Americans will be forced to buy health insurance under Obama's plan?

[Cheney]

There is a small flaw in your argument here- private healthcare in the US is extraordinarily expensive. My father was self employed for most of my childhood- and 10 years ago we had to pay 2,000 per MONTH for a family of four. Your comment implies that healthcare is an option for all, and that it is a choice not to have it. It really is not in many cases, and that is the big problem that needs to be solved.

There is no small flaw in my argument as it is easy to throw numbers around. You left out the income involved and other sources of income. The fact is that medical care was provided? There is a market system in the USA and not only one insurance company to do business with. It is quite easy to cherry pick sad stories and use this as justification to change the lives of the whole nation. But the reality of the situation is that over 80 percent of the people are happy with their insurance.

 

[citygirl]

Cheney - can you give me a source for that 80% you stated? Seems very high to me.

And I don't think there is any argument that healthcare (if not paid partially/fully) by your employer is *very* expensive. I had to cobra myself years ago (single, in my early 20s, good health, etc) and I think I was paying $600+ a month. It absolutely killed me, esp b/c I wasn't working.

I don't really know anyone who likes the current system - patients, doctors, etc.

FWIW - I am absolutely amazed at how well the system works here. I have private health insurance and I LOVE being able to walk in, show them my card and I'm done. No paperwork, no bills, no headaches. Worth every penny I pay and even if we looked at a 1-1 peso/dollar exchange, substantially cheaper than what I paid for crap health insurance in the States.

 

[Cheney]

Regarding "required health insurance" : He referred to consumers who go without health insurance as practicing "irresponsible behavior" and proposed that all individuals be required to purchase some type of health insurance. Although for those who absolutely could not afford insurance, a hardship exemption would be made available.
.

With all due respect, our President talks about his plan in speeches over and over again. Lord knows how many speeches have been written about health care but there is nothing in writting. I am sort of old school and feel actions speak louder than words. He should already have a bill written at this stage of the game. He takes a lot of flack for the two bills in the congress that are not his, where he should put his convictions onto paper and let the people decide.

 

[Cheney]

Cheney - can you give me a source for that 80% you stated? Seems very high to me.
.

It is so cool that you asked for the poll. Media throws out numbers at rarely do they explain how they get them. The number a couple of years ago was 87 percent.

http://www.gallup.com/poll/122663/Private-Public-Health-Plan-Subscribers-Rate-Plans-Similarly.aspx

Would you care to share who you have your insurance with? I am with Hospital Italiano and it is comparable to what I was getting in the USA. But I agree with you in that the prices are lower.

In my opinion they can reduce the costs a lot here because the doctors do not make a lot of money. My wife makes about 6k a month. That being said there is a problem most families have to deal with in today's society as businesses are giving limited benefits by keeping workers as part time with no medical coverage.

I just don't like a big government solution to any problems. I do not think that they do a good job (i worked +25 years in the government). And after all is said and done, in a lot of cases the problem remains.

What President Obama is proposing is very similar to what has been tried in New England and the results there are showing that the costs are rising.

 

[John.St]

And if I refuse to pay or unable to pay?

"Under one proposal now being considered"

 

[Scelesta]

There is no small flaw in my argument as it is easy to throw numbers around. You left out the income involved and other sources of income. The fact is that medical care was provided? There is a market system in the USA and not only one insurance company to do business with. It is quite easy to cherry pick sad stories and use this as justification to change the lives of the whole nation. But the reality of the situation is that over 80 percent of the people are happy with their insurance.

Have you ever shopped around for insurance? I have. There is really no difference in price. There are small differences in structure, but there really is no "market" for health insurance. It is all pretty much the same. Heath insurance companies do not compete for customers- there is no insurance company offering lower rates to attract customers. It is not to their benefit. And 20 % is a lot of people without healthcare- certainly more than to warrant the term cherry picking, as the uninsured get sick as often as the insured.
I am also not sure what you mean by "not taking into account income" ? There is no pay scale for insurance plans- they do not cost less if you earn less. I did not give a concrete example as a sad story, I gave it to show how expensive healthcare is in the US. How is a family that earns 20-30 k a year supposed to afford that, or even half that, per month? My point is that people who do not have insurance, by and large do not have it because they cannot afford it. And the bill will not change the lives of a whole nation- if you like your private healthcare, you can keep it. Government run healthcare is never as good as private, but as we see here, there can be really good private healthcare in addition to public healthcare that can do good saving lives and minimizing costs and strain on emergency rooms.

 

[John.St]

There is a small flaw in your argument here- private healthcare in the US is extraordinarily expensive. My father was self employed for most of my childhood- and 10 years ago we had to pay 2,000 per MONTH for a family of four. Your comment implies that healthcare is an option for all, and that it is a choice not to have it. It really is not in many cases, and that is the big problem that needs to be solved.

A world wide, no limits, add all you can, one year travel insurance for four persons is US$ 18,383 - a year - when bought online - and a travel insurance is higher risk than when people stay at home. https://global.ihi.com/travel+insurance/buy+travel+insurance.aspx

For a Danish family of four, it is less than US$ 5,000 - a year http://www.gouda.dk/page96.aspx?owner=101&country=dk&product=vodk

How can you live with this kind of swindle?

 

[RWS]

What's the choice? Renouncing citizenship? The federal Internal Revenue Service retains the "right" to attach income and assets up to ten years after renunciation. Besides, what country (besides Argentina and a scant handful of other first-world states) would admit an American émigré to its own citizenship?

 

[steveinba]

And that is why they should have health insurance. There are a lot of people that are gambling with their future by not having this insurance. But it should not be mandated that the general public should be responsible for the irresponsible?

But it is mandated. As a somewhat civilized country we do not turn people away at emergency rooms when they are in serious trouble or dying. Most of the people without insurance will never pay the bills. They will either disappear or declare bankruptcy.

The alternative would be to let people die if they show up at the emergency room without insurance, cash, or a credit card that can take the charges.

This is why insurance needs to be mandatory.

 

[steveinba]

Also, if you think the insurance companies are the problem in America, you need to consider that total industry profits are not a lot relative to what we spend on healthcare. I couldn't find a figure online, but I assure you it is way south of $100 billion per year. Even if you took ALL of that away it wouldn't even put a dent in the problem. A big part of the problem is doctors in America have become entrepreneurs who look to order as many tests and procedures as they can because they are are getting kickbacks on everything and insurance companies have to pay or risk being sued for risking a patients health. Malpractice suits are another big problem that drives up costs. The insurance industry profits are tiny compared to what is leached out of the system by these inefficiencies.