Is there a way to get USD in BA?

[gracielle]

.....Most Argentines still prefer to keep their life savings of dollars under the mattress and sell it in a cueva when they need pesos as they don’t trust BCRA in regards to keeping money safe in USD accounts after 2001....

Actually it has been a common practice long before the crisis of 2001. It partly explains the popularity of the dollar as the preferred currency used to buy and sell properties. I can attest that it goes as far back as the 60's.

 

[Jeremias]

For most Argentines, it’s from a salary payment.

Rich by salary payment, in Argentina? Quoting the president, I would say it is possible only if you get a Supreme Court Judge salary...

But if you have found a way to get rich, honestly and without gaming, in South America, do tell, as half a billion people are wondering about that all over the continent.

 

[antipodean]

Rich by salary payment, in Argentina? Quoting the president, I would say it is possible only if you get a Supreme Court Judge salary...

But if you have found a way to get rich, honestly and without gaming, in South America, do tell, as half a billion people are wondering about that all over the continent.

No, like $50-$80k pesos a month. A fairly typical salary for a hotel or airport frontline worker for example.

There are a lot of honest Argentines out there who work hard and pay their taxes, there are a lot of companies who do the same as costs / risks of in compliance are simply not worth it. It’s not all wild Wild West as the romantic vision would suggest.

Does it make them “rich” having accumulated US$5000 in savings? Compared to someone in Villa 31, sure, but compared to someone in Europe - forget it. The reality in Latin America is that there are huge gaps and making generalizations is impossible as there are just too many different realities for different people.

 

[Jeremias]

No, like $50-$80k pesos a month. A fairly typical salary for a hotel or airport frontline worker for example.

There are a lot of honest Argentines out there who work hard and pay their taxes, there are a lot of companies who do the same as costs / risks of in compliance are simply not worth it. It’s not all wild Wild West as the romantic vision would suggest.

Does it make them “rich” having accumulated US$5000 in savings? Compared to someone in Villa 31, sure, but compared to someone in Europe - forget it. The reality in Latin America is that there are huge gaps and making generalizations is impossible as there are just too many different realities for different people.

Well, I disagree, it is perfectly OK to make generalizations that happen to be true, like: no one in South America gets rich honestly (unless one becomes a football star or star singer or wins the lottery).

Like, do you know a single South American who got rich through his "$50-$80k pesos a month" salary, just one example please? No you don't, and nobody does. There is no way to become rich through honest salary from Barranquilla to Ushuaia, end of story. Unless you've found some miracle recipe?

Of course one can survive through honest salary, but my point was, not to become rich.

Now, granted it's becoming the same in Europe, too. Honest salary does not make one rich anymore in Europe, as was the case twenty years ago.

Edit: btw, I know no Argentinian from the honest hard working class who's got 5000 usd in savings. That was possible 3 or 4 years ago, not anymore. Unless of course one has inherited money from some Italian aunt or some.

 

[antipodean]

I’m not talking about ogliarchs or Supreme Court judges when I’m talking about changing USD into ARS or renting out monoambiente apartments. USD and rental income are a part of regular people’s life here too.

(And yes I do have some examples, my business partners here started out as front line workers on similar salaries back in the day. An opportunity came up, they took it, started small and became “big”-ish.)

 

[antipodean]

Edit: btw, I know no Argentinian from the honest hard working class who's got 5000 usd in savings. That was possible 3 or 4 years ago, not anymore. Unless of course one has inherited money from some Italian aunt or some.

Sorry I can’t resist, as it’s important to dispel any notion that it is all doom and gloom for every worker in Argentina. My employees and many others in my sector are examples of hard working Argentines who have managed to save in recent time (and they are on the said salary scale)

- 1 just opened a microbrewery and bar (28 years old) in a modest neighborhood in Santa Fe
- 1 saving to move to Europe and was ready to go before the crisis hit
- 1 recently took their family on vacation to Brazil
- 1 recently got back from a long trip around Europe
- 1 long time worker recently purchased their second home in a modest neighborhood - they are renting out their first home to supplement their income for a new baby etc
- My long time regular Venezuelan cabify driver finally saved enough to move him and his family to Europe and left earlier this year

All of these things take USD / FX to accomplish and they all started in pesos en blanco.

No Italian aunts or dirty money involved to my knowledge. Nor do I imply that they do not have economic complaints of their own about living and working in Argentina. They are just in a different bubble. Are they rich or dishonest and deserve to be scammed just because they are in a better condition than many?

 

[Jeremias]

Sorry I can’t resist, as it’s important to dispel any notion that it is all doom and gloom for every worker in Argentina. My employees and many others in my sector are examples of hard working Argentines who have managed to save in recent time (and they are on the said salary scale)

- 1 just opened a microbrewery and bar (28 years old) in a modest neighborhood in Santa Fe
- 1 saving to move to Europe and was ready to go before the crisis hit
- 1 recently took their family on vacation to Brazil
- 1 recently got back from a long trip around Europe
- 1 long time worker recently purchased their second home in a modest neighborhood - they are renting out their first home to supplement their income for a new baby etc
- My long time regular Venezuelan cabify driver finally saved enough to move him and his family to Europe and left earlier this year

All of these things take USD / FX to accomplish and they all started in pesos en blanco.

No Italian aunts or dirty money involved to my knowledge. Nor do I imply that they do not have economic complaints of their own about living and working in Argentina. They are just in a different bubble. Are they rich or dishonest and deserve to be scammed just because they are in a better condition than many?

You're saying it's not all doom and gloom for humble honest Argentine workers, but then you give examples, and half of them are people who save just enough to flee to Europe.

I mean, not all gloom and doom but everybody wants out, everyone dreaming to escape to Europe..? Is it a healthy situation?

As to the micro-brewery, well, the young Argentines who don't plan to flee to Europe, are indeed into "let's open a micro-brewery" dreams, I'm not surprised. But, sadly, just how many "micro-breweries" will remain alive by the end of the year? Even strong bars will get broke by the hundreds...

But please tell us in detail how "your employees on the 500 usd monthly salary scale" manage to save money?? They eat mate cocido and fideos, right, poor souls? They never visit a mall. No cinema outing. Holiday in Quilmes.

Well, I'd rather "cross into viveza territory" and have fun, than survive like some slave on mate cocido and tercera-marca fideos... but to each his own.

 

[antipodean]

No, Argentina is not a healthy situation! Too much stress and uncertainty. That’s what I mean about them having their own complaints about their own situation. Everyone wants a better future for themselves - some think why earn €500 in Argentina if I can earn €1000 doing the same job and have less life-stress in Europe if I have an EU passport. That’s the global reality of supply and demand and “greener grass” theory. It doesn’t mean their situation in Europe will actually be “better” or “worse” in relative terms. Still need to work for a living and still have financial limits.

How do they save? Not living in CABA. Paying around $10-20k per month in rent. Living within their means. Save even around $5-10k a month for 5 years and you will end up with something if you don’t leave it sitting around in ARS gathering dust to get eaten away by inflation. And yet they still seem to go out on the town more than me... on the surface not a “bad” life for Argentina.

Many working class people in “first world” countries don’t even save, they have less incentive/ fear/ ability to save, instead they live off credit being a slave to their banks and high costs of living for their entire lives with a comfortable social safety net to fall back on if it all turns to sh!t.

Everyone has their own quality of life index and reasons to stay or reasons to go if they have the means to decide. Likewise everyone has a different gauge of “how much” is “enough” for them. Same for expats like us.

(Ps Some of those employees have lived abroad, Norway and Dubai to be exact, and yet they still came back to Argentina to earn this much because for them it is home and has things more important than money like their friends and family.)

 

[Rich One]

You're saying it's not all doom and gloom for humble honest Argentine workers, but then you give examples, and half of them are people who save just enough to flee to Europe.

I mean, not all gloom and doom but everybody wants out, everyone dreaming to escape to Europe..? Is it a healthy situation?

As to the micro-brewery, well, the young Argentines who don't plan to flee to Europe, are indeed into "let's open a micro-brewery" dreams, I'm not surprised. But, sadly, just how many "micro-breweries" will remain alive by the end of the year? Even strong bars will get broke by the hundreds...

But please tell us in detail how "your employees on the 500 usd monthly salary scale" manage to save money?? They eat mate cocido and fideos, right, poor souls? They never visit a mall. No cinema outing. Holiday in Quilmes.

Well, I'd rather "cross into viveza territory" and have fun, than survive like some slave on mate cocido and tercera-marca fideos... but to each his own.

Well said, the 500 usd salary is part of the family income , but then there is the graft, side business, etc. Few middle class families can live out of one salary "en blanco"... IMHO

 

[Jeremias]

No, Argentina is not a healthy situation! Too much stress and uncertainty. That’s what I mean about them having their own complaints about their own situation. Everyone wants a better future for themselves - some think why earn €500 in Argentina if I can earn €1000 doing the same job and have less life-stress in Europe if I have an EU passport. That’s the global reality of supply and demand and “greener grass” theory. It doesn’t mean their situation in Europe will actually be “better” or “worse” in relative terms. Still need to work for a living and still have financial limits.

How do they save? Not living in CABA. Paying around $10-20k per month in rent. Living within their means. Save even around $5-10k a month for 5 years and you will end up with something if you don’t leave it sitting around in ARS gathering dust to get eaten away by inflation. And yet they still seem to go out on the town more than me... on the surface not a “bad” life for Argentina.

Many working class people in “first world” countries don’t even save, they have less incentive/ fear/ ability to save, instead they live off credit being a slave to their banks and high costs of living for their entire lives with a comfortable social safety net to fall back on if it all turns to sh!t.

Everyone has their own quality of life index and reasons to stay or reasons to go if they have the means to decide. Likewise everyone has a different gauge of “how much” is “enough” for them. Same for expats like us.

(Ps Some of those employees have lived abroad, Norway and Dubai to be exact, and yet they still came back to Argentina to earn this much because for them it is home and has things more important than money like their friends and family.)

Your (intelligent) post proves that you know the country very well.

So, I agree with most of what you write. Nevertheless, it looks a bit like you're trying to convince yourself that by giving a salary of 500 usd to your Argentine employees, you are a good, kind employer. Outside of the Gran Buenos Aires, it might almost be the case...but, anyway, it's not enough, I'm sorry to say.
I have Argentine friends who, unfortunately for them, being honest, survive on salaries of 500 usd per month, and it's not dignified, it's not a real life. Simply put, one needs a salary of 800 usd minimum to have the beginning of a productive good life here.