Barack Obama accused of making 'Depression' mistakes

I find this thread most interesting. I have researched the Great Depression and published on it. Roosevelt's New Deal policies did not help the economy, but they made people happy because he was TRYING. The Depression was actually two recessions: one after the crash, and another in 1936. In 1934 the economy was on a rebound, but he ignored it and did not return to free market capitalism. His main error was plunging the economy into another deep recession in 1936, because he did NOT stop spending. He proved without a doubt that Keynesian economics does not work.

Europe is now coming to the same conclusion. Germany and France are sick and tired of spending, and are moving towards capitalism. Labour in Britain is on the way out. Spain is also tired of socialism and big spending.

Obama is a Keynesian. He believes that America can spend its way out of recession. He is egged on by Paul Krugman, who frankly, has lost his marbles. The debt that Obama is costing America can NEVER be repaid. NEVER. We will see what actually happens, but history tells us that Obama will cause the dollar to be devalued, and the next generation of workers will be working to pay taxes.

Just my take, for what it is worth.
 
All the worlds ills blamed on Obama and socialism and not a mention of Bush under whos Neo con reign this crises all began.
The policies that caused this mess were anything but socialist
 
windy said:
All the worlds ills blamed on Obama and socialism and not a mention of Bush under whos Neo con reign this crises all began.
The policies that caused this mess were anything but socialist
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again, it's not about bush. it's not about obama. it's about the team that both bush and obama work for i.e. the bankers, wall street, mega corporations, council on foreign relations, trilateral commission...etc.

this crisis did NOT begin with bush. our country's government has been hijacked since the assassination of JFK.

it's not about socialism. this is about fascism and the merger of big business and government.

take a look at this great article by larry flynt called Common Sense 2009. if you're not from the US you might not know that larry flynt is the publisher of Hustler magazine and one of the biggest democrats and proponents of free speech there is. he took a bullet for free speech. now he is openly saying that our government has been hijacked and it has nothing to do with the false left vs right paradigm.

"Both Democrats and Republicans dance to the tune of their corporate masters. In America, corporations do not control the government. In America, corporations are the government."
 
redrum said:
http://www.telegraph.co.uk/finance/economics/6147211/Barack-Obama-accused-of-making-Depression-mistakes.html


Barack Obama is committing the same mistakes made by policymakers during the Great Depression, according to a new study endorsed by Nobel laureate James Buchanan.

By Edmund Conway
Published: 9:55PM BST 06 Sep 2009

History repeating itself? President Obama has been accused by some economists of making the same mistakes policymakers in the US made in the Great Depression, which followed the Wall Street crash of 1929, pictured Photo: AP

His policies even have the potential to consign the US to a similar fate as Argentina, which suffered a painful and humiliating slide from first to Third World status last century, the paper says.

There are "troubling similarities" between the US President's actions since taking office and those which in the 1930s sent the US and much of the world spiralling into the worst economic collapse in recorded history, says the new pamphlet, published by the Institute of Economic Affairs.

In particular, the authors, economists Charles Rowley of George Mason University and Nathanael Smith of the Locke Institute, claim that the White House's plans to pour hundreds of billions of dollars of cash into the economy will undermine it in the long run. They say that by employing deficit spending and increased state intervention President Obama will ultimately hamper the long-term growth potential of the US economy and may risk delaying full economic recovery by several years.

The study represents a challenge to the widely held view that Keynesian fiscal policies helped the US recover from the Depression which started in the early 1930s. The authors say: "[Franklin D Roosevelt's] interventionist policies and draconian tax increases delayed full economic recovery by several years by exacerbating a climate of pessimistic expectations that drove down private capital formation and household consumption to unprecedented lows."

Although the authors support the Federal Reserve's moves to slash interest rates to just above zero and embark on quantitative easing, pumping cash directly into the system, they warn that greater intervention could set the US back further. Rowley says: "It is also not impossible that the US will experience the kind of economic collapse from first to Third World status experienced by Argentina under the national-socialist governance of Juan Peron."

The paper, which recommends that the US return to a more laissez-faire economic system rather than intervening further in activity, has been endorsed by Nobel laureate James Buchanan, who said: "We have learned some things from comparable experiences of the 1930s' Great Depression, perhaps enough to reduce the severity of the current contraction. But we have made no progress toward putting limits on political leaders, who act out their natural proclivities without any basic understanding of what makes capitalism work."
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what are listening to some brits for?
 
Conservatives slain Socialists storm to 160 seat majority in Greek elections. This somewhat punches a hole in the viewpoint of Ibaron.
I don't however think this result means people are moving towards socialism and away from capitalism. I just think whoever is in power of whatever party is being blamed by the voters for the economic crises.
SO far i agree Obama has not delivered as i had hoped ,maybe he is trying to steady the ship before he stamps his mark on things. But he is surrounded by a useless bunch of parasites (and thts just his own party) so i am not overly optimistic.
 
Well, no one mentioning WHAT really brought up the Depression. We all talking about "who" and "how" acts was taking places to steer along. I'd totally agree with redrum that super powered "team" is boiling the whole planet and you may see their "precious" work in any given country. Whoever is interesting - dig up the History of First Central Bank of England. This is exactly what happened when power of uncontrollable currency emission was introduce to modern world. And it goes EXACTLY the same way today. The only thing took change sinse then is instead of many printing machines in different hands were printed paper bills back then, the only One is doing it by FRS.
 
The Demise of the Dollar

In a graphic illustration of the new world order, Arab states have launched secret moves with China, Russia and France to stop using the US currency for oil trading

By Robert Fisk

October 06, 2009 "The Independent" -- -- In the most profound financial change in recent Middle East history, Gulf Arabs are planning – along with China, Russia, Japan and France – to end dollar dealings for oil, moving instead to a basket of currencies including the Japanese yen and Chinese yuan, the euro, gold and a new, unified currency planned for nations in the Gulf Co-operation Council, including Saudi Arabia, Abu Dhabi, Kuwait and Qatar.

Secret meetings have already been held by finance ministers and central bank governors in Russia, China, Japan and Brazil to work on the scheme, which will mean that oil will no longer be priced in dollars.

The plans, confirmed to The Independent by both Gulf Arab and Chinese banking sources in Hong Kong, may help to explain the sudden rise in gold prices, but it also augurs an extraordinary transition from dollar markets within nine years.

The Americans, who are aware the meetings have taken place – although they have not discovered the details – are sure to fight this international cabal which will include hitherto loyal allies Japan and the Gulf Arabs. Against the background to these currency meetings, Sun Bigan, China's former special envoy to the Middle East, has warned there is a risk of deepening divisions between China and the US over influence and oil in the Middle East. "Bilateral quarrels and clashes are unavoidable," he told the Asia and Africa Review. "We cannot lower vigilance against hostility in the Middle East over energy interests and security."

This sounds like a dangerous prediction of a future economic war between the US and China over Middle East oil – yet again turning the region's conflicts into a battle for great power supremacy. China uses more oil incrementally than the US because its growth is less energy efficient. The transitional currency in the move away from dollars, according to Chinese banking sources, may well be gold. An indication of the huge amounts involved can be gained from the wealth of Abu Dhabi, Saudi Arabia, Kuwait and Qatar who together hold an estimated $2.1 trillion in dollar reserves.

The decline of American economic power linked to the current global recession was implicitly acknowledged by the World Bank president Robert Zoellick. "One of the legacies of this crisis may be a recognition of changed economic power relations," he said in Istanbul ahead of meetings this week of the IMF and World Bank. But it is China's extraordinary new financial power – along with past anger among oil-producing and oil-consuming nations at America's power to interfere in the international financial system – which has prompted the latest discussions involving the Gulf states.

Brazil has shown interest in collaborating in non-dollar oil payments, along with India. Indeed, China appears to be the most enthusiastic of all the financial powers involved, not least because of its enormous trade with the Middle East.

China imports 60 per cent of its oil, much of it from the Middle East and Russia. The Chinese have oil production concessions in Iraq – blocked by the US until this year – and since 2008 have held an $8bn agreement with Iran to develop refining capacity and gas resources. China has oil deals in Sudan (where it has substituted for US interests) and has been negotiating for oil concessions with Libya, where all such contracts are joint ventures.

Furthermore, Chinese exports to the region now account for no fewer than 10 per cent of the imports of every country in the Middle East, including a huge range of products from cars to weapon systems, food, clothes, even dolls. In a clear sign of China's growing financial muscle, the president of the European Central Bank, Jean-Claude Trichet, yesterday pleaded with Beijing to let the yuan appreciate against a sliding dollar and, by extension, loosen China's reliance on US monetary policy, to help rebalance the world economy and ease upward pressure on the euro.

Ever since the Bretton Woods agreements – the accords after the Second World War which bequeathed the architecture for the modern international financial system – America's trading partners have been left to cope with the impact of Washington's control and, in more recent years, the hegemony of the dollar as the dominant global reserve currency.

The Chinese believe, for example, that the Americans persuaded Britain to stay out of the euro in order to prevent an earlier move away from the dollar. But Chinese banking sources say their discussions have gone too far to be blocked now. "The Russians will eventually bring in the rouble to the basket of currencies," a prominent Hong Kong broker told The Independent. "The Brits are stuck in the middle and will come into the euro. They have no choice because they won't be able to use the US dollar."

Chinese financial sources believe President Barack Obama is too busy fixing the US economy to concentrate on the extraordinary implications of the transition from the dollar in nine years' time. The current deadline for the currency transition is 2018.

The US discussed the trend briefly at the G20 summit in Pittsburgh; the Chinese Central Bank governor and other officials have been worrying aloud about the dollar for years. Their problem is that much of their national wealth is tied up in dollar assets.

"These plans will change the face of international financial transactions," one Chinese banker said. "America and Britain must be very worried. You will know how worried by the thunder of denials this news will generate."

Iran announced late last month that its foreign currency reserves would henceforth be held in euros rather than dollars. Bankers remember, of course, what happened to the last Middle East oil producer to sell its oil in euros rather than dollars. A few months after Saddam Hussein trumpeted his decision, the Americans and British invaded Iraq.
 
Great article! Thank you.
"Iran announced late last month that its foreign currency reserves would henceforth be held in euros rather than dollars. Bankers remember, of course, what happened to the last Middle East oil producer to sell its oil in euros rather than dollars. A few months after Saddam Hussein trumpeted his decision, the Americans and British invaded Iraq. "
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I also heard that Saddam was on "Oil for Food" program ran by UN (with some scandals of course) and Iraqie citizens were recieving about $90/month per family with food products. Which actually was not that bad at all.

Well, I just know a litle that it is not going to be that easy with Iran.

But hey, the EURO's were "introduced" by whom? To outweight/crash USD later on? I don't think so. I think this is another scheme were introduced to play ups and downs in currency trades.
Like any market this days the EURO is tailored and adjusted by these who invented the thing. Yeah, I've heard that "Europen nations decided to ...bla-bla... to improove ... bla-bla..."
Btw, does this EURO plays any different then "paperback"?
For instance, does French had initially more weight in currency's "backing" coverage then Greece? Or its an "equal shares"? Then how they could be equal? France and Greece, or whichever one from those latest ones who joined the EU? How?
Could somebody draw some picture here in plain English, pls?

 
windy said:
Conservatives slain Socialists storm to 160 seat majority in Greek elections. This somewhat punches a hole in the viewpoint of Ibaron.
I don't however think this result means people are moving towards socialism and away from capitalism. I just think whoever is in power of whatever party is being blamed by the voters for the economic crises.
SO far i agree Obama has not delivered as i had hoped ,maybe he is trying to steady the ship before he stamps his mark on things. But he is surrounded by a useless bunch of parasites (and thts just his own party) so i am not overly optimistic.
Click to expand...


windy. are you reading any of my responses to your posts?

you must stop insisting that obama is a candidate of hope and change.

the people are blaming whoever is in power because they don't understand that a broader, well organized, crime syndicate runs the show behind the scenes.

it's like a don king boxing match. he controls both fighters.

break your conditioning of the false left/right paradigm. stop wasting your time worrying about socialism vs capitalism, repub vs dem, left vs right...etc.

obama is not the savior that you and so many have been hoping for. he is an actor. he has been groomed by the elite specifically for this job. you don't get to be president of the united states unless you are already an employee of the elite. he is a confidence man. he's a slick talking salesman who travels the world selling and advancing the agenda of wall street, the mega corporations and mega rich.

i suggest you watch The Obama Deception documentary in order to have a real understanding of how our government is infested with alumni of goldman sachs, council on foreign relations and the trilateral commission.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eAaQNACwaLw
 
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