No...no...no...this Can't Be Real...

Thank you for the honest explanation of Peronism.
The working class organised behind his leader, that probably like Mussolini, a charismatic relationship towards the masses.
Yeah, and I presume you know what the Italian workers did to their leader

So after Cordobazo, the militars had no choice and ask Peron to come back home to elections. It was that or the Socialist Revolution.
And wouldn't that have created even more social inclusion?
If not, why not?
 
When the first Peronismo began, it was deeply hatred by the right ("whos this guy taking away our privileges and giving them to the poor?") and by the left, because it was taking people away for the revolution, it was a competition for the left parties.

Peronist was at first almost exclusively a working class phenomena.

But later, in the 60s, after years of having the militars or democratic governments controlled by the militars, and Peronismo still forbidden, the left started to see this weird mass phenomena called Peronismo as a way to socialism. They started to symphatise, things were very clear, who was the victim, and the interests of that prohibition, it was also a huge generation fight, as we could see it everywhere world wide, the young liberals against the old conservative & repressive. It was Peronismo as a step to the revolution. And Peron wisely managed this situation from Madrid, not to differ from them, to include them to peronismo. Thats why we had the great argentine tragedy, the main cause of the last dictatorship, the left peronism and the right peronism competing, fighting, google "Ezeiza massacre".

The left, turned into Peronists, were clearly a majority, and were persecuted by Onganias dictatorship -nothing compared to Videla, after. Universities were intervened, long hair and beard prohibited, as well as miniskirt, the peronismo started to organise its resistance by the guerrillas. The guerrillas were a direct product of the prohibition of Peronism.

I dont think of the viability of socialism, although I believe in going in that direction. I mean, I dont think its sustainable the system itself, I think the market still has a great power in orientating peoples choices, decisions, etc, it orientates peoples lives, generaly speaking, its necessary. But I like governments to go in that direction cause it humanises and balances the worst things the market has. Social inclussion was one in the 40s with the post war of the central economies and the Keynesianism as its best (here called ISI: Industrialización por Sustitución de Importaciones) and quite another in the mid 70s, after the oil crisis, and the emergence of a new paradigm, the neoliberalism. In fact, that was sort of another cause of dictatorship, there were lots of peronists wishing the same societies of the 40s, industrial, jobs everywhere, almost no poverty, low inequality, social integration, socia incusion, etc, while the power, the military and economic power imposing by force another model.
 
What if your religion dictates that you can not shave the hairs off the side of your face? Did you go to prison?

In any case, I do get your point, the military where baddies who repressed the people's will: Peronism, which seems to have smartly coopted both some of the rich industrialists and 51% of the class self defined as "workers".

And I suppose the Peronists never had a chance, until now, to truly delevop the Third Position, aka Fascism, like the People's Action Party did in Singapore? I guess Peron was no Lee Kwan Yew...

Can you explain what's the project after Peron's death and the end of the cold war?

I might understand your point, after all it might explain what makes Argentina so "safe" as in stable, as in STAGNANT
 
Can you explain what's the project after Peron's death and the end of the cold war?


Because of the oil crisis in 1970 western countries, particularly the US and some rich european countries, saw theirselves with tons of money in their banks. So after 20 years of Keynesianism there was a redefinition of economics principles, like getting back together to Say's Law, or the fact that they needed to lend that money to make some profit, but nobody took it just like that: they needed friends dictators to lend they money, thats how the debt problem began in Latin America, and in other places too. It was totaly imposible for a country with that grade of politicization to multiply the debt for 6. So it was the end of an era in economics and the beggining of a new one. And a lot to do with this arising paradigm was the tumultuous 60s -not by accident we had all dictatorships world wide in the seventies, after the state of general protest of the sixties.

As I said before Peronismo is (sadly) the only national program of industrialisation, the only inclusive project of a Nation, of everyone with a job, with trully development of its forces. The other historical project, that oposes to Peronismo, is the "campo" project, a depressed economy with weak demand of their products so they can export, earn dollars instead of being obligated by the State to sell it in pesos. If theres a strong demand of food, the campo sell less outside, loses dollars. If you have a strong demand, the meat stays in the country and the farmers earn pesos, not dollars. So the farmers always want a depressed economy with low demand of their products. And Peronismo represents a growing internal market, a growing demand, a growing argentine salary, a dynamic economy, besides the confiscation of their production or highly taxing.

So there are this two projects. Three, actually, because the Radicalismo, UCR economically has very similar project to Peronismo. The problem of the farmer people is that they have too much power. They are the main source of dollars in the country. Our competitive sector, unike other countries in Latam, is not the industry, but the "campo". In fact, the industry depends on the dollars we get from the campo. It finances it.
One project goes for unemployment, exclude people from formal life, for poverty, for a banana republic. The other goes for industry, not big industry but PYMES, mainly textile, for consumption, for expanding the interna market, for big salaries. One has -historically- inflation. The other not. Because, as I said many times here and nobody hears me, we have a DEMAND inflation, thats the historical cause of inflation in this country: a strong demand that cannot be canalised with investment (bacause the upper classes are frightened and do not beieve in this country, with peronismo so near. So the supply always go behind the demand.

The dictatorship of course had a plan, an economic plan, and its transformations were structural. Last till today. A lot of reforms, measures taken while they governed remain till today, like the debt problem. They changed forever, and for worst, the Argentine productive structure. Apertura comercial, Reforma financiera, congelamiento de salarios, etc. They made it easy to financial capitals (which originated in the oil crisis as I said), and fractured in many parts the (political power of) the working class. While before dictatorship we had the agrarian and the big industrial capitals fighting and competing, with the dictatorship some sort of alliance came, and made it profitable for both, and while we had one strong national trade union federation and with a lot of power, at the exit of the dictatorsship it will divide and break into pieces: two CGT, the CTA, etc. It homogeinesed the top and fragmented the working class, that what dictatorship made with terror.
 
As I said before Peronismo is (sadly) the only national program of industrialisation, the only inclusive project of a Nation, of everyone with a job, with trully development of its forces.
Really? I thought the Socialists were very much in favor of industrialization and that they began their program before Peron had achieved his rank of faux-General. I suppose much like women's vote (achieved by Socialists in San Juan) it was also coopted by the Third Position.
I also believe that the term substitucion d'importaciones was invented under the Radical government of Yrigoyen, and that it was in fact the Radicals (Social Democrats?) the first victims of a military coup.
I understand you fancy Keynesianism, but notice that such a system requires aggressive expansionist policies to actually work. FDR (American Peron) used Keynesianism unsuccessfully until the only viable economic option was military expansion, or rather to bomb and loot Europe and Japan in ways previously thought unimaginably inhumane.
Without an aggressive Militaristic plan I don't see how Keynesianism can work. Other Fascist countries don't use it. Franco's Spain was not strictly Keynesian and Lee Kwan Yew's Singapore is super competitive.
 
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