normal society

Here's a picture of one of these prison "Viviendas" that the convicted murderers and rapists get to live in while they're being "rehabilitated" for their eventual Life outside of prison. You can't even get a loan here to buy a house yet these killers get nice knew homes to live in while serving time behind bars. Of course they have to be "evaluted by professional groups of physchiatrists" (laughable) before they can take advantage of living in one of these before their release:

I read this today in the news:

http://www.0223.com....as-transitorias

They recently aprehended the guy that was involved in the shooting at the hospital. He was responsible for a murder during a violent robbery in 2002 but it get's even better...

He was arrested; at the Batan Penitentary outside of Mar del Plata! The guy was already serving time in jail! it's literally unbelievable, although I've heard of this happening before. They've been keeping this new social program underwraps but it's beginning to get out and see the light of day.

This guy, inisde the prison system and was part of our wonderful new gov't program "Casas por Carceles" living in one of the swanky little chalets that the judicial system provided. So, how did het get out.....?

Well they have a "Temporary release benefit" where certain inmates that they deem well into the rehabilitation process and having exhibitied a record of good behavior on "Thursdays" or "open release day" are allowed to "leave the prison complex" ...yes... as in leave between the hours of 7am to 7pm....a full day, were talking about a convicted killer people! This guy killed an innocent person during a violent robbery in 2002. So when this guy left for the day, he attempted to rob a hospital and that's when all this happened, shootout, stole a remis etc...

I asked my friend who's a lawyer if this is actually true and he said "yes" not only that, he knows the lawyer that represented this guy in 2002 and all he would tell me is that the guy is a known member of a drug cartel in Buenos Aires.. and also that this program is growing... he just laughed about it and said "Eso es Argentina, nunca te deja de soprender" "This is Argentina, it never ceases to surprise you" LOL

It's unbelievable, incredibly irresponsible and is a perfect example of why crime is so bad in the first place and just not going to improve...it's going to get worse, steadily as it has been. What do criminals have to lose by operating within Arg? Why very little of course as this is a prime example. With a corrupt and lax judicial, a bunch of social and political hacks that think the worst of the worst of society can be normalized and rehabilitated. Then as soon as they get out they are back to robbing and murdering innocent people as always. If that isn't bad enough, allow these people to actually leave on good behavior, murderers, killers, violent people?

This is a perfect example of the abject failure and incompetence of this countries judicial and penal system, which is clearly corrupt, broken and increasingly putting the population at greater risk, through soft to literaly no sentencing of hardened criminals, rediculous social rehabilitative programs and early releases. This does not bode well for dealing with the skyrocketing crime in Argentina..

 

[ajoknoblauch]

This was just too good to pass up...

You know here in the Province of Buenos Aires, they have a program called "Casas Por Carceles" - "Houses for Jailcells"

A social program that's been implemented by the completely inept and "totally corrupt" "Ministerio de Seguridad de la Prov de Buenos Aires"

http://www.mseg.gba.gov.ar/mjysseg/SubsecInvestig/ModelosDetencion/programas%20casas.html

Basically inside the pentientary system at different prisons throughout the province they've constructed virtual "houses" in small neighborhood type simulation for certain inmates to live in where they can receive certian kinds of rehabilitative treatments while living there before their eventual release. Many of these inmates are hardened criminals and are serving time for murder and attempted murder, many multiple <----remember this point.

These houses include: stoves and ktichens for cooking, heating, are furnished and also include parrillas....like a tiny resort cabins in Bariloche or some place..

This is my favorite line from the description, quote: "Como se dijo, el propio detenido, quien recibe no solo el confort que brindan estas viviendas sino una posibilidad de incorporar pautas de responsabilidad que le servirán al momento de su egreso institucional"

Loosely translated: "As stated, the detainee, receives not only the comfort that these living quarters provide but also the possibility of learning basic rules of responsible living that will help them when they complete their transition back to normal society

Here's a picture of one of these prison "Viviendas" that the convicted murderers and rapists get to live in while they're being "rehabilitated" for their eventual Life outside of prison. You can't even get a loan here to buy a house yet these killers get nice knew homes to live in while serving time behind bars. Of course they have to be "evaluted by professional groups of physchiatrists" (laughable) before they can take advantage of living in one of these before their release:

I read this today in the news:

http://www.0223.com....as-transitorias

They recently aprehended the guy that was involved in the shooting at the hospital. He was responsible for a murder during a violent robbery in 2002 but it get's even better...

He was arrested; at the Batan Penitentary outside of Mar del Plata! The guy was already serving time in jail! it's literally unbelievable, although I've heard of this happening before. They've been keeping this new social program underwraps but it's beginning to get out and see the light of day.

This guy, inisde the prison system and was part of our wonderful new gov't program "Casas por Carceles" living in one of the swanky little chalets that the judicial system provided. So, how did het get out.....?

Well they have a "Temporary release benefit" where certain inmates that they deem well into the rehabilitation process and having exhibitied a record of good behavior on "Thursdays" or "open release day" are allowed to "leave the prison complex" ...yes... as in leave between the hours of 7am to 7pm....a full day, were talking about a convicted killer people! This guy killed an innocent person during a violent robbery in 2002. So when this guy left for the day, he attempted to rob a hospital and that's when all this happened, shootout, stole a remis etc...

I asked my friend who's a lawyer if this is actually true and he said "yes" not only that, he knows the lawyer that represented this guy in 2002 and all he would tell me is that the guy is a known member of a drug cartel in Buenos Aires.. and also that this program is growing... he just laughed about it and said "Eso es Argentina, nunca te deja de soprender" "This is Argentina, it never ceases to surprise you" LOL

It's unbelievable, incredibly irresponsible and is a perfect example of why crime is so bad in the first place and just not going to improve...it's going to get worse, steadily as it has been. What do criminals have to lose by operating within Arg? Why very little of course as this is a prime example. With a corrupt and lax judicial, a bunch of social and political hacks that think the worst of the worst of society can be normalized and rehabilitated. Then as soon as they get out they are back to robbing and murdering innocent people as always. If that isn't bad enough, allow these people to actually leave on good behavior, murderers, killers, violent people?

This is a perfect example of the abject failure and incompetence of this countries judicial and penal system, which is clearly corrupt, broken and increasingly putting the population at greater risk, through soft to literaly no sentencing of hardened criminals, rediculous social rehabilitative programs and early releases. This does not bode well for dealing with the skyrocketing crime in Argentina..

Given the shortcomings of punitive justice, Norway has been a pioneer in trying something different: http://www.nytimes.com/2015/03/29/magazine/the-radical-humaneness-of-norways-halden-prison.html?_r=0

I'm not sure I agree completely with the approach, but it's undoubtedly a constructive attempt.

 

[EricBluegrassFiddle]

Well, it's starting to get alot of attention, especially the amount of money that's been dumped in to this dangerous project....so we'll see what happens about it. Apparently this isn't the first time that a similar incident hasn't happened. I think it's a good idea that folks be aware of things like this. I can't vote and apparently this plan is going to be on the ballot here in this province in October but it's obviously not working

I think it's naive to presume that just any hardened criminal can be rehabilitated and this incident is just proof. It's obvious that many are going to take advantage of programs like this for their own good just like what happened in this situation. And this guy had been receiving all kinds of treatement and professional help since 2002. Of course, the family of the innocent victim that the guy murdered what recourse do they have in this? Imagine that this guy killed your 18 year old daughter and you find out about some program like this to rehabilitate a criminal and murderer like this?

Some folks need to be incarcerated for life, there's a reason for it.....to avoid situations exactly like what happened at this hospital. They're gambling with peoples lives, this could have turned out to be a very serious situation with alot of innocent people seriously injured or killed.

 

[sergio]

This outrageous program is an extension of a Peronist mentality regarding crime and punishment. Punishment is basically considered "repression". Even the Vatican's resident Peronista has weighed in on life sentences. They are "hidden death sentences" according to the Pontiff : http://www.theguardian.com/world/2014/oct/23/pope-francis-life-sentence-hidden-death-penalty-torture
With this mentality pervasive among Argentine leaders and "intellectuals" it should be no surprise that crime is out of control.

 

[scotttswan]

All prison systems should have some sort of rehabilitation system.

 

[sergio]

All prison systems should have some sort of rehabilitation system.

Yes however prisoners who have committed grave crimes should not be given housing that is superior to what most citizens can afford,

 

[nlaruccia]

You can't rehabilitate a rapist or a pedophile: they're mentally ill and need to be kept locked up and away from society. Personally I think they should be castrated. No child recovers fully from an experience with a pedophile.

 

[Bajo_cero2]

Well, this has nothing to do with corruption, instead, a different approach to the criminal system. While in the US they just think about to punish and that`s why the people attached to the criminal system is over 7.000.000, here the criminal system doesn`t look for punishment, insted, to educate that person and give them the tools to become good citizens.
Otherwise, jail becomes a phd for criminals.

Pedophiles and rapist are not the best example.

As far as I understand, the 24640 law allows this after they were 50% of their time in jail in order to prepare them to go out and do not come back again.

 

[ajoknoblauch]

Well, this has nothing to do with corruption, instead, a different approach to the criminal system. While in the US they just think about to punish and that`s why the people attached to the criminal system is over 7.000.000, here the criminal system doesn`t look for punishment, insted, to educate that person and give them the tools to become good citizens.
Otherwise, jail becomes a phd for criminals.

Pedophiles and rapist are not the best example.

As far as I understand, the 24640 law allows this after they were 50% of their time in jail in order to prepare them to go out and do not come back again.

So, then, Cristina and Boudou - like Videla and others before them - will enjoy house arrest instead of hard time?

 

[nlaruccia]

Well, this has nothing to do with corruption, instead, a different approach to the criminal system. While in the US they just think about to punish and that`s why the people attached to the criminal system is over 7.000.000, here the criminal system doesn`t look for punishment, insted, to educate that person and give them the tools to become good citizens.
Otherwise, jail becomes a phd for criminals.

Pedophiles and rapist are not the best example.

As far as I understand, the 24640 law allows this after they were 50% of their time in jail in order to prepare them to go out and do not come back again.

If the "educating criminals method" is working, why are there so many repeat offenders? I understand about mixing small time criminals with hard criminals but they should be separated rather than allowing them to get out of the consequences of their illegal actions.