Just a reassurance for Visa Runners to Colonia

[steveinbsas]

I found these in my email this morning from [email protected]

(Of course the poster was harassed/hassled at migraciones as opposed to being HAGGLED at customs.)

"I am currently in Punta del Este and on my way here on 12/26 I was HAGGLED for about 25 minutes at the Buquebus customs. I unofficially moved here almost a year ago and about 5 months ago instead of taking a Colonia trip I went down to immigrations and paid my $300 pesos to extend my visa (again after 1 trip to Colonia and 1 trip to the US).

Anyway I received a stamp extending until 11/28 at immigrations, but took a trip to the US in early Nov. and had no problem returning on 11/15. Basically the customs guy told me I wasn't suppose to still be here and should have left by 11/28 not to return again until at least February. In my broken Spanish I told him that was not true, not the law etc. He let me leave the port finally, but now I'm super nervous that when I return next week I am going to haggled more or not let back in at all!

Any advice? Since I plan to essentially move here and continue to run my business I tried to do keep my passport "legal", but now I think that was a bad idea. Thoughts, advice, commentary...all welcome. Thanks!"

It was followed by this reply:

"My prediction is that when you return, you'll get a different person who won't borther you for anything. People occasionally report being harassed, but it is generally on a one-off basis. Things do change, so there's no guarantee, but I feel the chances are close to zero that you'll be given a hard time again, especially since you are doing everything legally, and seem to have relatively few Argentine stamps on your passport."

 

[French jurist]

Indeed, chances are he/she'll enter safely.

At worse, this person wouldn't be denied reentry but could be obligated to leave the country by a deadline (see the other thread with the law/new decreto).

Just in case, this person should have a lawyer's phone number ready to call.

Too, BC mentionned in the other thread to have the phone number of a judge (don't remember which one) ready in such circumstances.

Maybe this aduanero spent an aweful Christmas and didn't receive the present he wished, who knows.

 

[citygirl]

Somehow I'm guessing that person didn't quite understand what the official was saying. (and by the way, his extension had expired on 11/28 which was probably the issue)

When you renew at Migraciones -and this is only occurs with the renewals at Migraciones - even if you don't have the "ultima porroga" - you CAN NOT leave & get a new 90 days until the original migraciones renewal has expired.

So that poster went on 8/28 & got a stamp good until 11/28. S/he probably thought when they left on 11/15, the clock started again. However, it didn't. If that person checked their passport, they probably didn't get another stamp in since the first one from migraciones hadn't yet expired.

 

[John.St]

citygirl is absolutely right.

The date on the prórroga (extension) overrides a possible later '90 days' stamp, if you re-enter Argentina before the date of the prórroga has expired.

Tell the OP to take a closer look at the passport.
Under the 'SALIDA' stamp for the early November trip, it says (it should say) in handwriting, "hasta 28/11/2010" or something similar - have been there myself.

I recommend avoiding a prórroga unless you plan to return after the expiration date.

 

[Bajo_cero2]

"My prediction is that when you return, you'll get a different person who won't borther you for anything. People occasionally report being harassed, but it is generally on a one-off basis. Things do change, so there's no guarantee, but I feel the chances are close to zero that you'll be given a hard time again, especially since you are doing everything legally, and seem to have relatively few Argentine stamps on your passport."

I disagree partially with you.
Overstaying and being a permatourist is equally illegal since decreto 616-2010.

"ARTICULO 61.- Cuando se verifique que un extranjero hubiere desnaturalizado los motivos que autorizaron su ingreso al territorio argentino o permaneciera en éste vencido el plazo de permanencia acordado, la DIRECCION NACIONAL DE MIGRACIONES lo intimará a fin de que, en un plazo que no exceda de TREINTA (30) días, se presente a regularizar su situación migratoria debiendo acompañar los documentos necesarios para ello. A tal efecto, se lo notificará por escrito informándole, de un modo comprensible, las consecuencias que le deparará mantenerse en la situación migratoria
advertida."

But this is when you are into the country!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

At the frontier they might deny your entry:

a) Rechazo en frontera: Cuando se dispusiere el rechazo en frontera de un extranjero, la autoridad migratoria arbitrará los medios necesarios para que su reconducción fuera del territorio argentino se realice en el menor tiempo posible.


You can be rejected because:
1. You have a bad record: permatorurist: desnaturalización de la visa.
2. You were catch when you was trying to get into the country evading the control.

That why I insist so much about stop going to Uruguay.

Regarding this guy, he should have a lawyer just in case for an habeas corpus. The judge I mentioned is the one who is dealing with habeas corpus. They change all the time and I only mean you should have the phone number of whoever he is with you because habeas corpus can be request by telephone.

Even it wasn´t hardly enforced they can do it. And this is random. For me it makes no sense to jeopardy yourself this way when you can become legal: residency or citizenship, whatever. At the DGM office in Retire there is a huge sign that says, "if you are illegal, this is because you want to be", Touché!
And I say it not only as a lawyer, I was an expat in the US and Europe and because of that I realize how important is to be legal.

Regards

 

[Johnny]

I returned to BA last night through Ezeiza after two weeks in the states. I am an unabashed perma-tourist with two "Ultima porrogas" quite visible in my passport. Over Thanksgiving I was in Montevideo for two days and had zero problems with immigration upon my return. Not the same story last night however. I was given a rash of shit by one immigration officer for "not being a tourist". I was lectured in an angry manner and the officer took my passport to a "supervisor". Upon returning I received more lecturing followed by a stamp of 90 more days.

I'm not looking for advise or kicking a hornet's nest that has been kicked in this forum so many times. I'd only like to give an update for those in a similar situation. If I qualified for a long term visa I would go that route.

I will say that the "lecturing" last night was ridiculously unprofessional. It smacked more of amateur intimidation than anything else. And of course 90 more days were given ! BTW, I have had a few "run ins" over the past few years with immigration officers both at Ezeiza and at the office in Retiro. Every unpleasant amateur experience has been with a woman officer, never with a man. I'm not about to make a judgement based on such a small sample, but that has been my experience so far. I am not a misogynist, just calling 'em as I see 'em.

 

[Bajo_cero2]

Well, you were lucky.

 

[milly]

For those of you who travel back to your countries of origin from time to time, why not get a new passport while you're there? Sure, you got to pay for it, but you'd have nice clean stamp-free pages to come back with.

Bajo_cero, you recommend just staying illegal rather than doing border runs. What would happen if I got into an accident, or was robbed and had to call the police? At least if I have valid 90 day tourist stamp I don't suppose it's their authority to turn me into migraciones for being a "perma-tourist". If I didn't have a 90 day stamp and was overstaying, would they not have the right to hand me over to migraciones for being illegal?

I also have a question regarding my particular situation, if you can advise. I did border runs for a year in 2004 before taking advantage of the amnesty to get my temporary 2-year residence. Then I left and my papers expired. I don't suppose that migraciones will do anything to renew my expired papers but if it only takes 2 years to get residency or citizenship, can my old residency be taken into consideration at some time in the future to get new papers?

Thanks!

 

[Johnny]

For those of you who travel back to your countries of origin from time to time, why not get a new passport while you're there? Sure, you got to pay for it, but you'd have nice clean stamp-free pages to come back with.

I have thought about "losing" my passport and then applying for another at the embassy. Not only would I have a clean passport, but more to the point, a passport without the damaging "ultima proroga's". That designation seems to be the kiss of almost death, though I have been in and out of Argentina on multiple occasions since receiving the "last renewal". Something to obviously think about for someone in my situation, though "losing" my passport doesn't much appeal to me. I'll probably continue to roll the dice until the situation becomes untenable and then move on to a different pasture, greener or not.

 

[steveinbsas]

What would happen if I got into an accident, or was robbed and had to call the police? At least if I have valid 90 day tourist stamp I don't suppose it's their authority to turn me into migraciones for being a "perma-tourist". If I didn't have a 90 day stamp and was overstaying, would they not have the right to hand me over to migraciones for being illegal?

The police don't seem to care about this. I was in a car accident and they only looked at the photo page of my passport to see how to write my name and record the passport number. I also made a denuncia at the comisaria in Recoleta using only a photocopy of the photo page of my passport. The officer did ask the date of my entry into Argentina (I said the day and month but not the year). He didn't even ask why I only had the photocopy with me.