Ding Dong' The Merry-Oh, Sing It High, Sing It Low.

[Noesdeayer]

O.K. already.It's fine to be happy that a gov't that sewed discord, distrust and division among Argentines is over.However,we have to be careful about overpersonalizing the issue.
I have been here 37 years since 1979 since and I have NEVER witnessed more hate mongering in this country as with the last 8 K years. Surprisingly enough not even during the military dictatorship However,let's accentuate the positive and disactivate the negative ,please.

 

[Dada]

Yes, that's what I don't like about her either. It' also why she keeps losing points. As someone said, "never interrupt an enemy when making a mistake". Her problem. Doesn't mean I have to fall into the same pattern.

Rich, please don't get me wrong. When I see you doing or saying something stupid or potentially self-damaging, I will tell you. I may even call that particular thing stupid or whatever (you name it), without ever calling you stupid, or thinking that silently. You are not the trap you're falling into, nobody is. Yet, these passions have done so much damage already that I find it appropriate to address them, preferably at this relatively early and innocent stage.

Like her or not, Cristina with all her flaws was one of the better presidents. How about for example Gaddafi? That was one serious dictator. Yet, look where Libya got by lynching him and dancing on his grave. Nothing good ever came from hate.

 

[Rich One]

Scioli lost because of the anti CFK Vote.. ...! Argentinos are not celebrating Macri's Inauguration but CFK Demise B) B)

 

[nicoenarg]

Nice. Now we're down to being thankful that she wasn't as bad as Gaddafi. Great way to never improve I guess.

 

[Rich One]

Yes, that's what I don't like about her either. It' also why she keeps losing points. As someone said, "never interrupt an enemy when making a mistake". Her problem. Doesn't mean I have to fall into the same pattern.

Rich, please don't get me wrong. When I see you doing or saying something stupid or potentially self-damaging, I will tell you. I may even call that particular thing stupid or whatever (you name it), without ever calling you stupid, or thinking that silently. You are not the trap you're falling into, nobody is. Yet, these passions have done so much damage already that I find it appropriate to address them, preferably at this relatively early and innocent stage.

Like her or not, Cristina with all her flaws was one of the better presidents. How about for example Gaddafi? That was one serious dictator. Yet, look where Libya got by lynching him and dancing on his grave. Nothing good ever came from hate.

Dada .... I read you loud and clear and I feel better and more self assured knowing that you will tell me if I Do or say something stupid...!
You are correct CFK was better than Gaddafi ! Also should mention perhaps she was better than Chavez

IMHO we all have the right to post our views it makes no sense to argue positions...!

 

[Gringoboy]

Like her or not, Cristina with all her flaws was one of the better presidents. How about for example Gaddafi? That was one serious dictator. Yet, look where Libya got by lynching him and dancing on his grave. Nothing good ever came from hate.

Here we go again, making nonsensical comparisons which are foolish in the extreme.
From this moment on, my desire to converse on the subject of CFK is almost completely diminished, except to say that she was the one of the most divisive, narcissistic and dangerous presidents this country has ever been inflicted with.
I'm now looking forward to the future as today as proved to be the happiest of days.
Let's move on shall we?

 

[ElQueso]

Dada, I have been here for 9 years and 2 months. i watched one person (with help, to be sure, but mostly directed by her) move this country from a country prosperously recovering from a horrible economic collapse 4 years before I got here, when the government literally stole billions of dollars from its citizens and foreign investors (not all rich people, as if to some that would have made things alright, but rather mostly ordinary people in places like Greece who lost their retirement savings).

I saw optimism in the days I came here. I had heard that previously people walked the street with their heads down and scowls on their faces but that's not what I saw so much then. I saw optimism and hope.

i watched that slowly leak from the populace, accelerating quickly in the last few years. She took the hope and optimism from the country as a whole and ended up giving it to just those who shouted her name with adoration, or went along in hopes of profiting from her policies as well.

Now, I look around, with many industries seriously damaged, rights curtailed "for the good of all", people following Cristina like Hitler youth with a blank, yet burning, brainwashed look in their eyes, i see the amount of damage that she has managed to bring around yet again to this country with her arrogant, one-sided policies. Most people i know struggling to make it to the end of the month. A larger number of woman in the prostibulos or on escort websites showing up at the end of the month to find a way to make money to complete the month. A larger number of poor people feeling desperate as their salaries didn't keep up with the inflation generated by populist policies that do damage.

i don't hate Cristina. i don't see hate here on the forum either. Like Gringoboy said, I just see relief and celebration that she's gone. Why the hell shouldn't we feel relief and celebrate? Along with millions of Argentinos who are doing likewise!

She did very, very little to bring honor or respect to the office of the executive of this country. I see little reason why we should show her blind respect in return, in the sense of her as the ex-chief executive. Certainly, as an American, I don't feel like she had any respect toward me (in a general sense) and I do everything I can to comply with the laws of this country, showing way more respect to Argentinos than she ever did. Particularly given how she loved to make my people the scapegoat of so much that is wrong with this country, somehow.

Look at how she left office. She is not deserving of respect as an ex-president in my opinion. She neither respected the people, nor the office of president.

As I've mentioned previously, I'd show her the respect due another human being if I saw her on the street (and her Recoleta apartment is about 2 1/2 blocks from where I live). I probably wouldn't hold a conversation with her - what would be the point? But neither would I spit on her and yell at her, as I believe most of thepeople on this forum would not behave in such a manner either.

Respect should not being given blindly.

Hate? Nah. Relief and for the first time in at least 5-6 years or so, a forward-looking hope for the future.

 

[wineguy999]

And the Godwin's Law winner is...ElQueso! :lol:

And your post is dead on what most of us (and Argentina?) feel.

 

[ElQueso]

And the Godwin's Law winner is...ElQueso! :lol:

And your post is dead on what most of us (and Argentina?) feel.

Well, I don't throw the Nazi card very often, I don't mean to compare Cristina herself to Hitler himself, but you have to admit that La Campora, La Vatayon Militante (whose symbol, BTW, is a peaceful little bunny rabbit) and other organizations that seem to follow Cristina blindly, are very reminiscent of the Hitler Youth and/or Hitler's "Brownshirts".

The problem with Godwin's Law in forums is that when one is talking of tyrannical leaders, Hitler and/or Nazism is an obvious, famous comparison and automatic cautionary tale.

But I do not mean to suggest that Cristina rose, or was planning to rise, to anything approaching the level of Hitler and his Third Reich. I was talking more about her ability to bring so many gullible people into her fold as adorers, and potentially dangerous ones (at least to the institutions of democracy itself) at that.

 

[rrptownley]

I have parallel but diverging emotions.

As soon as I heard the pot banging, whistles, vuvuzelas and cries of the people in my barrio at midnight, I poured myself a whisky and went up to the terrace and listened, but didn't join in. A wave of relief fizzled through me — a release of pent-up stress, depression, and pessimism that had been shadowing me for years, ever more since 2011 when capital controls and authoritarian state policies began to affect me personally.
I haven't greatly enjoyed recent years in Argentina. I have felt the state working against me, not for me. I pass the Casa Rosada on the way to and from work everyday and its presence instilled an authoritarian clamp on my both my potential, and freedom, to be my best in Argentina. I haven't received state benefits, I have seen no one who has trespassed my own liberties sent to prison, I haven't seen any action made with the the long-term good of the country in mind — only damaging populist reactions to serious situations—, I earn in pesos.
And so, at the hour of Cristina's exit, an involuntary flush of relief tingled across my shoulders and down my spine, tears welled in my eyes. Change has come, optimism grows in a government that I hope would more seek to represent the people, me myself, and the country's long-term benefit, rather than any populist ends.

Although, as the whistles, honking and pot banging died down and turned instead to shouts of "chau Crisitina," "se fue la yegua," and "Si Mauricio se puede," I felt a more concious emotion of apprehension. Not to celebrate now. Not to join in any militancy, reprimands, overly optimistic forecasts. I'm worried over the knowledge that, in order to fix the damage that has been done, the country needs to undergo some tough therapy. People wont be happy, there is a large, vibrant opposition not just in the Senate but also on the streets. They have a lot of funding and a lot of organization. Macri and his cabinet themselves aren't entirely clean, and I worry if they are up to task or if they can even survive the first four years.

But relief and cautiously-optimistic worry feels so much better than the anxious, restrictive pressure that the previous regime had me shackled to over the last decade. I step lighter and I'm making plans for the future.