Getting cash USD out of Argentina

[Patagone]

Hi all, I guess this is a luxury problem, but as we are planning on selling our apartment in Patagonia, we will probably be paid a pile of USD100 notes, which we need to get to Europe in some form without much costs nor excessive risks. The money is 'white' and there is no need to hide it, we just want it safely on our accounts outside AR.

What are the current options to get USD back out? As far as I know, depositing them in a bank and then doing an international bank wire doesn't work? We have USD accounts in EU and US (Transferwise).

Of course, we can stuff it inside our jackets and hope for the best. But as it will be more than the allowed $10k/adult + $5k/kid you can take freely across the border, we would need to declare it and I remember some horror stories that proved that declaring cash USD is equivalent to handing them over to a random ladron on the street as the customs agents simply will take it.

What options are there? Western Union (what amount)? Local Also, I am not sure about the current chances of the $100 notes being false, it would be good if they go through some bank. I assume that the current localbitcoins premium is higher than ever?
Thanks!

 

[camel]

I'd start with the first step - try to get paid in USD for your apartment, into an account outside of Argentina. I'm not sure how feasible that is but that would simplify things a lot.

I've heard the bitcoin premium in Argentina is high (to buy with pesos), but I haven't checked myself.

 

[ben]

AFAIK people on the street are offering this to the US for 3-4%.
From the US it’s a simple matter to wire it to Europe or anywhere else.

 

[nikad]

If you have a bank account in Argentina, you should have no problems and no limits wiring it to a foreign account under your name. The only restrictions are set on currency purchase and corporate transfers.

 

[pjniki]

We just completed the sale of our apartment in BA. If you are resident with a bank account, our understanding was that you could send the whole amount in one transaction for a real estate transaction, but you need a DNI with an Argentinean address. If the property is jointly owned, as ours was, then both of you would need to be residents and the accounts in Argentina and outside need exactly the same names on them. If you do not have a DNI with a local address, then you are restricted to taking $10,000 each on your person at the airport. Aside from black market caves your completely hamstrung. Believe me, we tried! The rules as of September were $1,000 per month for non-residents to send money out of the country electronically. If you have the local DNI but not a bank account, companies like Banco Piano were charging 3.5% when we checked in late September.

We ended up bringing $20,000 home with us and will retrieve the remaining money over the next year. Fortunately, we only had $100,000 to deal with.

 

[Patagone]

If you have a bank account in Argentina, you should have no problems and no limits wiring it to a foreign account under your name. The only restrictions are set on currency purchase and corporate transfers.

Thanks Nikad. Would you then just deposit the cash dollars in the bank office and then be able to transfer them out?

We just completed the sale of our apartment in BA. If you are resident with a bank account, our understanding was that you could send the whole amount in one transaction for a real estate transaction, but you need a DNI with an Argentinean address. If the property is jointly owned, as ours was, then both of you would need to be residents and the accounts in Argentina and outside need exactly the same names on them. If you do not have a DNI with a local address, then you are restricted to taking $10,000 each on your person at the airport. Aside from black market caves your completely hamstrung. Believe me, we tried! The rules as of September were $1,000 per month for non-residents to send money out of the country electronically. If you have the local DNI but not a bank account, companies like Banco Piano were charging 3.5% when we checked in late September.

We ended up bringing $20,000 home with us and will retrieve the remaining money over the next year. Fortunately, we only had $100,000 to deal with.

Thanks PjNiki. The AR bank account is in my wife's name, though I have a credit card connected to it in my name; the foreign USD accounts are in my name only. So that might create a problem?
As the money will probably be paid in cash, does it really matter if the apartment name is in one's name (it's in my wife's name in this case) as you would deposit cash in a bank? Or can you only transfer it out if it gets deposited by the buyer directly on or account?
Many thanks for your insights.

 

[gracielle]

We just completed the sale of our apartment in BA. If you are resident with a bank account, our understanding was that you could send the whole amount in one transaction for a real estate transaction, but you need a DNI with an Argentinean address. If the property is jointly owned, as ours was, then both of you would need to be residents and the accounts in Argentina and outside need exactly the same names on them. If you do not have a DNI with a local address, then you are restricted to taking $10,000 each on your person at the airport. Aside from black market caves your completely hamstrung. Believe me, we tried! The rules as of September were $1,000 per month for non-residents to send money out of the country electronically. If you have the local DNI but not a bank account, companies like Banco Piano were charging 3.5% when we checked in late September.

We ended up bringing $20,000 home with us and will retrieve the remaining money over the next year. Fortunately, we only had $100,000 to deal with.

Congratulations on the sale of the apt. On your other thread (Opening a bank account) you posted: ....My partner has his DNI (with our Canadian address).....In you don't mind answering, why did your ARG partner use the Canadian address on his DNI?

 

[nikad]

Thanks Nikad. Would you then just deposit the cash dollars in the bank office and then be able to transfer them out?

Yes, you should be fine. Which bank are you operating with in Arg? You might want to doulbe check, but as far as I know you should not have any problems.

 

[pjniki]

Congratulations on the sale of the apt. On your other thread (Opening a bank account) you posted: ....My partner has his DNI (with our Canadian address).....In you don't mind answering, why did your ARG partner use the Canadian address on his DNI?

We had no choice. His DNI had expired over a decade ago - we're both Canadian citizens and he's lived in Canada for 20 years - and in order to sell he had to renew his DNI through the consulate here with his Canadian address. At the time we started the process in May, we had no idea of the number of hassles we would go through to sell and getting correct information from professionals like the real estate agent was also a complete pain. He tried to replace his DNI with the BA address and it was simply impossible without that ARG credit card and we didn't have anyone at the time who could do it for us. All of the friends and family he still has down there are retired and/or not very well off. Only one of them was registered with AFIP and has a credit card and, unfortunately, he also has significant mental health issues.

He was facilitating some stuff at the beginning, then ended up in the hospital for 2 months. It was a complete, Kafka-like nightmare trying to pay AFIP bills from abroad. Two wire transfers never showed up in the AFIP accounts. The one from August 9 was finally returned to us in mid-october and we're still working on getting the second one from August 21 returned. We finally sent one small payment to the above friend through Western Union. The big capital gains tax we had to pay, about $5,500 USD, we ended up sending to another very rich friend ("I no exist with AFIP") to his account in Barcelona, he then went and exchanged US cash in BA ($225,000 pesos) which was then deposited in the account of the not-well friend so he could pay the bill electronically. The whole process went on and on like this. The accountant was quite helpful but it's so different than the North American process where your lawyer and real estate agent do everything, you sign a few papers and they hand you the keys or transfer the money from their escrow account.

 

[pjniki]

Thanks Nikad. Would you then just deposit the cash dollars in the bank office and then be able to transfer them out?



Thanks PjNiki. The AR bank account is in my wife's name, though I have a credit card connected to it in my name; the foreign USD accounts are in my name only. So that might create a problem?
As the money will probably be paid in cash, does it really matter if the apartment name is in one's name (it's in my wife's name in this case) as you would deposit cash in a bank? Or can you only transfer it out if it gets deposited by the buyer directly on or account?
Many thanks for your insights.

I would check with your bank and make sure all of your ducks are in a row in terms of transferring money. The information we got was that if the bank accounts interior and exterior were in the identical names (you know how Argentina is a stickler for that stuff), then transferring from a property sale wouldn't be a big deal. The other requirement was a DNI with a local address. Everything depends on your relationship with your bank (and what they feel like that day ).

Have you already put the property on the market, or are just getting ready to do it? If you have an Argentinean bank account already, that will save you a lot of hassles with AFIP since you can pay their bills directly. That's where we ran into the most trouble. We signed the contract with the buyer in early June and then lost a month waiting for a new DNI for my partner since, even though he is a Canadian citizen, was born in Argentina. Then we lost 2 months haggling with my bank about why wire transfers to AFIP weren't showing up. I had to kick all of that stuff all the way up to the bank ombudsman to get answers. After all the hassles, we were finally able to close on Oct 31.

Also, if you can find a buyer with money outside the country and have it stipulated in the contract that the money will be paid from outside Argentina, then you will avoid a lot of these hassles. I would try to make that a preferred condition for the sale. I don't know what the market is like in Patagonia. My inlaws are planning to sell in Mar del Plata and Santa Clara. There's still a little life in Mar del Plata, but the real estate market in Santa Clara is completely moribund.