Shock at the Supermarket

[arlean]

For Utopos -
I suspect that people dependent on Argentina pesos are hurting. That concerns me too. I'm probably a whole lot older than you but I made up my mind to be genuinely healthy and off medications. I don't mean just quit, I mean fix whatever was causing it.

Started when I was diagnosed with a tumor and they wanted to rush me to surgery. I had seen a doctor on TV who had had unsuccessful surgery for breast cancer. She changed her lifestyle and got well. So I contacted her. She is Dr. Loraine Day. I decided to try the same thing (at the time I was in the care of my brother because of extreme weakness). Four months later I was able to return to my home. Three years later the tumor was gone. Even my arthritis (diagnosed at age 33) cleared up and I don't hurt anywhere and need NO medications. 'Course it involves things most people won't do. Quit sugar and everything else refined and eat real food, mostly raw--among other things. And mostly vegetarian, though I am not sure a little meat now and then would hurt you. But I think cutting back animal products not only is healthier but less expensive. Does anyone disagree? I don't buy meat and cheese so I can't speak with authority. .

Antidepressants damage your immune system and make things worse. Not better. I know what I am saying is not mainstream opinion, but probably in 99% of cases it works. This is the only thing you wrote that I could address. My heart is so with the Argentina people who are hurt with all this. But I will spare you my opinions beyond that. Arlean

 

[fifs2]

Could you tell us how to deal with it too? I for one have never had to personally deal with the craziness that I see here on a daily basis.

I think expats can learn from that unsinkable Argentine resilience & entrepreneurship that has amazed me from day 1 with some of my own staff working an 8 hour day then heading of to Uni or a second job. One of our guys in 2002 decided he didnt want to pay 10 pesos for the lunch menu at our local restaurant in Constitucion, at the time..he offered to design their website for them if he could eat free for a year. He did both. They went out of business and he became the biggest stand-up producer in Bsas.
If easy credit were on offer here this would be a land of SMEs as there's so much creativity here as a result of people having to withstand crisis after enough.

 

[tez]

*yawn* Inflation?! In Argentina?? What an interesting subject, let's talk about that some more. And big stores that are more expensive and of lesser quality than in comparison to the US and/or Europe? Another thrilling topic.

I've never been one to say, "if you don't like it then leave," but really people! NONE of this is news, none of this should be a surprise to anyone. There are great things here in this country, but they are indisputably not the same great things that many of us have come to know and love in the US and Europe. It sounds like everyone on here has come to take all those great things in the US and Europe for granted, as if it is a basic human right to have a great selection of affordable cheeses.

It is a redundant statement, but it seems it must be said: when you are in Argentina, you are not in the US or Europe, and you're also not in Bolivia.

If you find something to be too expensive or outrageous: don't buy it. Find something else, you might surprise yourself and find something different that might not be the same, but that you like anyway! It's incredible this whole "living in a different country" thing, isn't it?

 

[ElQueso]

No offense intended, but the thread is specifically talking about inflation at the supermarket. That's one reason that thread titles exist - don't come into the thread and make supercillious comments if you're not interested in the topic.

And god forbid should we want to blow off some steam because maybe we are not people who see rosy images when watching the place we live get crappier everyday...

Some of us actually see what's going on and worry. And yes, some of us are leaving because of that.

Some of us have our permanent residency and are living here the same as Argentinos, and believe me dude, we earn our right to bitch and moan - JUST LIKE THE ARGENTINOS THEMSELVES DO. We ARE in Argentina, many of us are NOT neophytes, and there is nothing wrong with bitching and moaning about things that bother one unless one is someone who has his (or her) head in the clouds and can't stand to hear someone "malign" a false illusion.

 

[tez]

To ElQueso (and nicoenarg, since you liked his post)

Sorry, Dude, if I offended you. But my head isn't in the clouds. The only point I want to make is this is not the US, so why hold it to such a standard? This thread makes it sound as if people leave the US or Europe for whatever reason, only to come here and be surprised that things aren't exactly like they are in the US. It's the *surprise* that I was commenting against, not the bitching.

I think complaining is great, it is part of why things have steadily gotten better in the US, as far as consumer goods are concerned (in general)---when something isn't up to par, we complain about it and make sure we get something of value for our hard earned cash. Here, people just say, "que país de mierda!" and continue on their way, with the mediocre product in their bag, and some return to buy that same product over and over again, and thus things stay the same. Therefore: I am not against complaining. Complaining = good.

Now, back to my first original point: we aren't in North America, not even a northern hemisphere country, so it is of my opinion that we should not be shocked over things being different from those types of countries.

Point two: many, many people here have found great cheeses (since that seems to be important) that aren't incredibly expensive and even taste good. They're not going to be the same cheeses we find in the France or even the US, but they are good Argentine cheeses. It's not as easy as in the US (you can't get them from Coto), but they're available. My point: instead of being upset about what isn't the same as what you're used to, like cheddar, and take a look at what is different but good, like queso de campo from a small shop that specializes in cheeses and fiambres.

It's interesting how you claim your right to complain like the Argentines, which is precisely a style of complaining that in general doesn't bring about any change whatsoever, and subsequently brings about the need for a thread like this one... Maybe that's why you find a fit for yourself here? (assuming you do)

And I promise you, there's nothing spiteful or patronizing about my tone, however you might choose to interpret it.

 

[Utopos]

I mentioned the medication and the cheese only as a point of reference to inflation that I know first hand. The antidepressant comment was a joke... I, um... think.

To Arlean, I'm happy someone here thinks they are older than I am. I'm much closer to 80 than I am to 30. I think. My memory isn't what it used to be.

Speaking only for myself, anything I say here is merely an observation and never a complaint. Life anywhere is a compromise. Between intransigent pessimism and naive self-delusion is a middle ground. If is looks good, stay. If not, keep looking for that place you can call home.

I'm home.

 

[ElQueso]

Tez, I didn't take offense, I just get annoyed with people who come in and try to tell me, who has lived here for 6 years, that I need to just shut up and enjoy living in a different country. Particularly in a thread whose subject is specifically about things that concern everyday living here.

I have lived all over the world for varying periods of time. This is the longest I've lived in any one country outside the US. I've watched this country go from a place where although difficult to do business, at least manageable, to a place where foreign investors are running at full speed and foreign companies are leaving. I've watched the government make stupid decisions that affect everyone, expats AND Argentinos included.

I've watched crime rise. I've watched everyone of my family and friends get robbed in the last couple of years in situations that hadn't been very common previously.

I've gone from being able to buy groceries that once cost me 100 pesos to the same groceries (when they can be found) costing me 400+ pesos.

You may need to start policing Argentinos comments as well - there are plenty of local forums where Argentinos are complaining about the same thing. ALL of the Argentinos I know are sick of their government and the crap that it rains down on them on a daily basis. And they feel even more displaced than us expats do because it is actually THEIR country. And their vote doesn't make one whit of a difference because the government here has bought the vote of the poor people, who outnumber middle class and rich by a large margin.

I have a young lady in high school here. I hire Argentine programmers. I have a family and am concerned for our well-being. I live within the society, having not only expat friends, but also Argentine friends. I've earned the right to be a bit concerned about what's going on and to voice it in an open forum where others are talking about it as well.

I don't know how long you've lived here. It's all relative anyway. If you feel the need to make comments that seem to denigrate the rest of us who have valid concerns, down-right worries, based on the fact that we live here and are impacted on a daily basis because the economy here is collapsing, of course more power to you - the government here obviously doesn't believe in free speech, but most of us foreigners do.

But I will take umbrage at someone that tells me that I'm being boring because I'm talking about something that interests me and obviously doesn't interest you

 

[ElQueso]

BTW - I forgot to add about your comment mentioning that maybe I fit in because I voice my complaints on a forum and not in person, just like an Argentino.

I can assure you that you do not know me or you would have not made that suggestion. In point of fact, my family members hate going places with me due to their "verguenza" when I start complaining about something that I'm receiving. I don't take getting cheated (in a soft manner with bad service or in a downright obvious manner when someone tries to take dvantage of me) kindly and I express myself. Often to the manager of the establishment.

I complain in the best manner that I can manage, but the very fact that I bring the shortcomings of an operation to the attention of those responsible is more than many Latinos can handle.

So tell me - with your comment, do you mean that I shouldn't even be complaining to those who are responsible, because I am an expat and should be enjoying life here? Or that I should be like every other Argentino and keep it bottled up inside me until I explode with the rest fo them?

Unfortunately, I'm not a citizen, so I can't voice my complaints directly to the government...not that it would do any good anyway. Not that my other complaints do any good either, but that's the way I am.

 

[LostinBA]

Soy and other export commidities that bring in USD to the government reserves (which USD they use to prop up the peso) are down. Energy imports which drain government USD reserves are up (ergo the YPF hijinks). The current CFK government mistakenly believes a strong AR peso is good, thinking that is perhaps persuaded in the same way GW Bush believed it was necessary to invade Iraq after 911 - to double down on his father's approach without regard to current conditions. With CFK, it's her husband.
To continue to prop up the AR peso, the AR admin needs to acquire USD reserves and to do that it must eliminate imports which drain USD reserves. Ergo, all imports, food and non-food, have been taxed heavily to the point where the EEC, EEUU, Japan, 40 other WTO countries, and several neighboring Mercosur countries have formally complained about unfair import duties and procedures.
Elimination of competitive imports drives up domestic prices which fuels inflation which in turn drives up prices... until at some point the bubble bursts much like the midnight hour in Cinderella where horses turn back into mice.
CFK will turn into KFC, Anses will be unable to pay pensioners, the USD will fetch 8 pesos and life for us expats will return to normal. The locals, however, will suffer while KFC takes young lovers in Ibizia.

She takes young lovers to Ibiza? Where do I sign up?! Wait a sec...

 

[YanquiGallego]

I agree, sharing feedback and complaining are what keeps us sane and often times it's nice to know other people feel the same and are dealing with the same scenarios. I wasnt posting my expensive experience at the super to bore anyone, I was just THAT bewildered by the astronomical prices that it did compel me to share the experience.

In most societies and businesses, the act of interchanging feedback, be it good or bad, is welcome because it helps to grow or improve, companies in the US have those annoying comment cards all over the place and beg for it, here it´s seen as a personal attack should you voice something that's not right, with usually ¨go back to where you are from¨ being chorused into the general overture at some point.