Dumping Ecuador for Argentina

To Sergio: There are several reasons for my not feeling safe in Ecuador lately. Remember, we have not retired yet and are not living there, but I have been there twice for five weeks each trip and do not like what I have seen and heard.

First, in Feb., 2009, I attended a Spanish Emmersion school in Cuenca. The individual student coordinator, my conversational Spanish instructor and the mother of my homestay family warned me that I might get mugged. The warnings, respectively, were against 1) walking around in broad daylight within the colonial district and tourist center, even on crowded streets; 2) wandering outsider the colonial district even in daylight and; 3) venturing outside after dark. I felt like a prisoner inside my homestay house every night. In this sad state, I watched a lot of television. A frequent subject on the news was the rise in crime and the inability of the judicial system to take effective action because of over-crowding in the prison system. While in Cuenca at a well-attended outdoor art show, I witnessed a robbery.

On our second trip to Ecuador last summer we stayed in La Floresta, Quito, a neighborhood recommended for its safety by Lonely Planet (2007). The owner of our hostel said we should not go out after dark because there had been muggings nearby recently. Again, a prisoner! He called a cab for us because he knew and trusted that particular driver. From Quito we went to Otavalo and Vilcabamba where we had no problems, neither did we hear of any crimes. However in Loja on our way back to Quito, we went out to dinner and afterward the waiter said he would go outside to hail us a cab (presumably because is felt it would be unsafe for us on the street after dark).

I recently received an email from Nicholas Crowder, author of Culture Shock! Ecuador. Here is and excerpt:

"Thanks for the note and the information. I am glad you found the book helpful. I write a lot about personal safety for travelers and sometimes that scares people. However, while most of us won't have something bad happen to us we need to be prepared and the more knowledge you
have about a destination the greater your odds of being safe or knowing what to do. I practice this no matter where I am at.

I am a very big fan of Ecuador and encourage people to go. But, I try to report incidents that are public knowledge so they will be safe. The government sites in my opinion really don't do a very good job at reporting incidents. Recently a vice conul at the consulate was a victim a a kidnap express. This was reported in a local newspaper. There was a young U.S. citizen recently murdered in Manta. There was very little publicized about it. It is suspected that it involved a real estate deal. I think those are things anyone should know about. Ask almost any Ecuadorian you meet and bring up security and they will tell you it is one of the worst times in recent history. I interview hundreds and have a wide range of contacts. Possibly there are people not happy with the truth sometimes because it may hurt a business."

Why the recent rise in crime? There were over a million Ecuadorians living and working in NY City before the recession. Many Ecuadorians living in the US lost their jobs during the recession. Another news story I frequently saw while I was there discussed how to help reassimilate the returning, jobless compatriots back into Ecuadorian society. Some of them were resorting to crime to survive. In addition, President Raphael Correa had recently changed immigration laws, allowing Colombians into the country without any documents! This, my Spanish teacher explained, was an invitation to Colombian outlaws to escape justice by coming to Ecuador. That situation, last I heard, was being corrected.

I cannot speak for IL but perhaps they are a little behind the times or maybe the last sentence in Nicholas Crowder's email applies to them also. I hope this helps.

Cheers,
Ahhemm..
 
TO ALL: Thanks for all the great replies and info, especially "Lawyer". Salud, Ahhemm..
 
You may want to consider buying in Chile and brining it in here - it will be cheaper for you and you'll avoid the restriction on driving it out of the country if you want to travel in the Chilean Andes or any other neighbouring country. Anything with an engine is expensive here.
 
Sounds like it is not the crime in Ecuador that is your problem, but your paranoia. Surely when you come here you will hear similar stories.
 
It's not necessarily paranoia, it's just being new at this.... if the OP has any intention of living anywhere in South America for any length of time he's going to have to come to terms with the fact that there's going to be a lot of warnngs not to go out at night, and that a lot of the time that advice should be heeded. Part of the "fun" of moving to developing countries is that generally speaking there are a lot more security issues.

The OP can read through this forum, particularly that thread that asked whether or not any of us have directly been victims of crime and he'll see that Buenos Aires has its fair share of problems.

Now, they want to do the RV thing, ie they won't be in the large cities as often I guess, and there's a fair bit of difference between large city and small in Argentina.

The main problem I see with the RV thing is the initial expense -- cars, trucks, and RVs are really bloody expensive here. Someone suggested buying in Chile, but I believe you need to get out your Chilean residency to be able to buy a car there. You will have to investigate.

Another consideration before you move is the driving license -- you'll need a local one if you're planning on driving here for more than a few months -- you'll have to look it up but I don't believe the int'l license is meant to be valid for more than 90 days -- it may be valid for 180, but I don't think more than that. I don't drive here, so can't answer the question myself, but perhaps someone else can chime in to let you know whether or not you would have to write the test / do the psych screening in Argentina and in Spanish to get out the local license.
 
Ahhemm.. said:
I recently received an email from Nicholas Crowder, author of Culture Shock! Ecuador. Here is and excerpt:

"...

Why the recent rise in crime? There were over a million Ecuadorians living and working in NY City before the recession. ...
.

REALLY??!?! REALLY?!?!?!

1 million Ecuadorians living and working in NYC? Are you freaking kidding me? Do you know what % of the population of NYC that would be?? About 12.5% (assuming roughly 8 million)!!! If you use METRO-NYC, it's still about 5%.(assuming roughly 20 million)!!!

I wouldn't put a lot of trust in someone who makes an obviously erroneous off the cuff comment like that.
 
I have traveled to all Central American countries and most of South America and hear the same warnings from locals, "do not go out walking at night", "the city is dangerous". It seems that Latins are very paranoid about crime. When the restaurant waiter tells you wait here I will call a cab for you, why is it that he can go out and you cant? You must really stand out as being a rich Gringo and loaded with money.

I live in the Orlando, Florida area and today's news paper has rapes and murders. There is a lot of crime amongst tourist in Orlando like robberies and muggings also. Do tourist stop coming to Orlando because of the news? What I am trying to say is there will always be crime especially in big cities anywhere in the world. Buenos Aires ha a lot of muggers and purse snatchers according to what I read on BA forums but people still visit the city. I always dress and act like I belong to a country or city when I visit including wearing what the locals wear. Rio is a high crime city where a lot of Brazilians do not even want to visit but I go there and walk at night but always carefull of my surroundings. It also helps to carry Mace or Taser with you just in case.
 
Ahhemm.. said:
Hola. We are a soon-to-be-retired couple nearing 60. Ecuador has become a little too dangerous for my comfort and I am considering two or three years in Argentina, Uruguay and Chile until Soc. Sec. begins for us. Now here's my plan: We are outdoorsy, so we would fly to BA, buy a small RV, camp around and rent when possible, moving from the mountains to the coast depending on the weather (70s to 50s F is good). I've seen plenty of apartments advertised on VivAvisos which seem very reasonable; are these for real? When we are ready to return to the US we'd sell the RV. Our budget will be $US 2000 per mo. with some startup money in savings. What d' y' think?

There is no comparison between Argentina and Ecuador. Argentina is more hip, modern, and with more culture & educated people. But the crime is rising; blend in don't stand out. I think you budget is more than adecuate; I rented a temprary apartment, which is much more expensive that the regular ones for $960.00 mo in Palermo/Recoleta area; don't live in other areas these are closer to everything. If you want to drive you should first see how they drive. In 2007 when I visited I was rubbed and my fingers were cut so badly that I have lost the use of 3 tendons and 2 nerve damaged on 5 fingers. You need to be aware of your surroundings and don't believe anyone; don't let any one in your apartment, this is what I did when I was told they were from the rental company; a moment of stupidity and not thinking a life time of pain.
 
InjuredBadly said:
You need to be aware of your surroundings and don't believe anyone; don't let any one in your apartment, this is what I did when I was told they were from the rental company; a moment of stupidity and not thinking a life time of pain.

Ok this is so not my business and feel free to ignore this question. But what exactly did they do to you? And this is the reason for your choice of nick?
 
Back
Top