Pessification of real estate?

[KarlaBA]

Thanks for pointing that out to me.
Obviously, there are more than nine ways to skin a cat.

Yes it seems that the seller and buyer can do the transaction in whatever currency or goods they so choose, as long as they write down a peso value on the transfer document. But, let's assume that you do the transaction in USD; how do you get the USD out of the country? Or into a bank account. Or into any place safe? It would seem pretty crazy to do a transaction in a currency that was highly valuable to others, but unable to be stored safely. The end results of these changes by CFK is to remove the use of USD from the economy altogether - so don't count on there being any mechanisms for you to side step the real estate law.

 

[sesamosinsal]

And for how long will people be able to pay for a property in dollars if the only way (essentially) to get dollars is by showing proof that you're travelling? Of course, you can try to agree to pay in dollars, but what happens when we get to the point of no one having them, and/or not wanting to spend them?

What a mess.

 

[solerboy]

I see a whole new industry of dollar rich people buying up cheap property from desperate sellers.

 

[allcraz]

Basically, if anyone can come to an agreement in dollars it's people that already have the dollars...maybe they sold another property or just took them out of the bank in the last few months or maybe they've been stuffed in a mattress somewhere or they exchanged them on the blue market, but there are still dollars to be had. As far as getting your dollars out of the country, in our case we're not leaving. We would be reinvesting in other property if we sold. But if we don't sell, we're very happy where we are. Whether we sell it next month or next year, it will still have been a good investment.

 

[dennisr]

Mortgages, are they fixed rate in Argentina? If they are, could be quite a deal with inflation at +25%. Naw, that would be too easy.

 

[Joe]

The pessification of real estate prices is not the issue.

The issue is currency control. If I can sell my house and then immediately convert that to dollars, or euros or pounds at a free market price and be able to wire that money to my bank account anywhere in the world without government restrictions then pessification makes no difference at all.

I mean this is the way it works in most countries after all.

 

[Joe]

Argentine Central Bank head says,

"Marcó del Pont also made it clear that housing is to now be purchased with prices in pesos and said "it's a step forward for the 'pesification' of the real estate market."

http://www.buenosairesherald.com/article/105453/marcó-del-pont-defends-new-dollar-restrictions

 

[Gringoboy]

The pessification of real estate prices is not the issue.

The issue is currency control. If I can sell my house and then immediately convert that to dollars, or euros or pounds at a free market price and be able to wire that money to my bank account anywhere in the world without government restrictions then pessification makes no difference at all.

I mean this is the way it works in most countries after all.

That's exactly the point Joe. In the scenario you paint, the pessification would make no difference, but then we can always dream.

 

[rhys]

My wife and I bought two places in BA about 8 years ago. We had always intended to move there because we liked the place so much (originally from NZ) but year by year it just got harder and harder. Inflation was higher than anything we had seen elsewhere (although perhaps normal for locals).

We had mortgage free properties in recolleta and palermo and after expenses, taxes etc etc they were barely covering their costs. Add to that increasing restrictions from the govt and it got harder and harder so we sold just over a year ago. It was tricky getting the money out then but my word it looks easy compared to what is going on now. Only just over a year ago and the currency was 3 to the US dollar and now I see on these posts it is 6 (is that really true?). That does not bode well.

We had always thought that Argentina was too special to continue acting like a child and would follow the example of Chile which has worked out that there is no short cut to getting wealthy. Steadily chipping away makes everyone better off (assuming the wealth isnt sucked away through corruption) but the Argentine govt would rather whine about las malvinas as if those misbegotten islands are the country's biggest issue, bonkers.

Probably over the long run property will be ok but that is not the point. People buy on the principle that the money they have bought into the country does not suddenly become the plaything of the govt. Being stuck holding, what for most is, their largest asset is not pleasant. Argentina needs to grow up and develop a middle class rather than have a country divided between a rich class terrified that the poor will try and take what they have and populist politicians who think the answer is to take from others. It is not a zero sum game

 

[PhilinBSAS]

Argentina needs to grow up and develop a middle class

Argentina had a relatively large middle class - the largest proportions in south America I have read. In complete contrast to Chile.

From what I understand it is a gross oversimplification but can be said it was during the Peronist periods of Government the middle classes took the biggest hits.

Less so during the Radicals. Unfortunately the periods of Military Dictatorship were worst for the urban working classes which firmly conditioned/associated in the collective psyche (that and other stuff) the notion that the Peronists were the party of the working classes protecting them against the military/oligarchy/rich = middle class. Or seen from the other social strata saving them from the Peronists

Those with salaried incomes and savings in bank accounts were worst hit during the periods of hyperinflation and then the corralito/collapse

Just how badly absolutely/relatively the shrinking middle class were hit at the turn of the millennia is reflected in this article from the Observer.

http://www.guardian.co.uk/world/2001/dec/23/argentina.sophiearie

This is all IMHO based on what i have read up until 2000 the first time I came here so anyone wants to challenge any of this then no problem. I've only offered up one piece of evidence but there is quite a lot of other material which can discuss if anyone at all interested in finding out more why Argentina is Argentina which I suggests includes the accelerating decline of the middle class and entrenched class polarisation.