From Tourist to Future Resident

trapiche

Registered
Hello everyone,
My wife and I recently visited BsAs for the first time and we must say that a permanent return is being planned. At this time we reside in Orlando, Florida but find that the US is changing for the worst and action must be taken before it is too late. We are both retired, hispanics (Puerto Rico) have lived in Venezuela, Brazil and Spain and visited many latin american countries. We noted that the country is different and more advanced than its neighbors. Hope to continue reading your informative threads and disagreements, everything is helpful in the long run.
 

gouchobob

Registered
trapiche said:
Hello everyone,
My wife and I recently visited BsAs for the first time and we must say that a permanent return is being planned. At this time we reside in Orlando, Florida but find that the US is changing for the worst and action must be taken before it is too late. We are both retired, hispanics (Puerto Rico) have lived in Venezuela, Brazil and Spain and visited many latin american countries. We noted that the country is different and more advanced than its neighbors. Hope to continue reading your informative threads and disagreements, everything is helpful in the long run.
Well if you think there are problems in the states wait until you get to Argentina. Visiting as a tourist and living someplace full-time are two completely different things entirely. I think if you make the move you will find you have only exchanged one set of problems for another. I would approach this very carefully.

Most of the people posting to this site are young people with a young persons perspective. Their advice might be valid for them but probably not for an older retired person. A couple of important points you should consider are:

1. If you're retired I assume you are living on a combination of pensions, savings, etc. and Cost of living is a consideration. I would guess there would not be any advantage to you from a COL standpoint in coming to Argentina. You might find it actually more expensive than Orlando.

2. I assume you have Medicare for your health-care needs. If you are over 65 you may have difficulty in getting health insurance here. I have heard that the various health plans in Argentina will continue to insure someone who was a member before age 65, but if you try to join after age 65 they won't accept you. If they do accept you it will be substantially more money than what Medicare costs in the states.

Frankly if I were looking to retire in South America I would pick Uruguay or Chile. Both are a lot more stable than Argentina. I am sure the night-life and action is better in B.A. but generally that's not what somebody of retirement age is looking for.
 

HenryNisental

Registered
It is true his viewpoint.
But the cost of living is substantially lower than Chile or Brazil.
And if you are in good health ,medical insurance is not a must, since you can get a visit to a doctor for 10U$S or so.
I would recommend buying or renting an apt in Caballito, since you speak Spanish. It is a nice area.
And if you need serious medical care you can travel back to the Us for a while.
And as in any large city you must keep a low profile, and that´s that( do not be ostentatious with jewelry, etc)
Belgrano is a nice area too, with many Americans living there.
Another option would be buying a farmhouse nearby, it may be a lot of fun
raising animals, cattle,etc.
The Tigre (or Delta del Parana) may be your choice if you like water, boats, etc.
As you can see you have many choices.
Good luck Henry
 

gouchobob

Registered
HenryNisental said:
It is true his viewpoint.
But the cost of living is substantially lower than Chile or Brazil.
And if you are in good health ,medical insurance is not a must, since you can get a visit to a doctor for 10U$S or so.
I would recommend buying or renting an apt in Caballito, since you speak Spanish. It is a nice area.
And if you need serious medical care you can travel back to the Us for a while.
And as in any large city you must keep a low profile, and that´s that( do not be ostentatious with jewelry, etc)
Belgrano is a nice area too, with many Americans living there.
Another option would be buying a farmhouse nearby, it may be a lot of fun
raising animals, cattle,etc.
The Tigre (or Delta del Parana) may be your choice if you like water, boats, etc.
As you can see you have many choices.
Good luck Henry
You are right Brazil is more expensive(strong currency), but according to the annual Mercer survey B.A. ranks 112th versus Santiago at 128th. In Argentina inflation continues to be very high. It used to be very inexpensive a few years ago and today it's probably more expensive than the average U.S. city. If this continues who knows, look at Caracas 15th, not good for someone in retirement living off pensions and savings. It's true you could return to the states for medical treatment assuming you are in good enough shape to travel. What if you are injured in accident and can't travel, without insurance a long stay in a hospital could be very hard on your pocketbook even in Argentina.
 

sergio

Registered
Trapiche, Specifically WHAT is it in your opinion that is getting worse in the US? From your perspective (that of a retired person), I should think that Florida is the best place in the world to live. Everything is set up for the convenience of senior citizens - from the huge retirement community infrastructure, to medical services, handicapped facilities, discounts etc.

If you are 65+ you have Medicare which gives you the kind of comprehensive quality medical care that all Americans should have. In Argentina you would absolutely have to have a medical plan. Hospitalization is a lot cheaper here but care at a good hospital, comparable to a good hospital in the US, could be quite expensive as someone pointed out. Medication is, at best, reduced 40% with a medical plans. After 65 medical plans jump around 50%. That means several hundred dollars a month for a good plan - per person.

In Argentina you will not get benefits like free public transportation and as foreigners you will very likely be excluded from the few senior citizen perks that exist here.

If you live in the expat protection zone of Recoleta-Barrio Norte-Palermo and a couple of other areas you will not see the worst of poverty here however you will still be affected. I don't have a single single Porteño friend who has not been a victim of some sort of crime. I doubt it's that bad in Orlando.

As someone else pointed out, COL is not so low here - though better than Chile, Brazil and probably Uruguay. Inflation is high (25-30% this year) and the political situation always uncertain.

Please tell me what is getting so bad in the US that you think you will be better off here.
 

gouchobob

Registered
sergio said:
Trapiche, Specifically WHAT is it in your opinion that is getting worse in the US? From your perspective (that of a retired person), I should think that Florida is the best place in the world to live. Everything is set up for the convenience of senior citizens - from the huge retirement community infrastructure, to medical services, handicapped facilities, discounts etc.

If you are 65+ you have Medicare which gives you the kind of comprehensive quality medical care that all Americans should have. In Argentina you would absolutely have to have a medical plan. Hospitalization is a lot cheaper here but care at a good hospital, comparable to a good hospital in the US, could be quite expensive as someone pointed out. Medication is, at best, reduced 40% with a medical plans. After 65 medical plans jump around 50%. That means several hundred dollars a month for a good plan - per person.

In Argentina you will not get benefits like free public transportation and as foreigners you will very likely be excluded from the few senior citizen perks that exist here.

If you live in the expat protection zone of Recoleta-Barrio Norte-Palermo and a couple of other areas you will not see the worst of poverty here however you will still be affected. I don't have a single single Porteño friend who has not been a victim of some sort of crime. I doubt it's that bad in Orlando.

As someone else pointed out, COL is not so low here - though better than Chile, Brazil and probably Uruguay. Inflation is high (25-30% this year) and the political situation always uncertain.

Please tell me what is getting so bad in the US that you think you will be better off here.
Sergio I agree with almost all of your comments. However, you can be forgiven on your COL comparisons. It's hard to keep up to date on COL differences when inflation here is 20-30%. Argentina may have been cheaper a year or two ago but with the inflation it's more expensive than Uruguay and Chile today. Look at the current COL comparisons in my post above. You asked the questions I didn't on what they would expect to find better than the U.S. in their situation. I look forward to their answer.
 

sergio

Registered
Gaucho,

You may be right that Chile and Uruguay are now cheaper than Argentina. I haven’t been there for awhile but Argentines recently back from Brazil say that Brazil is expensive for Argentines.

As for what is getting worse in the US that affects senior citizens, the main thing is surely the economy. Today’s Washington Post, a pro-Obama paper, reports that REAL unemployment is 17.5% http://voices.washingtonpost.com/economy-watch/2009/11/truer_us_unemployment_rate_hit.html?hpid=topnews

This is what should worry the people in Orlando who want to transplant themselves to Argentina. Their retirement will be entirely dependent on the economy of the US. If their investments lose their value, if Social Security does not keep up with inflation (there are no increases for this year or next on the grounds that there isn’t sufficient inflation – a lie), if the dollar loses ground against the peso, these people will not be able to have the comfortable life they are expecting in Argentina.
 

gouchobob

Registered
sergio said:
Gaucho,

You may be right that Chile and Uruguay are now cheaper than Argentina. I haven’t been there for awhile but Argentines recently back from Brazil say that Brazil is expensive for Argentines.

As for what is getting worse in the US that affects senior citizens, the main thing is surely the economy. Today’s Washington Post, a pro-Obama paper, reports that REAL unemployment is 17.5% http://voices.washingtonpost.com/economy-watch/2009/11/truer_us_unemployment_rate_hit.html?hpid=topnews

This is what should worry the people in Orlando who want to transplant themselves to Argentina. Their retirement will be entirely dependent on the economy of the US. If their investments lose their value, if Social Security does not keep up with inflation (there are no increases for this year or next on the grounds that there isn’t sufficient inflation – a lie), if the dollar loses ground against the peso, these people will not be able to have the comfortable life they are expecting in Argentina.
I agree once again, however Argentina is only one of about 10 countries in the world that the dollar has gained against the local currency in the last year, should tell everyone something about the strength of the local economy.
 

ElQueso

Registered
News at the beginning of the year was that the government was going to allow the peso to glide down over the year to 4-1 peso to dollar. I've seen nothing to the contrary and although it's been hovering between 3.8 and 3.85 for awhile, I expect it to continue to fall a bit.

Some of my friends, who are heavy into stock and securities trading in the States, but have traded some currency too, think it will fall farther than 4-1 after the end of the year. The government's supply of dollars to buy pesos and keep the peso artificially high are running out.

Depends on how commodities and the Argentine and US economies end up doing, of course.
 
Top