Poorer than Haiti?

antipodean

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The issue is that the minimum salary buys things here but it buys nothing abroad. Part of that is the FX rate used, part of that is the difficult to buy dollars legally at the lower rate.
Meaning the value of the salary is smoke. People are trading smoke for smoke but at least they can more or less live/ survive off it, unlike in say Haiti. Great to trap people in their social caste, but impossible to get them out of it case in point Venezuela.
 

Rich One

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The issue is that the minimum salary buys things here but it buys nothing abroad. Part of that is the FX rate used, part of that is the difficult to buy dollars legally at the lower rate.
Meaning the value of the salary is smoke. People are trading smoke for smoke but at least they can more or less live/ survive off it, unlike in say Haiti. Great to trap people in their social caste, but impossible to get them out of it case in point Venezuela.
Very true case in point is Cuba where enginners live with US $60 ? or less per month. Guess life is cheaper there??
 

EL_TIGRE_de_Tigre

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Very true case in point is Cuba where enginners live with US $60 ? or less per month. Guess life is cheaper there??
Life is cheaper? You can only spend what you have.

Life is harder there? I would guess so.

There is all kinds of economic opportunity there? That's be a laughable assumption.

Warren Buffet put it best with his US Birthright & Citizenship comparison to winning the lottery. (You can search for it via GOOGLE, it shouldn't be too hard to find if inclined to familiarize yourself with his thoughts.) There are very few places in the world where the AVERAGE person or below average person, not to mention the EXCEPTIONAL person has a chance to realize their potential at a rate BEHIND that of the the typical US citizen!

Meaning, just about every place on this earth, if you are born there or are trapped there, you are sunk before you begin.

Yes, there are a few people here and there throughout the world who are exceptions to his general viewpoint. Even he acknowledges that. But on the whole, the majority of the earth's population is doomed to a life of economic inferiority. Much like the hunter gathers of the past. Only when agricultural enterprise and industrialized capacity was created did the average person have a fighting chance. And look at how well the shackles have been taken off of private industry in all places, like Argentina. Only when the federal government steps out of the way and the private sector is allowed to flourish will there ever be any meaningful change.
 

camberiu

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More data manipulation from a neoliberal think tank to create a ridiculous narrative. I guess they got bored with the "Argentina is the next Venezuela" line, now Argentina is Haiti.
I think we can all agree that Argentina is nowhere near the levels of poverty we see in Haiti. At the same time, I think the hard data shows that Argentina is nowhere near being significantly ahead of the other countries in the region in terms of development. In my lifetime (I am not that old), Argentina went from being "first world" when compared to its neighbours to "parity at best". Today the province of Cordoba is behind Bogota in terms of development. This fact alone was inconceivable 30 years ago. That is quite the fall that has been happening for generations.It is not due only because of specific policies from administration X or Y, but specially due to fundamental structural problems in the Argentine society. And until those issues are addressed (Which no administration from the Left or Right seems willing to do) the downward trend will continue and the floor might be something like Haiti. Hopefully I will not live long enough to see it get to that point. And this is not a "neo-liberal conspiracy claim".

Source
 
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EL_TIGRE_de_Tigre

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I think we can all agree that Argentina is nowhere near the levels of poverty we see in Haiti. At the same time, I think the hard data shows that Argentina is nowhere near being significantly ahead of the other countries in the region in terms of development. In my lifetime (I am not that old), Argentina went from being "first world" when compared to its neighbours to "parity at best". That is quite the fall. And this is not a "neo-liberal conspiracy claim".

Source
Argentina is not some bombed out, burned to the ground, busted country.

It is simply a shell of what it was and what it could be in this modern world. Frustrating? HECK YES! Because never has so much potential been thrown down the drain by elected officials who have a diamond in the rough to work with!
 

EL_TIGRE_de_Tigre

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Argentina is not some bombed out, burned to the ground, busted country.

It is simply a shell of what it was and what it could be in this modern world. Frustrating? HECK YES! Because never has so much potential been thrown down the drain by elected officials who have a diamond in the rough to work with!
Furthermore, the populace has entrusted (Through the democratic process at the ballot box ...) idiots, who are a continuation of previous idiots to drive the bus! And these drivers are being WRECKLESS with our bus!!!
 

camberiu

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Furthermore, the populace has entrusted (Through the democratic process at the ballot box ...) idiots, who are a continuation of previous idiots to drive the bus! And these drivers are being WRECKLESS with our bus!!!
The first step to getting out of the hole is to stop digging. The Argentine population have been unable to stop digging since the 1940s. It seems that the deeper the hole gets, the harder they dig.
 

Rich One

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Not really Argentina will never be like Haiti. I spent a week in Port Au Prince many years ago.. It was real voodoo..!
 

Renzi

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Very true case in point is Cuba where enginners live with US $60 ? or less per month. Guess life is cheaper there??
It's a paternal state, so basic necessities (as determined by the state) are taken care of (by the state) making less income necessary, in theory. Still, according to the lastest UN HDI report, Cuba ranks higher than all of South Americans outside of the cono sur. They're not doing too bad considering they no longer have the USSR to buy up all their reserves of sugar.
I think we can all agree that Argentina is nowhere near the levels of poverty we see in Haiti. At the same time, I think the hard data shows that Argentina is nowhere near being significantly ahead of the other countries in the region in terms of development. In my lifetime (I am not that old), Argentina went from being "first world" when compared to its neighbours to "parity at best". Today the province of Cordoba is behind Bogota in terms of development. This fact alone was inconceivable 30 years ago. That is quite the fall that has been happening for generations.It is not due only because of specific policies from administration X or Y, but specially due to fundamental structural problems in the Argentine society. And until those issues are addressed (Which no administration from the Left or Right seems willing to do) the downward trend will continue and the floor might be something like Haiti. Hopefully I will not live long enough to see it get to that point. And this is not a "neo-liberal conspiracy claim".

Source
There is definitely a discussion to be had about why things are a mess in Argentina, and have been for a very long time. But it can be had without resorting to hyperbole and false equivalencies like these think tanks tend to do, which are meant to scare the public into accepting solutions (more privatization, dollarization, etc.) that are sometimes worse than the problem. And there is no realistic scenario where the country with the third largest economy in Latin America will somehow reach the poverty level of the country with the poorest (China will turn all of this country into one giant pig farm before that happens). Argentina's current is GNI still around 22,060 USD, whereas Haiti's is 1,790.
 
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