World media in overdrive on Argentina

[TheDonald]

I have spoken to the best lawyers in Argentina about this and they all said that Argentinas natural resources and assets include territory are vulnerable to this new decreto . Bajo cero can maybe enlighten us ?

I did some research and the sources you rely upon are not providing accurate information. The Articulos you provide and the related provisions address Argentine assets outside the sovereign territory - think apartments, planes, bank accounts. This is common security for sovereign debt. This is why Elliot almost seized the Argentine jet when CFK initiated the default. It is also why Elliot almost seized the Argentine ship in Ghana. Argentine assets outside sovereign territory were pledged to lenders, in the event of default. Interestingly, embassies are considered a legally separate class and are not subject to seizure of any type.

Argentine bonds are trading in the mid-40s not because that is what creditors value land or assets collaterlizing the debt. They are valued in mid-40s because that is the calculation investors are making based on Argentina's willingness to pay and its ability to pay. Markets are forward looking. Investors have attached an almost 100% probability that 2F will assume power in Dec 2019. From there, investors are calculating Argentina's sources of funds compared with debt maturities, plus the relative strength of the parties in restructuring negotiations.

As Argentina has proven, no sovereign can stay in default forever. Either a pragmatic politician replaces a common thief (as happened in Argentina). Or the pain of being unable to borrow in financial markets gets too great. One of those forces breaks, and hence debt is restructured.

I stand by my earlier statement: there is no chance that creditors will use the legal process to seize Argentine sovereign territory. Sleep easy, amigo.

 

[elhombresinnombre]

I have spoken to the best lawyers in Argentina about this.....

C'mon now: if they really are the best lawyers in Argentina then the first question they will have asked you is "What would you like the answer to be?"

 

[perry]

I did some research and the sources you rely upon are not providing accurate information. The Articulos you provide and the related provisions address Argentine assets outside the sovereign territory - think apartments, planes, bank accounts. This is common security for sovereign debt. This is why Elliot almost seized the Argentine jet when CFK initiated the default. It is also why Elliot almost seized the Argentine ship in Ghana. Argentine assets outside sovereign territory were pledged to lenders, in the event of default. Interestingly, embassies are considered a legally separate class and are not subject to seizure of any type.

Argentine bonds are trading in the mid-40s not because that is what creditors value land or assets collaterlizing the debt. They are valued in mid-40s because that is the calculation investors are making based on Argentina's willingness to pay and its ability to pay. Markets are forward looking. Investors have attached an almost 100% probability that 2F will assume power in Dec 2019. From there, investors are calculating Argentina's sources of funds compared with debt maturities, plus the relative strength of the parties in restructuring negotiations.

As Argentina has proven, no sovereign can stay in default forever. Either a pragmatic politician replaces a common thief (as happened in Argentina). Or the pain of being unable to borrow in financial markets gets too great. One of those forces breaks, and hence debt is restructured.

I stand by my earlier statement: there is no chance that creditors will use the legal process to seize Argentine sovereign territory. Sleep easy, amigo.

I did some research and the sources you rely upon are not providing accurate information. The Articulos you provide and the related provisions address Argentine assets outside the sovereign territory - think apartments, planes, bank accounts. This is common security for sovereign debt. This is why Elliot almost seized the Argentine jet when CFK initiated the default. It is also why Elliot almost seized the Argentine ship in Ghana. Argentine assets outside sovereign territory were pledged to lenders, in the event of default. Interestingly, embassies are considered a legally separate class and are not subject to seizure of any type.

Argentine bonds are trading in the mid-40s not because that is what creditors value land or assets collaterlizing the debt. They are valued in mid-40s because that is the calculation investors are making based on Argentina's willingness to pay and its ability to pay. Markets are forward looking. Investors have attached an almost 100% probability that 2F will assume power in Dec 2019. From there, investors are calculating Argentina's sources of funds compared with debt maturities, plus the relative strength of the parties in restructuring negotiations.

As Argentina has proven, no sovereign can stay in default forever. Either a pragmatic politician replaces a common thief (as happened in Argentina). Or the pain of being unable to borrow in financial markets gets too great. One of those forces breaks, and hence debt is restructured.

I stand by my earlier statement: there is no chance that creditors will use the legal process to seize Argentine sovereign territory. Sleep easy, amigo.

Cuando en Francia se debatió el canje de la Patagonia por deuda pública

Por Gonzalo Carranza El 5 de Marzo del 2003 diarios franceses debatieron sobre la cesión de tierras argentinas por canje de deuda. El diario “Liberation

argentinatoday.org

Donald I have attached a link that details clearly the Patagonia question. Please read in full amigo .

In 2001 in the last crisis this option was discussed to deliver Patagonia to pay the external debt. There were many articles on this in the media at the time. Now with the change of laws this posibilility is not out of the question . There is tremendous interest in this land . Patagonia has been deliberately undeveloped and most of its resources untapped. Is this a coincidence is a question that we must answer .


Life has taught me that everything is possible as much as It seems unlikely and most older people have seen changes in their lives that would have seen infathomable in their youth. For this reason its important to keep a open mind .

 

[earlyretirement]

Perry,

Argentina does NOT need the world media to "lead it to economic ruin". They can do that well all on their own! Argentina is a disaster and always will be long term. There is no solving all of the problems they have. It doesn't matter who is the President. You just can't fix a broken system without totally changing the system and no one is willing to do that and never will.

 

[toongeorges]

The market estimates the probability of a default to be 91,78÷

Argentina Government Bonds - Yields Curve

Argentina Government Bonds and Yields Curve. Updated charts and tables, agencies ratings, spread comparisons, current prices.

www.worldgovernmentbonds.com

I sent my Argentine girlfriend a link to a news article yesterday that talked about the capital controls being back. The online page to make international transfers from her bank is suddenly unavailable saying "estamos trabajando para mejorar las Transferencias al Exterior". Luckily she transferred all her dollars out of the country in time.

The crash is unfolding

 

[TheDonald]

Perry,

 

[TheDonald]

[/QUOTE

]Argentines did not understand the extent to which this economy is subject to the whims of international financial markets. Many still do not. The amount of money that financiers move in and out of Argentine bonds, Argentine currency and other Argentine assets overwhelms anything that the Argentine government or the IMF can muster. It's like a rowboat paddling against a tidal wave. The prices of most Argentine assets will be dictated by international sentiment towards Argentina. When that sentiment stabilizes, then Argentine asset prices will stabilize.

 

[retiredbanker]

You are very wrong Argentina is of great interest to the élite due to having the most important natural resources on the planet. Patagonia is the jewel in the crown and could be taken away from us for payment of the external debt. Read up on it and inform yourself

Wrong! Fact checking would prove an embarrassment for you.

 

[perry]

Wrong! Fact checking would prove an embarrassment for you.

Cuando en Francia se debatió el canje de la Patagonia por deuda pública

Por Gonzalo Carranza El 5 de Marzo del 2003 diarios franceses debatieron sobre la cesión de tierras argentinas por canje de deuda. El diario “Liberation

argentinatoday.org

Have you bothered to read the link or you do not understand spanish ?

 

[camel]

Wrong! Fact checking would prove an embarrassment for you.

A suggestion. When you claim that a statement someone has written is false, it helps everyone if you state how it is false, and what you believe to be true. Like remember in elementary school when we had a "true or false" test, and the instructions said "if it's false, say what would make the statement true".

I'm interested in the whole Patagonia thing, so citing sources is much appreciated.