Documents For Citizenship - Questions About Apostilles

[lucha54]

Hey all,
So I know that I need to get my certified birth certificate and I need to send it myself from within the US to get apostilled (I'm going anyway, otherwise I'd do it here but would need a notary for the appostille part ; so they told me at the office of the city where I was born).

Next for the FBI clearance, which I just found out ALSO need to be apostilled... but I don't think I need the notary for that apostille, that's why I wanted to double check with anyone who has done it.

Because I'm going back to the states, I realize i need to send it closer to the end of my visit... and that it would be voided if I sent it in now and then went to the states and if they had the clearance back to me while I'm still there. Correct?

But if I need to get it apostilled and only I can do that, shouldn't I do it from within the states? (but then it's invalidated since I'll still be there!)

Or is it just the birth certificate that only the actual person needs to submit it to get it apostilled, and for the FBI forms, anyone can send it in to get apostilled, no need to get the notary if I do it from here after I get back?

Sorry I know I haven't worded this very well but it sends my head spinning just thinking about it!

 

[Crema Americana]

I was lucky in that my parents helped me with it. I sent off the FBI fingerprints while I was there, and I left an addressed envelope with payment so that they could then send the background check to the State Department for the apostille. Then they sent everything down to me.

I didn't need a notary for anything. I'm sure it varies by state, but for my birth certificate I did the same thing. Filled out the forms and addressed the envelopes. (I did need to include a photocopy of my ID and a cover letter.)

Do you have someone in the US that can receive your mail and send it off for apostille and then back to you? That would be the easier way.

A tip: When you request the apostilles, include a post-it note on top of the forms saying something like "Apostille Needed for Argentina Residency." It helps ensure they send the proper form.

 

[steveinbsas]

So I know that I need to get my certified birth certificate and I need to send it myself from within the US to get apostilled (I'm going anyway, otherwise I'd do it here but would need a notary for the appostille part ; so they told me at the office of the city where I was born).

If you are applying for residency (not citizenship) you don't need a copy of your birth certificate. You can go to the migraciones website and see that it is not on the list of required documents.

http://www.migracion...osur_temporaria

Notaries do not have the power to perform the Apostille. Any signed document can be notarized and the notary only verifies the signature. Secretaries of State perform the Apostille. Some states offer certified copies of the birth certificate on line and also offer the Apostille service before mailing the document. It's not surprising that you were misinformed about the Apostille in the (US) city where you were born.

Next for the FBI clearance, which I just found out ALSO need to be apostilled... but I don't think I need the notary for that apostille, that's why I wanted to double check with anyone who has done it.

Correct, you don't need the notary for the Apostille because they cannot do it. An FBI report (to be used to apply for residency in Argentina) must be certified by the US State Department. That information is available on line and in other threads of this forum (search "FBI report").

Because I'm going back to the states, I realize i need to send it closer to the end of my visit... and that it would be voided if I sent it in now and then went to the states and if they had the clearance back to me while I'm still there. Correct?

Are you referring to sending your fingerprints to the FBI closer to the end of your present visit in Argentina? IF the report is issued (dated) while you are in Argentina and you return to the US after that, migraciones will not accept it.

But if I need to get it apostilled and only I can do that, shouldn't I do it from within the states? (but then it's invalidated since I'll still be there!)

You can receive the FBI report while you are in the USA and that's good because I believe that the report can only be mailed to a US address. You should request the State Department certification when you send your fingerprints. I also believe there is a "window" of time (60 days?) in which you can be in the US before returning to Argentina with the report and it will remain valid.

Or is it just the birth certificate that only the actual person needs to submit it to get it apostilled, and for the FBI forms, anyone can send it in to get apostilled, no need to get the notary if I do it from here after I get back?

As I noted earlier, you do not need the birth certificate when applying for residency. You cannot have any document from the USA receive the Apostille in Argentina, and, as I also noted earlier, notaries do not perform the Apostille.

You will, however, need to have the FBI report translated by a certified translator and then legalized in Argentina before you submit it to migraciones....if you are actually applying for residency and not citizenship.

Sorry I know I haven't worded this very well but it sends my head spinning just thinking about it!

Hopefully, this information will reduce the RPMs. If anyone else can add to and/or correct anything I've written here I hope they will do so.

PS: If you are applying for citizenship (as indicated by the title of this thread), it would be advisable to go to the federal court which has jurisdiction where you live in Argentina and ask for a list of the documents that they require. Apparently, it can vary from court to court. I believe that most of them do ask for the birth certificate. If you do not already have residency and a DNI you will probably also need a lawyer to help you through the process.

 

[GMXam]

I sent my Certified copy of my birth certificate to the state office in the state I was born...no notary was required by then since it was a state document, but that may be a state-specific policy.

My FBI report, I had it sent to my son in the states, gave him instructions to send to the State Department in DC for apostille and sent back to his address where he had it sent to me in Argentina via UPS, no notary needed.

What I did need notarized were documents that weren't certified or issued by a state office with a state seal from which they were created/issued (ie divorce decree, court documents necessary for my case, etc).

 

[lucha54]

Thanks Steve and Crema Americana... let me clarify.

I am applying for citizenship with the help of a lawyer. I am currently I am in Buenos Aires.
In 2 weeks, I will travel to the US, for a duration of 2.5 weeks. Because I decided to start the process so close in time to my trip, it wasn't worth it to get the birth cert. ordered from here, then would have to get sent for apostille (and the application for the apostille needing to be notarized if you're not applying for apostille in person - that's what the office of records of my birth city/county told me). Would have taken as long as going to the states and back and I already had the trip planned.

So I'll get the certified birth certificate (one day turn-around if I do it in person) and that I then need to send it to Sec of State to get apostilled.

I was at the lawyer's office doing the finger prints, which they were going to send directly to a channeler... then I said no wait, I am going to be in the states so let's not let a fresh FBI clearance get invalidated because I'll be visiting home; I will send it from the states as soon as I arrive.

BUT can I send it out when I arrive and receive it before I leave or does it HAVE to be received by my mailbox after I've physically left the US, otherwise would be voided? I know this has been discussed but I'm confused as to whether I can receive it on my last few days in the states and send it off from there for apostille, or just me being there to receive it would invalidate it.

THEN, and here is where my original question/confusion came in, the lawyer said that the FBI clearance form must be apostilled as well! But sent to where to get apostilled? The sec. of state where I was born and will be sending my birth cert for the apostille? The sec. of state where my new address is? (a different state)

And to send the FBI clearance to get apostilled, the lawyer's assistant said that anyone can do it, I don't need to get anything notarized like I would have had to do for the apostilled birth cert. if I were sending the application for that from here in BA.

And to answer your questions Crema Americana, unfortunately I don't have anyone to send it to get apostilled from within the states, but I do have a mailing service and I think they will do it for me but I'll have double check with them....

Steve, sorry i was not more clear and you ended up answering questions with the presumption that this was for residency... so when you said "migraciones will not accept it" that doesn't apply.

 

[lucha54]

I sent my Certified copy of my birth certificate to the state office in the state I was born...no notary was required by then since it was a state document, but that may be a state-specific policy.

My FBI report, I had it sent to my son in the states, gave him instructions to send to the State Department in DC for apostille and sent back to his address where he had it sent to me in Argentina via UPS, no notary needed.

What I did need notarized were documents that weren't certified or issued by a state office with a state seal from which they were created/issued (ie divorce decree, court documents necessary for my case, etc).

Hi GXMam sorry I wrote my reply before reloading the page and didn't see this.. Thanks for your feedback. I certainly hope my trusty mail service can take on the errand of mailing it out for me to the State Dept in DC. Thanks for clearing that up!

 

[GMXam]

Their channeler may be quicker...I'd use then in the US to get the report. My bf said the FBI website was estimating 90 days turnaround for requests sent directly to FBI as they are implementing a new system. That's what I'm doing when I get there. Then sending to apostille when I get it.

 

[Crema Americana]

The FBI report and the birth certificate are completely separate - the birth certificate is from your State (and each state does it differently, and apostilles their own documents at the State's Department of State) and the FBI report is Federal and must be apostilled by the Federal Department of State in Washington DC.


The FBI background check you request from the FBI and then must send it off to the US Department of State Office of Authentications. It seems all my old links are broken and they've changed the address from when I did it last year.

http://travel.state....ntications.html
http://travel.state....vices.html#Mail
In short, you fill out the form DS-4194 (remember to say it's for Argentina), include the FBI report, write a check to US Dept of State for $8, include a prepaid return envelope and send it to the address on the site.

As for how long it's valid... As Steve said, I believe you have some time before it 'expires' even if you're still in the States when you receive it. Certainly a week seems reasonable enough. What invalidates it is when you return to the US after the date on the background check. If you get the background check and come straight down and apply soon after, you should be fine.

 

[lucha54]

The FBI report and the birth certificate are completely separate - the birth certificate is from your State (and each state does it differently, and apostilles their own documents at the State's Department of State) and the FBI report is Federal and must be apostilled by the Federal Department of State in Washington DC.


The FBI background check you request from the FBI and then must send it off to the US Department of State Office of Authentications. It seems all my old links are broken and they've changed the address from when I did it last year.

http://travel.state....ntications.html
http://travel.state....vices.html#Mail
In short, you fill out the form DS-4194 (remember to say it's for Argentina), include the FBI report, write a check to US Dept of State for $8, include a prepaid return envelope and send it to the address on the site.

As for how long it's valid... As Steve said, I believe you have some time before it 'expires' even if you're still in the States when you receive it. Certainly a week seems reasonable enough. What invalidates it is when you return to the US after the date on the background check. If you get the background check and come straight down and apply soon after, you should be fine.

YAY! Super clear and helpful. Thank you so much. I'll definitely use a channeler GMXam ... and about this expiry thing, I'm just wondering if I can do it all in the span of 3 weeks (FBI apostille included) but maybe I shouldn't push my luck with the risk of it getting invalidated. Anyway thanks again for your input.

 

[ba_phd]

Hi all! I am going through the same process. Does anyone have a channeler for the FBI good conduct form that they recommend?