Help with landlord dispute over expenses

[hoda0010]

We're in a dispute with our landlord. Basically, we rented our apartment in Dec 2022 under the old 3 year rental law with annual increases. Our contract stipulates the expenses we'll pay in accordance with the terms of the law at that time, so it says we shouldn't pay extraordinary expenses, but also that we're really only responsible for "habitual" expenses related to the property regardless of whether they're listed as extraordinary or ordinary common expenses.

When we rented two years ago the rent was affordable and the expenses low so we just paid everything even though we shouldn't have been (definitely a mistake). Last year, the owner started pestering us about voluntarily paying more than our contract stipulated because he didn't feel like we were paying enough, but we just reminded him that we've been paying all of the expenses and have also paid to fix things without going to him or asking to be reimbursed. We also mentioned that at the beginning of our final year, and after having our huge rental increase that comes with annual contracts (it tripled, last month we paid 1.1 million pesos (915,000 rent and 185,000 expenses) for a 2 bedroom in Villa Crespo in an older building with no amenities), that we would like to start only paying the expenses we're required to pay. We felt this was fair, especially considering we've paid all of the expenses for the last two years, take good care of the property and pay on time every month.

The owner is not taking this well. First, he refused to admit that he was responsible for any of the expenses and that everything listed was our responsibility. Then, there was a moment when he seemed to agree that maybe we shouldn't be responsible for paying the expenses related to the improvements to the Portero's apartment, but after he reverted back to simply disagreeing and saying we need to pay all of the expenses. The building administrator has been nice and answers our questions, but nothing on our expenses are broken out into ordinary or extraordinary expenses so we're basically left to just wade through them (although my understanding is also that it's more about habitual expenses rather than ordinary/extraordinary with our contract). The building is doing a lot of work on the balconies and there has been a lot of work in other units of the building which have really driven up our overall expenses and we don't feel like we should be paying for those things.

Has anyone else been through this? Or have any advice? I've researched a lot and we're going to send an email to the free legal service for tenants and owners the city offers to at least find out how we should move forward.

I also feel like there's probably a cultural tenant/landlord issue going on that, as outsiders, I'd love more insight on. Our total rent plus expenses payment last month was 1.1 million pesos, so asking to remove 57k pesos for things on the expenses related to repairs in other units and improvements done in the portero's apartment really doesn't seem unreasonable to me. Thoughts?

 

[antipodean]

I also feel like there's probably a cultural tenant/landlord issue going on that, as outsiders, I'd love more insight on. Our total rent plus expenses payment last month was 1.1 million pesos, so asking to remove 57k pesos for things on the expenses related to repairs in other units and improvements done in the portero's apartment really doesn't seem unreasonable to me. Thoughts?

Culturally, most Argentines don't really care about what the law or a contract says - they place more importance on the relationship where both sides try to be fair to each other knowing that in this economy each part will have their ups and their downs. When they feel that this is the case, they are likely to be more flexible and less conchudo about things. When they feel someone is too quick to point to a contract before talking things about, their defence mechanism of inflexibility and nit-picking comes out.
(Although like absolutely anywhere in the world there will always be some people who out of desperation, ignorance or simply their personality try to take advantage).

Do a search on real-estate websites to see the prices of similar apartments to yours (zone, size, age, facilities etc).
Use the market price vs total amount you are currently paying as the starting point to your discussions to show the "reasoning" behind which side may actually be loosing out. Also consider how long you may have been paying "too little" if that was the case and try to quantify the gap to try see it from the owners perspective (e.g. if there is any reasonable reasoning behind it).

Then if you are really paying "too much" you can just give your notice to leave early, knowing that the owner will have a hard time finding sometime to pay as much as you are paying (plus risk months of the apartment laying empty and needing to pay expenses and other costs himself while searching for a new tenant...) so at that point of realisation they may change their stance.

 

[nikad]

Under the former law and based on what the Civil Code states, the tenant is only responsible for ordinary expenses. If I was in your situation, I would send a carta documento ( legal letter ) to the landlord, letting him know that from now on you will not be paying expensas extraordinarias, so that any debt is his sole responsibility. He can either pay them himself, of reply to your legal letter allowing you to deduct that amount from rent if you pay them. This being said, he will obviously won't be renewing your contract, there are currently plenty of rentals available in the city.

 

[nikad]

The total price you are paying for a 2 br in Villa Crespo plus building fees is average market price, it is not outrageous, but I am sure there are other properties available, if you have proof of income or garantia, you should be fine. Leaving early and terminating the contract will only generate more expenses to you are there is a fine that has to be paid ( all contracts have that )

 

[Quilombo]

Agree with what Nikad has said, you've tried to be amicable, but he's not interested, so now it's time to be respectful but serious.

I'd start with the approach she suggested, keeping in mind that you can escalate from there, but hopefully there won't be any need.

As I've said previously, there are a lot of consortiums and landlords in CABA smoking paco these days because they're out of touch with the economic situation of the country. My building's expenses have reached almost a quarter of a million pesos for nothing. We have no SUM, no pool, no security, yet we're expected to pay this insanity.

Thankfully my contract ends in February so I gave notice, I told the landlord nothing against her, I know she doesn't set the expenses, but I recommend she works with the other owners because there's no way this building should cost this much each month. She didn't have a response other than the regrettably common Argentine thing of complaining about the situation, but not wanting to do the work to resolve it.

As for your rent, it seems a bit high to me, but except for one year I've always lived downtown where it's cheaper. My new place is 500K for 110m2 and the expensas are 175K, with rent adjustable to IPC.

 

[Lanick]

Seems like you got nothing to worry about. Just another greedy LL trying to take advantage of a gringo tenant.

 

[D.B. Cooper]

There's the Camara Argentina de la Propiedad Horizontal y Actividades Inmobiliarias. They're on Peru 570 Street in San Telmo. They might be able to point you in the right direction. They're like a chamber of commerce for Real Estate property issues. Good luck.