Cost of dental braces in Argentina?

[Sockhopper]

Why would it be wrong for BA's professionals (accountants, dentists, engineers, lawyers, physicians) to charge in pesos at the 'blue' rate but right for eveyone else who deals in services and goods (property, cars, etc) to charge in 'blue'?

Why do people on this forum who promote the selling of $US in 'black' oppose portenos buying $US in 'black'? After all, without portenos buying dollars, tourists and expats would not have a market for their $US!

 

[citygirl]

Why would it be wrong for BA's professionals (accountants, dentists, engineers, lawyers, physicians) to charge in pesos at the 'blue' rate but right for eveyone else who deals in services and goods (property, cars, etc) to charge in 'blue'?

Why do people on this forum who promote the selling of $US in 'black' oppose portenos buying $US in 'black'? After all, without portenos buying dollars, tourists and expats would not have a market for their $US!

I don't know of any professionals in any of the above mentioned who charge in dollars and then demand the exchange at a "blue"rate.

Let's call a spade a spade. I have no issues with a doctor charging 6300 pesos. But he should be clear about what he is charging in pesos so you can compare it to other dentists.

And at 6300 pesos for an implant, that is more expensive than other dentists here. It very well may be worth it but that's for each person to decide.

I am aware it's cheaper than the US or Canada. But we don't live in the US or Canada or Brasil or wherever. So for *you*, it's a bargain because you come down here with foreign currency. For those who live in pesos, do you think spending 6300 a tooth feels like a bargain?

 

[LostinBA]

Why would it be wrong for BA's professionals (accountants, dentists, engineers, lawyers, physicians) to charge in pesos at the 'blue' rate but right for eveyone else who deals in services and goods (property, cars, etc) to charge in 'blue'?

Why do people on this forum who promote the selling of $US in 'black' oppose portenos buying $US in 'black'? After all, without portenos buying dollars, tourists and expats would not have a market for their $US!

I agree with citygirl. We live here and we live and earn in pesos. You're on vacation. Frankly, your post is just too silly to warrant much of a response. I'm glad you got a deal on your dental work. Enough said.

 

[Sockhopper]

I agree with citygirl. We live here and we live and earn in pesos. You're on vacation. Frankly, your post is just too silly to warrant much of a response. I'm glad you got a deal on your dental work. Enough said.

Oh, I didn't realize that you support pesification and the elimination of the black market. That changes everything. I was addressing my post to all those supporters of the black market which I only now know doesn't include you.

Then there are those residents who both earn in pesos and also have US bank accounts and so bring in $US via “Xoom”. Do they think ‘blue’ when they sell or use US, in ‘official’ when they come to spend their pesos got via “Xoom”, and in 'blue' again when they charge for their products and services?

As per my question not yet answered, I see no principle justifying the idea that it's fine for people in some occupations to charge 35% more than the official exchange rate for their work or product while those in other occupations must charge customers at the official rate for theirs. This distorts the value of the goods and services a society needs, and it begs more inflation!


I too want to be charged for all things in BA in pesos at their official rate as a repeat visitor. I can’t have a US-located bank account and so am not eligible to transfer $US to BA via "Xoom". No such facility exists in Canada or Europe where I live. This means that in BA a $US bill in a US-bank account holder’s hands as pesos via "Xoom" is worth 35% more than a $US bill in mine! Neither should any foreign visitor have to offend the law and policy of Argentina or any country he's in by using illegal money-dealers before his $USnon-Xoom are treated as being worth as much as $USXoom ones.

Due to the different currency rates in existence, this is all as though a multi-tiered pricing system for goods and services were in effect. Imagine a BA restaurant (charging in pesos) having to ask you what your nationality, residency, country of employment, and which forms of currency and exchange methods you have been using before the waiter can know which differently priced menu to bring you:
-one for portenos including professionals who only earn and charge in pesos (ejecutivo -45 pesos);
-one for professionals who do business with foreigners and portenos and who charge just their foreign clients more on the assumption that they can all just bloody well find it (medium price);
-one for professionals who charge all clients the 'blue' rate (500AR due to these diners' nerve);
-one for tourists who produce their atm slips to show they bought their pesos at the official rate (cheap meal);
-a very expensive one for anyone who uses “Xoom” and can’t adduce proof that he’s employed in Argentina; and
-one for tourists crazy enough to take the chance on cuevas (cheap meal + an extra 15% off).

This is a deplorable morass of discrimination. As someone who was just 3 months short of moving to BA to retire and apply for a 'pensionista', I realized I’m just not up to what has happened due to 2 different currencies being separately distorted and the ridiculous fact that my nationality not being American means I'd be paying 35% more than some residents in BA.

I hope things there change without worsening first.

 

[citygirl]

I'm pointing out that I don't know of any service providers here in Argentina that charge "in dollars" and then demand the blue market rate in pesos.

Cars are bought and sold in pesos. Houses legally now must be bought and sold in pesos (at least the declared portion)

His prices in pesos, since he demands the blue rate, are higher than other dentists. That's fine but let's just call it what it is.

And I'm curious - were his prices the same 6 months ago? IE - Did he charge 1050 USD and accept the 4.5 exchange rate (b/c there wasn't a blue market really at that time? )

 

[trennod]

Yep the FX rate used should not be the issue. The issue is the final price in pesos as compared to the competition for that good / service. The competition for that good / service exists inside Argentina so that should be the benchmark.

 

[Steph170]

Hi, on a lighter note, I have just arrived here and I have two upper front veneers that need replacing sooner than later as I thought I could last until I go home (3 months)

Is it ok going to the dentist here or will I have hell with my travel insurance. I have no clue how the dentist system works here and really want a good one!!

I also wanted some cosmetic work done, as in whitening which I know isnt medical but it is the only opportunity I can have my teeth whitened when my veneers are being replaced as they last 10 years.


Just some pointers would be much appreciated.

Thanks

 

[Sockhopper]

I don't know of any professionals in any of the above mentioned who charge in dollars and then demand the exchange at a "blue"rate.

for *you*, it's a bargain because you come down here with foreign currency. For those who live in pesos, do you think spending 6300 a tooth feels like a bargain?

If you want, need or think it’s right to pay in pesos at the official rate (as I do), I’d suggest that each person discuss this personally and respectfully with a dentist rather than think of a price posted on a forum as one cast in stone. A service provider stating a price doesn’t make a contract. Negotiating and finalizing terms can.

I would never contract to have in me a dental implant that isn’t Swiss-manufactured. There’s a reason for North American, European and at least some if not all BA dentists using only Swiss ones. I feel a deep ‘ouch’ for any who are can no longer import these.

Four years of researching, comparing and keeping up-to-date with dental fees shows me a remarkable consistency among BA dental fees.

Some expats attribute to their adopted countries problems that are also now being felt in their own countries since they moved away from it. Not everyone on this forum distinguishes specifically Argentine problems from those now affecting people in many countries. Some British expats in France also don’t distinguish.

While the devastating problems that have arisen in BA this year meant that my husband and I didn’t move there in May as we’d been working on since January, outrageously expensive dental costs are a big problem for most people on this planet. This isn’t due to inflation. It’s due to arrogance, seminars run for dentists teaching them how to counter patients saying they can’t afford those prices, and reps from dental associations having articles written in papers saying that dental treatment safety and expertise exist only in Canada.

Most of who need implants and go to BA would not call BA’s implants ‘cheap’! That’s for expats to stereotype us as thinking or living if they want. To us, they’re just cheaper and on par with those of recommended dentists and clinics in China and India.

My husband and I, tourists, go without a lot of things that some expats see as necessary and wrong not to have in BA. We don’t spend ¼ of our grocery budget on mineral water as I recently read on this forum or need Canadian brands’ toilet paper. We wouldn’t complain about the price of bottled pasta sauce in BA because, of course, we’d continue to make our own – homemade is better! I could show you ordinary things in my house now priced at 30% more than a year ago. The difference is that when you live in a ‘better’ country, you’re supposed to not see inflation and many things that have become markedly and embarrassingly ‘third world’ here over the past 5 years. When sidewalks and roads here are in way worse condition than BA’s, that’s not despicable. It’s just the result of “budget cuts”.

Not all of us just ‘come down’ to BA with $US as you said. We save all year by spending less. Some of us have to convert our $CAD, euro, pound sterling, $AU etc. to $US first. That costs. We don’t have a preferential and legal transfer facility like “Xoom” and for some of us a holiday in a democracy isn’t synonymous with exploring the world of illegal money-dealing to be sure that we can live better than portenos.

I just saw your later question. In November and December, Dr. Pelcman was charging $US1000 for an implant and crown.

 

[citygirl]

my question was about the FX rate he was accepting in November, since there wasn't the blue market.

So was he accepting 4500 pesos in November? And now is charging 6300 pesos 6 months later to take advantage of the blue rate? That's the big question.

Sockhopper - that's great that you've found the solution here. And I wasn't implying anything about how you or anyone chooses to spend your money. But you still think in dollars (US/Canadian) and say "Oh, this is a bargain getting the work done in Argentina (and it is compared to Canada)." But dental work isn't a bargain here if you live and earn in pesos. 6300 pesos is a monthly salary for a middle class professional.

Like I said, way back when, he may absolutely be the top dentist or use different materials or have any number of reasons for charging what he charges. His results may indeed justify it - it sounds like that is certainly the case for you and that's fantastic. He absolutely has the right to charge whatever he feels his services warrant. I was just responding to the OP that price in pesos for services seems high compared to what other dentists are charging here.

 

[LostinBA]

I don't know what exchange rate he was giving 6-12 months ago. The quote was always in USD.

Sockhopper, you seem genuinely concerned re social justice as it pertains to the exchange rate. I might suggest that you take your CAN$ and exchange them for the official rate so as not to take advantage of Argentina and Argentines. Then when you need services, and the provider quotes you in USD and wants the blue rate, you can see how it feels.

I have no problem paying the 'blue rate' for imported hardware like the titanium screws if indeed they came from outside Argentina and if the dentist himself had to pay USD for these at the blue rate. However, all 'services' and nationally produced goods should be priced at the official rate. My suspicion is that they normally are and that any professional quoting everything in USD and then wanting the blue rate exchange for everything is simply taking advantage of 'rich' foreigners and would probably never do such a thing to fellow Argentines.