Cashmere sweaters

[Lulu-Kyoko]

The clothes here are not of the best quality and seem to be over-priced... and so, I'm curious about the cashmere sweaters. Are these really cashmere? If so, why are they so cheap (i.e., $200-250 pesos on Florida)? Are they worth buying, or will they fall apart and unravel after 1-2 wearings?

 

[glasgowjohn]

the cashmere is good quality but nothing like Scottish cashmere . Apparently its a different breed of animal.

 

[sleslie23]

Speaking of sweaters does anyone know a good place to buy normal wool or cotton sweaters?

 

[steveinbsas]

A few posters have recommended Zara.

Everything I bought at Zara has either shrunk beyond wearable or come apart at the seams.

Everything I bought at Goodwill, the Salvation Army, or any other thrift shop during my last visit to in San Francisco in 2008 has withstood multiple washings.

In the thrift shops of San Francisco I bought an alpaca sweater from Peru and a cashmere Zegna sport coat from Switzerland (both in nearly new condition) for less than ten dollars each. I also bought lots of high end shirts, sweaters (Merino), and jeans in the same price range.

If you can, avoid buying clothes in Argentina.

 

[Lulu-Kyoko]

The clothes at Zara are generally not the greatest in terms of quality, both here and at home (Canada). And I'd love to avoid buying clothes in Argentina-- I've noticed in some stores the clothes on the hangers are literally falling apart and the sweaters actually have holes in them.

That said, I'm getting kind of desperate-- I didn't pack very well. And I guess I'm actually a bit suspicious of the "cashmere" sweaters because they seem to be the same price as the various crappy acrylic sweaters I've seen, which makes no sense.

 

[Ashley]

I'd be interested to see what you find out as I find it really difficult to come across good-quality jumpers here...
The last time I went to one of those cashmere shops on Florida (several years ago), I tried on a jumper and it felt NOTHING like real cashmere and was actually a bit itchy.

 

[Sockhopper]

There are no cashmere sweaters made in Argentina. Cashmere comes from the Kashmir goat indigent to the Himalayas. Nowadays, China produces most of the world’s cashmere. Argentina produces and imports none. Cashmere is prized because it is the finest, softest and highest warmth-generating fibre coupled with being very lightweight. This is due to the structure of this animal’s hair/wool.

The sweaters labelled as cashmere in BA are most definitely not! Instead, they’re made of shoddy yarns that combine the poorly processed wool of a Patagonian goat breed with typically 1 or 2 other fibres (eg. silk waste and the cheapest imaginable but unidentified synthetics). This is confidently labelled and sold as ‘100% cashmere” by tourist trap shops around Florida Street when that sweater isn’t even “100%” of any kind of fibre!

Why Argentine fabric textile labelling standards let this be or aren’t enforced, I don’t know. In North America, a few foreign-manufactured clothes that arrive here are misidentified as to their composition. But most of those exporters are careful to abide by our labelling standards because when their shipment is stopped and not admitted, they lose money and know that everything they ship in the future will be investigated. Our Customs’ authorities do this because duties are tax revenue. Argentine consumer goods made only for the domestic market don’t face this hurdle. This may suggest that if a country doesn’t trade and tries to get by on its own resources as Argentina mostly does, it’s easier to get away with falsely labelling goods.

I've found those fake cashmere sweaters scratchy with short coarse hairs that poked into my skin all over or fell off when I moved while I tried some on. That yarn lacks resilience so that these sweaters look lifeless, are limp and sag before they’ve even been worn once. (I know fibres and textiles. I used to be a textile artist-craftsman in England, instructing, exhibiting work, spinning, weaving and knitting textiles from raw sheep’s wool of many breeds, cashmere, camelhair and linen. I then dyed these with natural dyes, and wove or knitted them into textiles for clothing, upholstery, blankets, and large carpets. Or designed and made clothing from them. So I can’t help examining every textile I see in every shop in detail everywhere I travel and have shopped since that period of my life!)

Without having seen or touched a Patagonian goat or having been in an Argentine textile mill, I think that the technical characteristics of the Patagonian goats’ wool being sold in BA as ‘cashmere’ make it unsuitable for passable knitwear as well as not being cashmere. Its quality would be unacceptable as natural fibre clothing even in bargain-basement stores in the West. If someone just wanted a souvenir, sure. But I’d not tell anybody that one of these sweaters was cashmere or say that I got a great bargain in a poorer country.

I suspect that this lack of suitability combined with poor methods of collecting, cleaning and preparing the raw wool; and substandard spinning and textile production machinery contribute to the stunning inferiority of this product. This is just what the finished product tells me. Just as the OP saw how unrealistic a price of 200-250 pesos ($US44-$55) would be for a cashmere sweater, it’s equally comical to expect to find cashmere there. But I did exactly that on my first trip to BA. I didn’t know then that Argentina tries as hard as it can to not import raw materials. Only seeing those sweaters led me to ask about that.

In the US, a cashmere sweater of very respectable quality retails at the lower but not junky end for $US160-$300 at full price. (Or for about 20-30% more in Europe but prices really vary due to there being several different grades and thicknesses of cashmere yarn.) Prices for good cashmere sweaters rise in the US to $500 easily, then $800, and then jump to $1200-$3300 if an item bears a famous designer’s name or is very thick.

Harvesting cashmere necessarily involves impeccably hand-combing out only the finest hair/wool from the coat of the Kashmir goat. A year’s growth of fleece from 4 Kashmir goats goes into one medium-weight sweater. Cashmere is a luxury fibre. Therefore, it’s processed by established and reputable spinning and textile mills, especially those around Lake Como in Italy. This is why you might come across in NoAm knitted garments priced at the lower end I noted that are correctly labelled as “Made in China of 100% Italian cashmere”. Italy makes the yarn and China makes the clothes. These garments ARE excellent value. North Americans were paying the same price for cashmere in 1986 at better US department stores before we rid ourselves completely of our textile manufacturing infrastructure and handed over our clothing and linen needs to Asia and Pakistan to satisfy. China produces its own cashmere and over the years, its quality has improved. There’s less of the worst quality here now than that country produced 15 years ago.


Lulu-Kyoku,
If I needed a wool sweater in a jam in BA, I would look for the smallest men’s wool pullover I could find in one of the men’s chain shops along Av. Sta Fe in preference to this fake cashmere. Argentine men’s clothes hold up so much better than what’s sold for women. I’ve searched high and low in BA for a lady’s sweater made of pure cotton or wool but haven’t found one yet!! Portenas wear synthetics because that’s what Argentina can make for them without importing raw cashmere, merino wool, cotton, silk or even passable rayon or polyester.

I would also check out sweaters designed and hand-knitted by a women’s cooperative in Villa 31 (“Mujeres Artesenas”) . Online, their knitwear looks better and more varied in design than what I’ve seen in BA shops. I expect these are all synthetic too. But this organization sounds like a very positive force. And their work studio looks as pleasant, clean and bright as small ones in the West. If anyone checks this out, please let us know what you learn:

http://www.villa31.org/english/story/


If you didn’t need a sweater right away, I’d have suggested that you ask the yarn shops along Av. Cordoba where it divides Villa Crespo from Palermo Soho if they know of a hand-knitter for hire who could make you a sweater to your own design, for example. From what I could see just looking through their windows, their yarns are probably all synthetic too. Thousands of coloured skeins stacked in an array of graduated shades to the ceiling but every skein identical in texture and thickness! But at least such a sweater would be warm and available for you if you’re still in BA next winter. Perhaps you could have someone from Montreal send you knitting patterns cut from knitting magazines and the pattern books put out annually by Icelandic, French and English companies who sell knitting yarns to hand-knitters? There used to be several posh knitting shops in Montreal that had these but perhaps they’re gone now?

If it’s any consolation, fabrics in clothing sold in North America have markedly deteriorated in quality especially this year. Raw cotton quadrupled in price 3 summers ago when China surprised the West by buying up most of the world’s supply of it when our manufacturers weren’t looking or anticipating this. The new and ‘substituted’ fibres now being used alone or as filler mixed with cotton items look utterly cheap on. A lot of women are returning clothes to shops because the mid-priced brands they loved ($US150-500 items) are now doing this. There’s a huge difference in the quality of what these brands made just 3 years ago. And the rumour is that the price of wool worldwide is about to soar.

 

[Lulu-Kyoko]

Well Sockhopper, this is really the most fantastic answer! Totally unexpected and very much appreciated. I will ask my friends about the shops in Montreal, there are still a few old-school shops left in Chabanal, the garment district. Until then, I will take a look at Santa Fe.

And Ashley, I ended up buying two sweaters on Florida-- and you are right, they are itchy. So I ended up buying some shirts to wear under them. Oh well, they were cheap and at least came in pretty colours. I'll let you know how they look in a week or two!

 

[sergio]

Brilliant answer, Sockhopper. In many years in BA I never took seriously the term "cashmere" in Argentina. You are quite right about the shoddy quality of clothes manufactured in Argentina. It is also true that men's clothes are far better than women's. CLothes that I have bought at James Smart have held up pretty well.

 

[Lulu-Kyoko]

Speaking of sweaters does anyone know a good place to buy normal wool or cotton sweaters?

No! I looked high and low for non-acrylic sweaters-- within reason $$$-wise-- and couldn't find anything. I'm going to follow Sockhopper's suggestion though and look at the men's sweaters. I'll let you know if I find anything.