Learning Spanish

[rdcooper]

How much Spanish do you need to know to apply for citizenship? I've been learning for about a year and half using Rosetta Stone. I thought I was making progress, but I was watching Argentine travel videos on YouTube, and I can't understand what they're saying. The pronunciation of the words is different from what I'm learning. I picked up on one of the street names, but the word "calle" had a definite "sh" sound to it instead of a "y" sound that I'm learning, along with some other things.

 

[AdrianB]

Double L is sh in argentina, also sometimes Y is sh as well.

 

[MarshallE]

You don't need to know any Spanish at all to become a citizen, it's not a requirement anymore. There's also no constitution exam or anything like that.

 

[LuckyLuke]

What you are referring to is the Platense dialect spoken down here. There are videos explaining the differences. There's nothing inherently wrong with your Spanish lessons and I would recommend you continue taking them. Once you learn the dialect differences, you can practice by watching some Argentine TV and connecting with other Argentines in your local area or via internet.

 

[elflyingkiwi]

Luckily, there is no language requirement to become an Argentine citizen.

Argentine Spanish is very distinct from most other dialects of Spanish, for two main reasons:

1. The "sh" sound for the "ll" and "y", which is known as sheísmo (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Yeísmo). It can be hard to get used to, especially if you have been learning Mexican Spanish or a generic Latin American Spanish course on Rosetta Stone.
2. The use of "vos" as the second person singular, which is known as voseo (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Voseo). What makes it especially tough is that it's not just replacing "tú" with "vos" - "vos" has its own conjugation patterns. The patterns are mostly the same as the "tú" patterns, except in present tense. For example, for "hablar" you get:
- Tú hablas...
- Vos hablás...
For "seguir" you get:
- Tú sigues...
- Vos seguís...
Using "vos" affects all forms of the second person singular. For example, you would say "con vos" instead of "contigo" and "para vos" instead of "para ti". Happily, the reflexive form, as in "te hablo", is the same whether you're using "vos" or "tú".
3. Argentines love naming things differently to other Latin Americans. You'll notice this a lot of if you've been learning a generic Latin American-variant of Spanish. Some examples:
- "Pen" is (el) "bolígrafo" in Mexico but (la) "lapicera" in Argentina
- "Pool" is (la) "piscina" in Mexico but (la) "pileta" in Argentina
- "Avocado" is (el) "aguacate" in Mexico but (la) "palta" in Argentina

So, yeah... all in all, Argentine Spanish is probably a little bit different to what you're used to but you will get used to it ¯\_(ツ)_/¯

Edit: Almost forgot to mention, if you ever get to a point where you think you've mastered Mexican and Argentine Spanish, then head on over to Chile and be prepared to feel like you know nothing all over again !

 

[rdcooper]

Is the Spanish closer to Latin American Spanish or should I be learning European Spanish?

 

[FrankPintor]

Is the Spanish closer to Latin American Spanish or should I be learning European Spanish?

There is no Latin American Spanish. You'll just have to pick which dialect you like best and stick with it. If you want to live in Latin America, you should not be learning European Spanish, with its lisping and 2nd person plural, which have disappeared in the Americas.

@elflyingkiwi gave a good run down. For me, in reverse order of difficulty:

• Chileans barely speak Spanish (every 2nd word is "weon").
• Peruvians aren't much better, they're all into demonstrating their playfulness with language ("telo" for hotel, "una chiquita" for come here a moment), that is, when they're not trying to cheat you.
• Argentina we have from @elflyingkiwi's post, the voseo and yeismo are challenges. These apply to Rioplatense, there are other accents in the "interior" which are a bit more normal. Argentinians are not much appreciated in other parts of Latin America, that might be something to bear in mind.
• Uruguay - see Argentina.
• Venezuelan Spanish is fast, idiomatic, and it's all about joshing ("mosca por ahi" means be careful).
• Ecuador is fine, just a bunch of local idioms ("chiro" for broke, "chuchaqui" for hangover).
• Paraguayan Spanish is easy enough to understand, but, oh dear, that "R" will set you apart
• For me, the gold standard of Latin American Spanish is spoken in Colombia. Not any part of Colombia, don't try to adopt a Medellin / Paisa accent, unless you want to work in a call centre, and certainly not one from the coast. It's Bogota ("la nevera"): well spoken, not too idiomatic (though the "no des papaya" advice is famous), not too fast, not sing-song, no voseo, no yeismo, no 2nd person plural, just normal modern Latin American Spanish.

Find a decent language institute, hopefully with teachers from Bogota, and go with that. You will be understood everywhere. And you can add the local flourishes later.

 

[elflyingkiwi]

Which dialect you end up learning is probably going to come down to where you want to spend the majority of your time and who you're hanging out with. There's no right answer and no objectively "easier" dialect to learn than any other. As @FrankPintor pointed out, they all have their own little quirks. I would just pick one and stick with it. Once you have the language down fluently, you'll be able to understand other Spanish speakers, even if you didn't learn their particular dialect (though you may miss some things when they start using a lot of local slang).

It's the same in all languages really, even in English. Imagine a beginner English student doing a series of classes in America and then immediately going to Ireland to try and have a conversation with the locals - they too would struggle to understand what is being said.