COVID: Argentina in sixth place

Zepher

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I am not sure the poster was going for the kind of sentiment you are sensing??? (You may be jumping the gun???)

Although I can't speak for the poster, I can speak for what I thought was meant by the poster:

Given that there are now 7BIL + humans on the planet, it seems that the quality of our species, is not what it once was. As in ... people just don't act, behave and think like they used to in the past. Consideration has been replaced by greed, courtesy by gluttony etc ...The past always seems like it was better times. That may or may not be true, but that is the popular perception.
No one ever says there ore too many fish or sand fleas... Most of the population of Argentina is in BA with vast swaths of fertile land for thousands of miles. You know how many Buenos Aires' that could be built? It's not a zero sum game and realize the "climate change" endgame is depopulation.... very sad how we have such a dim view of humanity. If Governments would get out of the way we could get back to work.... Govt-19 has been used by the public sector to muzzle the private sector and maybe a dry run for something more sinister. Remember Zika? Billions were allocated for Zika but no one remembers or cares one year later. Beware the Medical Industrial complex run by centralized government agencies. --> Peace
 

Ries

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I was just looking at Washington State numbers (where I am until Argentina will let me back in).
And they kind of confuse me.

Your link says- Argentina- 931,000 cases, 25,000 deaths plus or minus. total population 45 million. That means deaths per number of cases is 2.6% and the number of deaths per total population is 55 per 100,000
Washington State- 100,000 cases, 2300 deaths. total population 7 million That means deaths per number of cases is 2.3% and number of deaths per total population is about 30 per 100,000.

Washington State is definitely one of the better managed States, but we still got hit heavy and hard early on. And our numbers, while better than Argentina, are not better by an order of magnitude, but merely a bit better.

There are certainly individual States in the USA that are much worse, and I would not doubt that there are some that are worse than Argentina. current US are rapidly rising, and while not as bad as april, are still, in many places, scarily higher than Buenos Aires. So the idea that Argentina is some kind of mismanaged hellhole at the bottom of the list just doesnt ring true to me. Today, numbers are jumping in Poland and the Czech republic, for example, places that may pass argentina soon.

Basically, I dont think Argentina has done that bad a job. The US, on the other hand, has totally mismanaged every aspect.
 

antipodean

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I was just looking at Washington State numbers (where I am until Argentina will let me back in).
And they kind of confuse me.

Your link says- Argentina- 931,000 cases, 25,000 deaths plus or minus. total population 45 million. That means deaths per number of cases is 2.6% and the number of deaths per total population is 55 per 100,000
Washington State- 100,000 cases, 2300 deaths. total population 7 million That means deaths per number of cases is 2.3% and number of deaths per total population is about 30 per 100,000.

Washington State is definitely one of the better managed States, but we still got hit heavy and hard early on. And our numbers, while better than Argentina, are not better by an order of magnitude, but merely a bit better.

There are certainly individual States in the USA that are much worse, and I would not doubt that there are some that are worse than Argentina. current US are rapidly rising, and while not as bad as april, are still, in many places, scarily higher than Buenos Aires. So the idea that Argentina is some kind of mismanaged hellhole at the bottom of the list just doesnt ring true to me. Today, numbers are jumping in Poland and the Czech republic, for example, places that may pass argentina soon.

Basically, I dont think Argentina has done that bad a job. The US, on the other hand, has totally mismanaged every aspect.
Time scale. Cases / deaths only took off recently compared the US or other Latin American or European counties meaning Argentina is still many months behind. The key to look at is cases and deaths in last 14 days (or looking just at past two months or so) as a sustained trend since it is extremely high and has eclipsed those of even Brazil in terms of peaks. Even if CABA/ AMBA is coming down for the first time after almost six months, the rest of the country has only started going up in the past month. It will be a long road ahead and for sure and will complicate CABA and other “stable” regions come next winter since we have created an uneven cycle.
 

gracielle

Registered
So the idea that Argentina is some kind of mismanaged hellhole at the bottom of the list just doesnt ring true to me.
I disagree.
Today, numbers are jumping in Poland and the Czech republic, for example, places that may pass argentina soon.
That is a moot point until if and when that happens.
Basically, I dont think Argentina has done that bad a job.
I don't believe in the veracity of the "official" numbers reported so far by the ARG govt.
The US, on the other hand, has totally mismanaged every aspect.
I agree in principle. Yet can only attest to the handling of the pandemic in California where I reside part of the year.
 

Ries

Registered
Time scale. Cases / deaths only took off recently compared the US or other Latin American or European counties meaning Argentina is still many months behind. The key to look at is cases and deaths in last 14 days (or looking just at past two months or so) as a sustained trend since it is extremely high and has eclipsed those of even Brazil in terms of peaks. Even if CABA/ AMBA is coming down for the first time after almost six months, the rest of the country has only started going up in the past month. It will be a long road ahead and for sure and will complicate CABA and other “stable” regions come next winter since we have created an uneven cycle.
Washington State, along with many US states, is seeing a very similar recent increase in cases- because people are getting cavalier about masks and social distancing. Same thing with places in europe, and other states in the US. I think the key thing to look at will be totals for the entire year, as rural vs urban outbreaks have followed similar patterns, at different times, globally, so unless you look at a longer time period, you see local spikes which fall into a global pattern with time.

But my bottom line is- Who the Hell knows?

Especially in the richest country in the world, we have virutally no gathering of overall, similar numbers from all areas. Reporting, testing, treatment, and classification varies so much from location to location, nationally or globally, that comparisons are usually quite incomplete.

I certainly dont believe in the overall veracity of US federal numbers, and many state numbers, as they are being fiddled for political reasons, usually downward, ignoring many cases.

But as someone who is living in the USA right now, I can tell you that government coordination here, beyond a very local level, is just as bad, if not worse, than in Argentina.
 

antipodean

Registered

If we can’t count cases, we can count deaths.
Argentina now has the most COVID deaths per million in the past week. Since the amount of deaths reported daily is not decreasing it is a pretty alarming trend and almost double that of elsewhere. However, it is a snapshot of the the past weeks and if it does decelerate quickly or another country accelerates quickly will change the ranking.

My fear is that in the interior, places like Santa Cruz, the health system has already collapsed or close to it and we will see a disproportionate death toll in comparison to AMBA in the long run... despite 6+ months to get those health care facilities up to the task.

In terms of real impact, I have lost count of the number of Argentines I know who have had it or had someone in their family with It - so it is definitely something “felt” by almost everyone by now. There was a statement by the ex health minister about the lack of testing here suggesting that by now Argentina is likely to have had over 8 million infections, out of 45 million people. Heard immunity here we come?
 
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antipodean

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But as someone who is living in the USA right now, I can tell you that government coordination here, beyond a very local level, is just as bad, if not worse, than in Argentina.
The difference is that in the US the central government did little to try and stop it. Here in Argentina the government did try in the strongest yet most ineffective terms, and at an enormous economic and social cost, while filling us with propaganda that Argentina is/ was doing the best job in the world of taking care of COVID. Also Argentina only has 45m people.
 
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