Is President Kirchner Improving The Lives Of Argentinos?

Is President Cristina Kirchner Improving the Lives of Argentinos?

  • Yes

    Votes: 11 13.9%
  • No

    Votes: 68 86.1%

  • Total voters
    79

Joe

Registered
Is the Argentine President, Cristina F. Kirchner improving the lives of the majority of Argentina's citizens and making their future prospects better?

Yes or No.

Please note the word "citizens". We are not talking about for example "perma-tourists" or expats.
 

Matiasba

Registered
To me, yes.

And I dont like her that much, but there are achievements we cant deny.
10 years of growth. With social inclusion, with social plans to fight against poverty. We had more than the half of the country under the poverty line. Thats a lot, and totally unexpected years ago. We totally recovered of the worst crisis this country has ever experienced. And you can feel these Im talking, in the street.... there are way more less people begging than in 2003, 2004...

More than 6% of GDP destinated for education. Im 34 years old and this government is BY FAR the government that more have invested in education. And Im talking in all levels. Primary, Secondary and university. A guy who does scientific research now can actually live with his salary, and dont have to drive a cab or something to survive. Totally new. They repatriated lots of scientifics from around the globe, they were working in industry in developed countries, and they made a plan so they can stay here. Thats much more important than its sounds. Because that means that there is a plan. Every graduated costs to the UBA 40 thousand dollars each. Is an investiment that the country never sees again, since the great majority go and study and work abroad and never return that academic training to the country. They never come back and that cost a loss to the country. Now, with this government, this is changing. And Im not talking about propaganda but of real cases I do know.

Lots of heavy industries reopened with the Ks. For instance, Fabrica Militar de Aviones, which was a model along the XXth century and closed by Menem. The car industry grew a lot. Every year we beat the record of exporting cars. Just picture that we had 25% of unemployment, and think how all these quality jobs came to help the situation.

I can go on and on, explaining the achievements of this government, that REALLY are big and more than this sample I wrote, and I know this forum is entirely anti K. Im not a K, I have a lot of issues I hate of this government, I dont even like her, I found her demagogic and egocentric, but you guys should know where we come from, you should know other governments, and interact not only with the upper classes, or upper middle classes. She got the 54%! who voted her? the working class! those who dont have any problem with the restrictions, those who dont have any problem with dollars, those who couldnt afford a meal and now they have a job and can go to Mar del Plata in summer.

Lots of people went from the poverty to the middle class. Is not me who says it. It is the World Bank (surely not K) and the IMF and the HDI from UN. Thats a fact, and they are the more serious people that measure these kind of things.

Corruption? Yes, sure theres a lot of corruption but is something inherent of this country, not just of this government. I mean, there are a lot of Intendentes, gobernadores, concejales, and a large etcetera, that are plain thieves, but would that change with a new government? surely not. It was like that, it is like that and it will be like that. We have to learn how to deal with it, to get used to. So you cant tell corruption is something distinctive of this government. In fact, with Menem, corruption was something much bigger, cases such as IBM-Banco Nacion, the Diputrucho, every single privatization, which were sell very cheap and fast so they could pick a part.... THAT was corruption. They sold the assets this country had, and they took it to the worst crisis ever. This government is recovering that losses.
 

PhilipDT

Registered
No. The flowers for Algernon story of the new middle class is already heading towards its fin. Good middle class jobs are disappearing as foreign investment heads to zero while those that have the jobs that stay are finding themselves squeezed to the breaking point without union representation to counter the 30% inflation. It seems tragic, but I guess free soccer on TV has to count for something.
 

JamJam

Registered
Not sure if she improved the lives of those involved in the Once train crash. Then trains here are very 3rd world.
But hey you have football for all!
 

citygirl

Registered
I'm not a citizen so I don't know that my opinion counts.

All of it being said, do I think there was improvement in the short-term? Sure, but when you're starting from the lowest point, that's not all that hard. I applaud many of the social programs that were instituted under the K's regime. But in the long-run, no I think they have squandered a great opportunity to put this country where it belongs economically speaking and that the piper will have to be paid eventually - where are the funds going to come from to continue to fund many of these social programs?

Where art thou, middle class? Because at least amongst many of my friends, their lives are getting progressively more difficult, not better. I look at good friends of mine. Married with kids, both parents have two good careers and they are worse off now than they were 5 years ago thanks to inflation and the rising costs across the board. For the first time this year, they couldn't afford to go on vacation. Can't afford to buy a new (or used) car. Can't afford to move out of their tiny 2 br apt. And he's at a high level in the post office and she is a graphic designer. But between the increase in apt expenses, food, school, etc - they are running to stay in place, despite annual raises and the rest.
 

trennod

Veteran
I dont care much for what plans she and Nestor have had in place, as I am looking for outcomes but as well, its difficult to measure given any statistics that come from the government clearly cant be trusted.

With regards to her and Nestor improving the poverty in the country (ie not talking about the policies stunting growth, against individual freedoms/liberties etc), crime is increasing and getting significantly worse and the villas in all parts of the country are growing. You can see it here with how Villa 31 has grown over the last 5 years, in Tucuman in my girlfriends city (which is outside of San Miguel) there was barely ever a villa but in the last 3-4 years it has really come on. Those in San MIguel de Tucuman have grown in size as well. I just buy it that she is improving things for the poor here...
 

PhilipDT

Registered
I look at good friends of mine. Married with kids, both parents have two good careers and they are worse off now than they were 5 years ago thanks to inflation and the rising costs across the board. For the first time this year, they couldn't afford to go on vacation. Can't afford to buy a new (or used) car. Can't afford to move out of their tiny 2 br apt. And he's at a high level in the post office and she is a graphic designer. But between the increase in apt expenses, food, school, etc - they are running to stay in place, despite annual raises and the rest.

Its like a treadmill with a constantly increasing speed. At first you get on, start jogging and actually move up the treadmill, all while managing to stay at comfortable pace. Then, as it speeds up, you keep having to push harder and harder to inch forward until there is just no way to keep going forward, you're doing everything you can possibly not to slip back. Eventually you can't stop from slowly slipping back, and you're stuck, sprinting to try and stay as far forward as you can until you collapse and fall off in a heap of bankruptcy.

My girlfriend feels this way, as do many of my friends. The new Argentine middle class, drawn from poverty, given a cruel glimpse of something better, then smaked down again by the reality of a grossly mismanaged economy.
 

Gringoboy

Registered
The aim is to maintain or very slightly improve the lives of the 'proles', keep them where they are, induce more into their number and thus create an underclass that can be bent and shaped at will.
This is the medium to long term goal and the middle class is merely an irritating obstacle that has no place in the grand plan.
 
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