Argentina's Prison Babies (Daily Mail)

[Farenheit]

http://www.dailymail...n-age-four.html

 

[Nounou]

Sadly the system of placing young children in jail with their mothers is quite common place in a number of countries, Australia being one. Here in WA children can be placed in prison with their mothers until age 2, after that time they are eithr placed with their family or foster care.

To my mind it demonstrates how far down the plug hole society has gone! Having spent the last 8 years working with the slightly older products of such a system, I seriously question the merits of punishing an innocent party (the child) for the mere p.c benefit of 'keeping a family together'. A far better proposition would be to further strengthen adoption laws and more importantly increase and give serious clout to legislation pertaining to the rights of the child and give these kids a real chance of life!

Whatever the mother has done should NOT impact the rights of a child...end of!

 

[EricLovesBA]

Would be interesting to have a more complete picture. In this depiction it did not seem that the quality of life was so terrible - maybe better than the lowest strata "serving time" outside the prison system, battling day to day life in utter poverty. Before I am so quick to judge this practice, I begin to ask myself a few questions...

Are they any worse off than all the kids whose mom didn't get caught?
When exactly does someone lose the right to be a parent? When they rob someone? When they fail to put a square meal on the table 3 days in a row? When they do 3 months of jail time for a felony? 6 months? A year? A parking ticket? Where do we draw the line exactly?
What is the psychological impact of separating the child from the mom, and will their new situation necessarily be any better?

 

[Vagrant Violet]

A far better proposition would be to further strengthen adoption laws and more importantly increase and give serious clout to legislation pertaining to the rights of the child and give these kids a real chance of life!

Nounou-

I cannot express how much I agree with you! I recently happened to look into the basic gist of adoption laws in this country a few weeks ago (long story), and it is so very sad, the epitome of South American bureaucracy at its absolute worst. Despite the numerous kids that I see on the street on a daily basis, according to law, they make it seem like these kids who need stable homes (which will also help prevent a very grave and damning cycle from repeating itself) are some kind of rare commodity. The extent that couples must go through in terms of duration of time and horrifying red tape is horrible, and in the end, if they are lucky, they wind up with a child (as opposed to a baby or a toddler) several years later. It's like you have to "justify your need" for what seems like a "consumption" of a limited and precious resource

When I read about Valeria, the 28 yr old with 9 children, you have to really wonder what the dangerous (lack of) logic is ("Human rights," "family first," and so on...). I can only imagine that all 9 of her current offspring are not going to have a fighting chance for very much in life, which is a crime when you think how obviously things could and should be different.

 

[mulderfox]

Nounou-

I cannot express how much I agree with you! I recently happened to look into the basic gist of adoption laws in this country a few weeks ago (long story), and it is so very sad, the epitome of South American bureaucracy at its absolute worst. Despite the numerous kids that I see on the street on a daily basis, according to law, they make it seem like these kids who need stable homes (which will also help prevent a very grave and damning cycle from repeating itself) are some kind of rare commodity. The extent that couples must go through in terms of duration of time and horrifying red tape is horrible, and in the end, if they are lucky, they wind up with a child (as opposed to a baby or a toddler) several years later. It's like you have to "justify your need" for what seems like a "consumption" of a limited and precious resource

When I read about Valeria, the 28 yr old with 9 children, you have to really wonder what the dangerous (lack of) logic is ("Human rights," "family first," and so on...). I can only imagine that all 9 of her current offspring are not going to have a fighting chance for very much in life, which is a crime when you think how obviously things could and should be different.

it´s really hard to take children away from the mother in here. even if she is a felon. they have full custody untill the kid is 4 i think.
female prisions even have pediatricians.

it´s the same in bolivia at least. but i think children can remain there untill there are 8

 

[arlean]

From what I see (everywhere--the subways, the buses, etc).--they nurse their babies and nursing until they are two or so is pretty normal just about everywhere except the U.S., and maybe that has changed there as well. But I wonder if this is a factor. I don´`t know what prison is like for a little one, but breast milk is sure a lot better for them than soy milk!

 

[gordita75]

Yikes!!! Try working in child welfare and then tell me about tearing kids from their mothers- from the time they are born they establish an attachment with a parent that you cant just 'disappear' by putting the kids with some stranger- at least in prison the kids are with mothers who are not on drugs or living on the streets and the children don't suffer from attachment disorder. Keeping a family together has to be the ultimate goal unlesss a chlid is at risk of harm. If you think keepin a kid with their mom in prison is bad, try researching american child welfare practices/laws (different in each state), you would be MORTIFIED.

ive worked in international adoption, child welfare and in prisons (that doesn't mean i know much fo anything but on that trifecta, a bit)

 

[AngelinBA]

I've visited Unidad 31 at ezeiza a number of times over the years, as far as prisons go it's not bad, and probably comparable conditions for the kids there to whatever "home" might be. They are cared for, but the psychological impact of growing up behind locked doors is huge. What is much worse in my mind are the female prisoners who keep getting pregnant so they don't have to back to the general prison wards. How do you do that to a kid?!

 

[gordita75]

youve met and established meaningful relationships with these women prisoners who have then shared with you that they are getting pregnant solely to not be in general prisons??

1. bullshit
2. judging anyone (even after falsely reducing any decison to a sole motive)= no bueno

 

[Bajo_cero2]

Well, to be in Jail doesn t mean they are bad mothers, they might be bad citizens perhaps.