About the Tractorazo

[Redpossum]

tell me you don't know anything about farming without telling me you don't know anything about farming

This, exactly. And the truly alarming part is that people with equally limited understanding make government policy directly affecting agriculture. I choose the word "agriculture" because it's about ranching as much as farming, or more so.

Full disclosure - I grew up in a semi-rural area, and was an Ag student in high school. I can't pretend to be neutral, but I do have some understanding of just how challenging a rural lifestyle is, no matter how "wealthy" one may be in theory.

 

[antipodean]

The owner of a $2.25 million dollar asset could sell even a tenth of it and live in luxury off the money for 10 years in this country. If they weren't making enough money to maintain their lifestyles off it, they would sell it. The fact that they don't says it all. They have everything but want even more.

How does that math work exactly?

And after a generation, how much farm would be left to farm? The aim is the efficiency of the old Soviet strip-farm model...?

And more importantly what do you do when there are no buyers lining up to buy (knowing that not only would they need the specific knowledge and skills to actually manage and work the farm, they would also need to pump in millions of Their own initial capital - as they certainly can’t borrow it - for the land, equipment, labour, raw materials and getting their goods to market only to face the exact same problems as their predecessor? Sell it to a Chinese pig farming conglomerate and condemn the surrounding environment to going from bad to worse?)

Your assumption that all farmers have everything is little more than a classist stereotype or propaganda. Do a trip to the campos around the country. You’ll see as many, if not more, shitty old run down estancias as nicer ones.

 

[Redpossum]

https://www.reddit.com/r/argentina/comments/uccttb

 

[Cordoba]

They cash at usd at official rate minus 33% but they have the benefit of importing goods at official rate and deduct 56% tax. It is normally planted with subsidized credits from the State, they pay (very low) salaries in pesos, most of the machinery is produced in Argentina (https://cyt-ar.com.ar/cyt-ar/index.php/Industria_argentina_de_maquinarias_agrícolas) so they have 56% cash back in taxes, they do not pay royalties because the most used seeds that are resistant to warmer/dryer weather and to glifosato/weeds/diseases were developed by the INTA for free (an State research institute ) & they are royalties free (this is how the production of soy grew 100%) and most of them bought the field paid in 30 years with less than 5% interest with Peron.

Can you explain the mechanism/ability to import at the official rate and deduct 56% tax?

I always hear them complaining about cashing out at the official and export tariffs but didn't realize there is a benefit on the other end. Maybe I shouldn't be so sympathetic.

 

[ventanilla]

How does that math work exactly?

And after a generation, how much farm would be left to farm? The aim is the efficiency of the old Soviet strip-farm model...?

And more importantly what do you do when there are no buyers lining up to buy (knowing that not only would they need the specific knowledge and skills to actually manage and work the farm, they would also need to pump in millions of Their own initial capital - as they certainly can’t borrow it - for the land, equipment, labour, raw materials and getting their goods to market only to face the exact same problems as their predecessor? Sell it to a Chinese pig farming conglomerate and condemn the surrounding environment to going from bad to worse?)

Your assumption that all farmers have everything is little more than a classist stereotype or propaganda. Do a trip to the campos around the country. You’ll see as many, if not more, shitty old run down estancias as nicer ones.

It's genuinely funny to see Americans trying to frame people who are worth millions in a country where most people earn $300 a month as not incredibly rich. Their consumerist, McDonalds lifestyle has convinced them that being able to buy literally anything you want and live in luxury is actually oppression.

 

[antipodean]

It's genuinely funny to see Americans trying to frame people who are worth millions in a country where most people earn $300 a month as not incredibly rich. Their consumerist, McDonalds lifestyle has convinced them that being able to buy literally anything you want and live in luxury is actually oppression.

I’m not American.
I don’t eat McDonalds.
But I am actually integrated into Argentine society and the Argentine economy as a small business owner (that voluntarily practices and externally audited as meeting the highest standards of environmental and social responsibility in terms of impact generated) that deals with a lot of real people, businesses and sectors all around the country - so I guess I do have a pretty real perspective on rich Argentines, not so rich Argentines and definitely not rich Argentines based on reality. Something beyond many “freelancers” here who are ultimately looking from the outside in and taking things at face value and signing up to politics as if they were signing up to a football team.

 

[BeraRane]

"How to Lose Friends and Alienate People"

 

[Redpossum]

/me wonders how this thread that he started over a month ago, and that lay dormant four weeks, suddenly blew up into this level of bronca

 

[sts7049]

It's genuinely funny to see Americans trying to frame people who are worth millions in a country where most people earn $300 a month as not incredibly rich. Their consumerist, McDonalds lifestyle has convinced them that being able to buy literally anything you want and live in luxury is actually oppression.

i bet you thought this was a great counterpoint in your head. hint: it wasn't

 

[Alby]

...and signing up to politics as if they were signing up to a football team.

It’s hard to disagree with this. I know where I stand along the theoretical political spectrum but I make a point of not buying into the way the struggle between left and right plays out here in Argentina. That would be as preposterous as an Argentine plonking him or herself in my country and picking a side as if he or she were steeped in the entire history of the struggle as it has played out there.

I have noticed that my Peronist and K friends and acquaintances make no bones about their beliefs and affiliations and just seem to automatically presume I am along for the ride. I do nothing to encourage or discourage that. It’s not my fight. By contrast, those on the other side of the grieta who have revealed their views have only taken me into that confidence after we’ve known each other for some time, and even then only rather gingerly, in hushed tones, as if they were revealing a horrible secret that they were almost scared to tell. I find the contrast fascinating. Again, I just listen to what they’ve got to say and take it on board. And then play Switzerland.

There is plenty to learn from both sides. I've lived here for four years and been visiting for 34. One day I might buy into their disputes.