Cost of living in Argentina for foreigners improving?

[GuidoAnselmi]

So, I've been outside of Argentina for a few months now, but I still keep up with the news, and I have to say, while I knew it before, living through it has been another thing: Argentine businesses truly have consumers over a barrel.

Since Argentina and Brazil are in a customs union, I'm often looking at or buying literally the same brands, same model numbers, same product, and a ton of stuff is increasingly bilingual to make shipping to the rest of Mercosur easier, but the price differences between here and Argentina are night and day. While it's true that VAT here is 4% lower, prices are anywhere from 10% to 50% less, or even lower than Argentina, and you can't simply chalk it up just to freight.

This is what Milei and the "pro-market" guys don't understand, and what several of us have been saying since 2023 when it looked like he was going to win: taxes could be 0% in Argentina, but basic economics will always be ignored in favor of insane margins as @Che1990 was saying. These companies don't want to compete, and I'm not sure if Rich's question about butchers was rhetorical or not, but this is exactly what I've seen time and time again: Argentine businesses, even those that sell perishable goods, would prefer to sell 1 unit for $5 instead of 2 for $9.50, even if that means losing their original investment.

Milei and Caputo's conceptualization of economics are purely theoretical because that's what they studied in school (and orthodoxically at that; Austrian, and neoliberal respectively). They're also both so wealthy that they probably haven't gone grocery shopping personally since Menem was in office, and earnestly believe that if you "cut red tape" and "free the market" things will just sort themselves out, but don't know or don't care that Argentine business men have always viewed laize-faire economics as an invitation by the government to gamble as to how high they can set their profit margins before they either go bankrupt due to a lack of sales, or political pressure forces the government to intervene in the gouging (think pre-pagas).

Finally, let's remember that the US doesn't directly intervene in other countries economies (and elections) the way it did here when things are going well: things are so bad in Argentina that, at best, Scott Bessent is truly corrupt, and is just saving his friend Rob Citrone from having to take a bath on his Argentine investments, or at worse, the US fears a Tequila Fernet Crisis, and is trying to prop Milei up lest Trump lose one of his most loyal sycophants in the region.

TL;DR cost of living for all, not just foreigners will continue to get worse; beatings to continue until morale improves.

Your penultimate paragraph says it all. Corrupt beyond the pale. And Citrone is not the only one who will be saved from a bath.

 

[Rich One]

I'm not sure if Rich's question about butchers was rhetorical or not, but this is exactly what I've seen time and time again: Argentine businesses, even those that sell perishable goods, would prefer to sell 1 unit for $5 instead of 2 for $9.50, even if that means losing their original investment.

The butcher mentioned worries about the total peso sale, not individual cut prices. He needs to set money aside to go to Mar del Plata with the family in Summer.
He travels to poorer barrios to buy prime cuts from other butcher shops (lomo, ojo de bife, and bife the chorizo) at firesale prices. A side ot beef has a limited number of prime cuts that don't move fast in popular barrios.

 

[RichardAlem]

Sounds like a great opportunity for foreigners with the right business acumen to start a business in some kind of consumer goods with competitive pricing. Why I never read about that?

You don't read about it because it's not a good idea.

 

[Lanick]

They are.

It’s a combination of too much pride, greed, a lack of astuteness and the same poor work ethic you see in the restaurants and shops here.

They don’t give a fuck about selling or working. All they care about is working as little as possible for as much as possible. All short term thinking.

If you look on MercadoLibre or Rappi for a particular product, you’ll find huge price differences. A packet of Juan Valdez coffee is anywhere from 20,000 to 40,000 pesos.

Doesn’t happen anywhere else - businesses check what their competitors are doing all the time, and price match and price beat.

Here they don’t even bother.

There are also lots of monopolies, regulation and protectionism that breeds these practices.

A good example are the estate agents, they are horrific. Scum of the earth. They don’t work hard and charge ridiculous commissions.

But they get away with it because of the regulations that protect them. You have to be licensed to be an estate agent, and be a member of the CUCIIBA chamber/union where they all agree to charge % commission. Nothing you can do about it. It’s against their code to charge less commission. Corrupt laws protecting them.

A few months ago there was a video on TikTok/IG about a furniture business that was doing really well because they had good prices.

They shared a video from when they started out 2 years earlier about all the hate they received from other furniture companies because of their low pricing, comments like “I wouldn’t get out of bed for that margin”, “you’ll put us all out of business”

And also, when Uber arrived. Everywhere else, normal taxis have to lower their prices, innovate new services, and improve their offering. Básica fucking capitalism.

Here what did they do? The taxi drivers hunted down the uber drivers, attacked them, threw stones at them, and damaged their cars like cavemen.

And now lots of businesses are complaining about the imports coming in, as they finally have to compete and lower their prices.

That’s the mentality of many -not all- Argentine business people.

It’s why the country is so fucked, too. It’s not just the politics, it’s society.

Work ethics in Argentina is the point. Doesn’t exist and excruciatingly annoying. Argentines historically been extremely self sufficient and lived a good life. But for the last 20 years they’re getting poorer gradually. Some still keep thinking they’re something else and they hit rock bottom and then some of them realise the situation. But too little too late. Lack of work ethics is the main cause of many things in Argentina. There was a post comparing Turkey and Argentina the other day. Very similar nations economically but Turkey is way better than Argentina because of work ethics. Almost everyone has an attitude in Argentina and businesses think they’re doing you a favor by selling their goods or services. This has to change.

 

[Warm_breeze]

Work ethics in Argentina is the point. Doesn’t exist and excruciatingly annoying. Argentines historically been extremely self sufficient and lived a good life. But for the last 20 years they’re getting poorer gradually. Some still keep thinking they’re something else and they hit rock bottom and then some of them realise the situation. But too little too late. Lack of work ethics is the main cause of many things in Argentina. There was a post comparing Turkey and Argentina the other day. Very similar nations economically but Turkey is way better than Argentina because of work ethics. Almost everyone has an attitude in Argentina and businesses think they’re doing you a favor by selling their goods or services. This has to change.

On a related note Argentina has hands down the worst customer service on earth, no matter where you go whether it's restaurants or retail, or dealing with aerolineas

Having said that its still my favourite place on earth

 

[Lanick]

On a related note Argentina has hands down the worst customer service on earth, no matter where you go whether it's restaurants or retail, or dealing with aerolineas

Having said that its still my favourite place on earth

You experiencing something like Stockholm Syndrome then !

I can’t imagine living or even visiting Argentina again. Crazy stupid prices for rubbish quality. The attitude. Awful customer service. Non existent justice system. Disrespectful drivers. People parking disabled bay. Rudeness at its best!!

 

[Che1990]

You experiencing something like Stockholm Syndrome then !

I can’t imagine living or even visiting Argentina again. Crazy stupid prices for rubbish quality. The attitude. Awful customer service. Non existent justice system. Disrespectful drivers. People parking disabled bay. Rudeness at its best!!

Yet we all love this country! I bitch and moan all time but wouldn’t live anywhere else in the world

 

[perry]

You don't read about it because it's not a good idea.

Work ethics in Argentina is the point. Doesn’t exist and excruciatingly annoying. Argentines historically been extremely self sufficient and lived a good life. But for the last 20 years they’re getting poorer gradually. Some still keep thinking they’re something else and they hit rock bottom and then some of them realise the situation. But too little too late. Lack of work ethics is the main cause of many things in Argentina. There was a post comparing Turkey and Argentina the other day. Very similar nations economically but Turkey is way better than Argentina because of work ethics. Almost everyone has an attitude in Argentina and businesses think they’re doing you a favor by selling their goods or services. This has to change.

thank You Lanick for your direct and honest points . Very few argentinos people are willing to admit realities . Argentina ID definetely the dearest coubtry of they world now for Bad Quality and reduced servings .

Today I was in san Telmo Market these are some of the prices for take away . Croissants 6600 pesos each . papaya fruit 12000 pesos pee kiilo . milanesa de ternera 13000 pesos per kilo . take away hamburguesa 13000 pesos . empanada saltela3500 peso each . Main courses in pop up restaurantes minimum 25000 pesos . a take away flat white 4500 pesos .

lanick You in London considered very expensiive can You give us a idea of prices for similar ítems there in a farmers market or food hall ?

 

[Alby]

We get it. You won the long running argument days ago in the other thread.

 

[Lanick]

thank You Lanick for your direct and honest points . Very few argentinos people are willing to admit realities . Argentina ID definetely the dearest coubtry of they world now for Bad Quality and reduced servings .

Today I was in san Telmo Market these are some of the prices for take away . Croissants 6600 pesos each . papaya fruit 12000 pesos pee kiilo . milanesa de ternera 13000 pesos per kilo . take away hamburguesa 13000 pesos . empanada saltela3500 peso each . Main courses in pop up restaurantes minimum 25000 pesos . a take away flat white 4500 pesos .

lanick You in London considered very expensiive can You give us a idea of prices for similar ítems there in a farmers market or food hall ?

Hello Perry;

Let me put it this way. I divide time between Spain and the UK. In Spain I renovate houses. I got Argentine builders working for me. One of them went to Arhentina for a month to visit after 4 years and back in 10 days due to the prices.

London is seriously cheaper than BsAs. At my local Sainsbury’s (supermarket) for £10 (usd 13,5) I can buy 200 gr large prawns, 3 portions of fresh egg pasta, pesto sauce, 12 meatballs, 200 gr of humus, 200 gr pack of feta cheese and tomatoes. Espresso at a chain cafe is around £2. Pharmacies cheap. Clothing cheap. Electronics cheap.

Adding the screenshots of the local Lidl circular. You can see the prices. Spain is even cheaper. You can have a decent bodega meal for €10. A 2 scoops of artisanal ice cream €2,50.