How easy is it to be sued by a nanny here?

[sergio]

Labour law is a double edged sword in Argentina. It gives workers some needed protection from unjust employers but it can also be easily abused. The informal economy is huge in Argentina because the country is backward in many respects - too many taxes, too much corruption. In many cases hiring someone legally is just too costly so employers look for the obvious alternative. The people I know who do this would prefer to have a more transparent system but it just doesn't work that way for small businesses. In the case of maids, doing it legally is not so expensive.

I agree with the comment that if you lived in another country without domestic help, you can do it here too. More and more Argentines are getting away from hiring domestic workers. It's not. a bad idea to clean your own toilets.

 

[mmoon]

I’ll likely get attacked for this comment, but my experience has mostly been that foreigners come to Argentina and realize they can afford to have regular domestic help and suddenly they have/need a full time employee (who’s often being paid under the table). They’re freaked out but convinced that they can’t live without them (even though they lived many years outside of Argentina without all this help).
I had a friend in BA with two college-age kids and an apartment of about 100 square meters. She did not work outside of the home but she was sure she needed to keep a full time maid. (How much could she clean? She loved to iron while she watched TV.) Even though she was paid en blanco and an employee of theirs for 20 years, she still found a way to sue them. I believe it had to do with unused vacation days. Of course they settled because they knew they would lose and they didn’t want to deal with a court case. So it goes...

 

[semigoodlookin]

I’ll likely get attacked for this comment, but my experience has mostly been that foreigners come to Argentina and realize they can afford to have regular domestic help and suddenly they have/need a full time employee (who’s often being paid under the table). They’re freaked out but convinced that they can’t live without them (even though they lived many years outside of Argentina without all this help).
I had a friend in BA with two college-age kids and an apartment of about 100 square meters. She did not work outside of the home but she was sure she needed to keep a full time maid. (How much could she clean? She loved to iron while she watched TV.) Even though she was paid en blanco and an employee of theirs for 20 years, she still found a way to sue them. I believe it had to do with unused vacation days. Of course they settled because they knew they would lose and they didn’t want to deal with a court case. So it goes...

I have been reading this thread thinking much the same. Do people really need a full-time worker to do basic house chores? Although, this question was about a nanny and of course, everyone's case is different. That said, I too know people who have come here and got a cleaner when it is just not needed at all or they never had one in their previous country.

 

[Rich One]

I’ll likely get attacked for this comment, but my experience has mostly been that foreigners come to Argentina and realize they can afford to have regular domestic help and suddenly they have/need a full time employee (who’s often being paid under the table). They’re freaked out but convinced that they can’t live without them (even though they lived many years outside of Argentina without all this help).
I had a friend in BA with two college-age kids and an apartment of about 100 square meters. She did not work outside of the home but she was sure she needed to keep a full time maid. (How much could she clean? She loved to iron while she watched TV.) Even though she was paid en blanco and an employee of theirs for 20 years, she still found a way to sue them. I believe it had to do with unused vacation days. Of course they settled because they knew they would lose and they didn’t want to deal with a court case. So it goes...

We have read in the news about top Government Officials/Actors who get sued by domestic help for being in Negro for 20 years!! . Mirtha Legrand, and others alike.
Secretary of Labour Triaca sued by former housekeeper for termination without notice or indemnization plus other claims?

https://opisantacruz.com.ar/2018/01...iso-ni-indemnizacion-entre-otras-cosas/50441/

Most legal suits are won by House Help see below...!

https://www.elobservador.com.uy/not...os-ganan-las-empleadas-domesticas-20138171990

 

[sergio]

I don’t know where you are from but people in general all over the world behave that way. Perhaps you are more sensitive here and don’t pay much attention to people in your own country. I have clients all around the world and they are always trying to f*ck me over, just like my Argentine clients. And the more generous and kinder I am (performing extra work not agreed in the contracts, for instance) the worse it gets.



Oh, that almost brings a tear to my eyes! What about paying your nanny “in white” or however you wanna call it. You do the right thing and it’s literally impossible to get sued.

I would say, to you and the rest of the expats here, behave in Argentina like you would behave in your own country. If you can’t or you are not willing to do so, then that confirms even more so that you are basically identical to us Argentines. Many of you may think you have some moral superiority but then you come up with threads like this one.

S

Some expats come here and they start to adopt local vices. A US friend who worked here worked for a US native citizen. This US guy ran an important business and broke lots of labour laws. He just thought he could get away with it.

 

[Stantucker]

S

Some expats come here and they start to adopt local vices. A US friend who worked here worked for a US native citizen. This US guy ran an important business and broke lots of labour laws. He just thought he could get away with it.

Before this discussion about Expats not paying in blanco because they have adopted local bad habits takes on a life of it's own, I would like to clarify a few things: 1) I think a lot of us pay in negro because the people working for us have asked us to do so and we see it as a way of helping them. I realize that may not be helping them in the long run, but they seem to think it helps them in the short run, and we honor that. 2) Paying in negro, especially for domestic help, not only happens here but most every where. It's insulting to Argentines to make it sound like it's pretty much exclusively their bad habit.

We did not pay our house cleaners in the States in blanco nor do we pay our house cleaner here in blanco for the reasons I outlined above. In every other area here we pay every tax and declare all our assets. I have always preferred to pay in blanco and maybe I should, but not doing so is, in many cases, about a lot more than laziness or not wanting to do the right thing for personal gain.

 

[sergio]

Before this discussion about Expats not paying in blanco because they have adopted local bad habits takes on a life of it's own, I would like to clarify a few things: 1) I think a lot of us pay in negro because the people working for us have asked us to do so and we see it as a way of helping them. I realize that may not be helping them in the long run, but they seem to think it helps them in the short run, and we honor that. 2) Paying in negro, especially for domestic help, not only happens here but most every where. It's insulting to Argentines to make it sound like it's pretty much exclusively their bad habit.

We did not pay our house cleaners in the States in blanco nor do we pay our house cleaner here in blanco for the reasons I outlined above. In every other area here we pay every tax and declare all our assets. I have always preferred to pay in blanco and maybe I should, but not doing so is, in many cases, about a lot more than laziness or not wanting to do the right thing for personal gain.

I was not referring to hiring domestics but violating labour law in a company setting, something this individual would have been much less likely to have done in his own country.

 

[mmoon]

Before this discussion about Expats not paying in blanco because they have adopted local bad habits takes on a life of it's own, I would like to clarify a few things: 1) I think a lot of us pay in negro because the people working for us have asked us to do so and we see it as a way of helping them. I realize that may not be helping them in the long run, but they seem to think it helps them in the short run, and we honor that. 2) Paying in negro, especially for domestic help, not only happens here but most every where. It's insulting to Argentines to make it sound like it's pretty much exclusively their bad habit.

We did not pay our house cleaners in the States in blanco nor do we pay our house cleaner here in blanco for the reasons I outlined above. In every other area here we pay every tax and declare all our assets. I have always preferred to pay in blanco and maybe I should, but not doing so is, in many cases, about a lot more than laziness or not wanting to do the right thing for personal gain.

Obviously I don’t know your exact situation, but to me the difference in paying “in negro” in Argentina vs the States is that I literally don’t know anyone in the States who has a full-time house cleaner/maid. In the US, it’s overwhelmingly more freelance-style/independent contractor (with a host of unique problems as well) vs in Argentina where one employer is solely responsible for an employee’s livelihood.

 

[Kaminoge]

I have been reading this thread thinking much the same. Do people really need a full-time worker to do basic house chores? Although, this question was about a nanny and of course, everyone's case is different. That said, I too know people who have come here and got a cleaner when it is just not needed at all or they never had one in their previous country.

I've had a cleaner in quite a few countries. Not because I need a cleaner (although of course it's nice) but because (as someone else mentioned) I see it as a good way to give someone a job. Presumably someone who needs it. I haven't been here long enough to really think about it but threads like this convince me that I won't be getting one here. Which means that someone misses out on a pretty cruise-y job. Oh and in every country where I've had a cleaner I've just paid them cash. It's certainly not an Argentinian specialty.

 

[sergio]

I've had a cleaner in quite a few countries. Not because I need a cleaner (although of course it's nice) but because (as someone else mentioned) I see it as a good way to give someone a job. Presumably someone who needs it. I haven't been here long enough to really think about it but threads like this convince me that I won't be getting one here. Which means that someone misses out on a pretty cruise-y job. Oh and in every country where I've had a cleaner I've just paid them cash. It's certainly not an Argentinian specialty.

Argentina is a "special" country.