Argentina's Soaring Birth Defect Rate, Gmo, And Monsanto

[GS_Dirtboy]

Snip... I have a very different perspective (and priorities) than people who grew up on an environment in which they never had hungry people knocking at their doors in tears begging for food. Once you do, you start not caring too much about how hogs and chickens are treated.

I care somewhat about how hogs and chickens are treated because I grew up on a farm, raised them, killed them, and ate them. I'm familiar with good animal processing. I'm much more concerned about diversity farming and feeding practices that are sustainable and don't burn out the land, cause a spike in human birth defects, and keep the ecosystem in balance.

Did you read/watch the documentaries? It doesn't seem like you did from your comments.

 

[GS_Dirtboy]

For further in-depth reading about what is at stake I recommend the excellent book by Jared Diamond, Collapse: How Societies Choose To Fail Or Succeed. It is a fascinating read about how past societies did not understand and/or respect their environment and overused natural resources leading to their collapse. Examples are the Modern-day Montana, Mayans, Vikings, Norse, Rwanda, Dominican Republic / Haiti, China, Australia, and Easter Island.

I'm far from an alarmist. But even a country boy like me can tell we've got a problem on the way.

 

[expatinowncountry]

On the issue of GMO and food security, the truth is probably in the middle.

Monsanto are not saints. If you think about it, all started with an evil act. It was during the Vietnam war that they found that some plants were not destroyed by the US napalm bombing because of a particular gen. So Monsanto realize that including that gen in their seeds they could create plants that were resistant to pesticides (a pesticide is a chemical weapon!) increasing productivity enormously. On top of that you could include other gens to create seeds that were drought resistant or that adapt better to different environments. They have a monopoly over many seeds and that is of course bad for consumers. But why companies would innovate if they did not have the extra profit that comes from holding a patent? It is a complicated trade off to evaluate.

You could think also the food industry in a similar way. It is all about sourcing and logistics... so if you can innovate there, you have a competitive advantage that allows you to capture a large share of the market... and when you own the market you can build barriers to discourage the entry of other companies. The role of competition policy is to regulate this and keep some sort of fair play (level field)

I work often in Africa, where conditions are similar to the Sertao (North East Brazil) so I have to be sympathetic to Camboriu's views. When you see crop yields that are one third of other developing countries in Asia or Latin America with massive harvest failures (and the famine that comes with it) because of increasing unpredictable climate conditions, you start asking yourself why you would not recommend farmers to use GMO seeds. It is very hard to judge this when eating for you means a short walk to the supermarket or a restaurant. The reality of developing countries is a totally different story.

The story of Monsanto and the current Argentine commodity boom is very interesting but it is a long story and I do not want to change the focus of the thread.

 

[Iznogud]

So you agree that Penn is a loud mouth?

I know Teller is not really mute. But in their act he is. That's the point. They are entertainers. They have an act. Personally, I wouldn't cite them when attempting to prove a point (or a counter point in this case) any more than I would ask Sean Penn to resolve the Malvinas/Falklands spat.

Ha ha, maybe Capusotto has some ideas on how to control inflation.

You certainly can read a lot of a simple sentence. Only said that a fact you presented is inaccurate. Could easily imply that the rest is also contaminated, using your logic...

 

[GS_Dirtboy]

Snip...

I work often in Africa, where conditions are similar to the Sertao (North East Brazil) so I have to be sympathetic to Camboriu's views. When you see crop yields that are one third of other developing countries in Asia or Latin America with massive harvest failures (and the famine that comes with it) because of increasing unpredictable climate conditions, you start asking yourself why you would not recommend farmers to use GMO seeds. It is very hard to judge this when eating for you means a short walk to the supermarket or a restaurant. The reality of developing countries is a totally different story.

The story of Monsanto and the current Argentine commodity boom is very interesting but it is a long story and I do not want to change the focus of the thread.

I agree with you. Fertilizer, pesticides, herbicides, and other farming innovations like crop rotation, crossing, etc have done a tremendous amount to increase the yield on food. And, we should do whatever we can to reduce the impact of famine-prone areas and get people food to eat. However, I think the point of these documentaries, and my concern, is that we are putting a tremendous pressure on the land - not to mention collusion between governments and a private company - and some of the impacts we are starting to see, both in humans and in our ecosystem, are pretty scary.

 

[sleslie23]

You certainly can read a lot of a simple sentence. Only said that a fact you presented is inaccurate. Could easily imply that the rest is also contaminated, using your logic...

Blah blah blah. If you've seen Penn and Tellers act then you should have understood my first post. Apparently you either didn't, or were just stating the obvious.

 

[arlean]

GS-Dirtboy and other informed ones. Thank you for posting this. It is an honor to be on the same forum with you guys.

This is NOT somewhere in the middle. If I were not using a rented computer I would post for you the rats fed GM corn for two years, that can hardly drag around the tumors. Actually Monsanto does not increase yields. Also animals fed monsanto GM feed for a number of years become sterile. Hamsters are sterile by the third generation, to be specific. Plus they also develop their own problems, including their fur growing inside their mouths. How would YOU like to have to cut the hair inside your mouth? Will it affect people that way? Only time will tell.

Monsanto is trying to get total control of the seeds so that no farmer can save their seed but will be totally subservient to Monsanto. In the US they are suing nearby farmers if they steal some of the farmer´s seed out of the field and it shows GM--that has polenated his field accidentally. What corruption! If you don´t believe me, just research it. Not hard to find.

They are using their huge wealth to accomplish their goals. I know a farmer in Uruguay who is leasing his small farm land to Monsanto and they are paying him an amazing amount of money for the privilege. He knows it is wrong and consoles himself because it is all going, they tell him, to China. Who can console himself that it is little Chinese children that will be eating the stuff instead of Uruguay?

This stuff came out of the U.S. where cancer rates have gone from 1 in 30 to almost 1 in 2. Who would want to copy them, the sickest population among the developed countries? Why would a country whose people always show up the sickest in any survey be considered someone to copy? I´ll tell you why. Because people do not know. But some do. My son was warned here not to eat the chicken in Argentina because the chicken farmers are copying U.S. methods of raising them and that some doctors warn women the hormones they are using to bring chickens to market faster cause breast cancer. Of COURSE they do. Behold . . . a smart, informed Argentine!

Fortunately we do still have a choice. If Monsanto has their way, they will eliminate that choice so we all need to stand for what is right. Feeding kids GM foods (or anyone else) is NOT RIGHT.

Look to Uruguay. They allow corn and soy to be GM and nothing else. I am so sorry Monsanto got their foot in the country at all. But if you eat beef or vegetables in Uruguay it is not GM´d. Quite a few countries have kicked Monsanto out because of what the research is showing. I hope Argentina will. I buy all organic that supposedly is not GM´d and I hope that´s true.

Thanks for the info on GM foods in Argentina. I have seen Food, Inc., also. I really appreciate any information you guys find on that. My daughter, a certified, nutritional therapist, has warned me about Argentina. She said 45% of the food is GM here and because of the huge soy crop I hope mostly that 45% is soy. I do not eat soy or corn ANYWHERE. I love this country but I won´t stay if I can´t get real food. I´ll put up with Cristina, but not a diet of GM food!!!!!!!!! Christina will come and go. The effects of eating GM will not. I hope parents reading this will become aware, really do the research, no matter what you think at this moment, and look out for their children who depend on them to protect them.

 

[expatinowncountry]

GS-Dirtboy and other informed ones. Thank you for posting this. It is an honor to be on the same forum with you guys.

This is NOT somewhere in the middle. If I were not using a rented computer I would post for you the rats fed GM corn for two years, that can hardly drag around the tumors. Actually Monsanto does not increase yields. Also animals fed monsanto GM feed for a number of years become sterile. Hamsters are sterile by the third generation, to be specific. Plus they also develop their own problems, including their fur growing inside their mouths. How would YOU like to have to cut the hair inside your mouth? Will it affect people that way? Only time will tell.

Monsanto is trying to get total control of the seeds so that no farmer can save their seed but will be totally subservient to Monsanto. In the US they are suing nearby farmers if they steal some of the farmer´s seed out of the field and it shows GM--that has polenated his field accidentally. What corruption! If you don´t believe me, just research it. Not hard to find.

They are using their huge wealth to accomplish their goals. I know a farmer in Uruguay who is leasing his small farm land to Monsanto and they are paying him an amazing amount of money for the privilege. He knows it is wrong and consoles himself because it is all going, they tell him, to China. Who can console himself that it is little Chinese children that will be eating the stuff instead of Uruguay?

This stuff came out of the U.S. where cancer rates have gone from 1 in 30 to almost 1 in 2. Who would want to copy them, the sickest population among the developed countries? Why would a country whose people always show up the sickest in any survey be considered someone to copy? I´ll tell you why. Because people do not know. But some do. My son was warned here not to eat the chicken in Argentina because the chicken farmers are copying U.S. methods of raising them and that some doctors warn women the hormones they are using to bring chickens to market faster cause breast cancer. Of COURSE they do. Behold . . . a smart, informed Argentine!

Fortunately we do still have a choice. If Monsanto has their way, they will eliminate that choice so we all need to stand for what is right. Feeding kids GM foods (or anyone else) is NOT RIGHT.

Look to Uruguay. They allow corn and soy to be GM and nothing else. I am so sorry Monsanto got their foot in the country at all. But if you eat beef or vegetables in Uruguay it is not GM´d. Quite a few countries have kicked Monsanto out because of what the research is showing. I hope Argentina will. I buy all organic that supposedly is not GM´d and I hope that´s true.

Thanks for the info on GM foods in Argentina. I have seen Food, Inc., also. I really appreciate any information you guys find on that. My daughter, a certified, nutritional therapist, has warned me about Argentina. She said 45% of the food is GM here and because of the huge soy crop I hope mostly that 45% is soy. I do not eat soy or corn ANYWHERE. I love this country but I won´t stay if I can´t get real food. I´ll put up with Cristina, but not a diet of GM food!!!!!!!!! Christina will come and go. The effects of eating GM will not. I hope parents reading this will become aware, really do the research, no matter what you think at this moment, and look out for their children who depend on them to protect them.

Your post is very long and very emotional so I really would not like to start a fight with a comment that may by misinterpreted. Your post is based in many unreliable sources and anecdotal evidence. Still you may be (or not) right in everything but for sure you are wrong in something and I need to point it out because I work on agricultural economics.... GM seeds increase yields quite a lot and allow the agro frontier to be expanded to areas were before the climate conditions did not allow some crops.

An example of this is Argentina (from 40 million tons to 100 million in ten years because of GM).

 

[sarahthebarber]

Stop crying and fighting about the problem and become part of the solution.

This is a terrifying and very real issue that so many ignore in order to not affect the convenience of their food sources. One way we can all do our part is to shop at local and organic markets, from local organic farms, refuse to eat certain foods that are commonly GM(ie: corn, soy etc.). These types of places are few and far between in Buenos Aires, but they are here and the only way to insure that these farms and markets are able to survive is to support them! As the demand increases for local and organic, which it is, the availability of these products and services will also increase.

Monsanto is one powerful organization, that is for sure. But we as individuals also have incredible power in the ways we choose to spend our pesos or dollars or whatever. We have the power to ensure that these small and sustainable farms survive and thrive, we have the power to not support massive organizations like Monsanto. It takes a small adjustment in lifestyle to carve out the time to travel a bit further than we normally would to shop for these things. However, the payoff for ourselves, our health and for the farmers we choose to support is tremendous.

Some links to access information regarding organic and farmers markets:

http://www.organicbuenosaires.com English and Spanish, has a lot of information about shops, markets, and restaurants that sell organic.

http://www.cocinaverde.com An organic food/meal delivery service with excellent quality providing foods that no other place in BA provides(ie: nut butters), but also has links for other markets, restaurants, etc. Also in English and Spanish.

http://www.elgalpon.org.ar A fantastic local market selling a large variety of products grown without the use of chemicals.

We have the power as individuals to change the landscape of these very damaging farming techniques that are directly affecting our health. Buy local, buy organic, change your life, change the planet. Tell your friends!

 

[GS_Dirtboy]

Your post is very long and very emotional so I really would not like to start a fight with a comment that may by misinterpreted. Your post is based in many unreliable sources and anecdotal evidence. Still you may be (or not) right in everything but for sure you are wrong in something and I need to point it out because I work on agricultural economics.... GM seeds increase yields quite a lot and allow the agro frontier to be expanded to areas were before the climate conditions did not allow some crops.

An example of this is Argentina.

Excellent! Someone who is in this industry!

My understanding is that GM seeds do indeed increase crop yields My concern is the cost of those crop yields with regard to:

1. Rapid expansion of farmland without good planning for nutrient cycles and soil erosion. It was cited that Argentina has lost 50% of it's remaining forest to the soy boom.

2. The long-term effects of GM food on humans.

3. The unrestrained use of pesticides/herbicides and the effects upon peoples located near these farms.

4. The obvious collusion between governments and Monsanto (at the expense of good oversight and control?).

We'd be very appreciative of your thoughts on these given your expertise.

Thanks!