Paris or Buenos Aires?

[citygirl]

They're apples and oranges (as much as people like to call BsAs the Paris of South America, it's not Paris!) I'm not really sure where to begin, they're so different it's hard to compare. Although both have lots & lots of paperwork

I'm sure you realize that finding legal work in both places will be quite difficult (unless you have a company willing to give you a work visa). Unemployment is high in both countries. If you are looking to work as a freelance - obviously you know that salaries will be substantially lower here if you are looking to work locally. If you are going to be doing work for overseas companies and paid in dollars, your dollar will go a lot farther here than in Paris. But ojo - that is not to say it's cheap here by any means and getting more expensive by the day.

As to which you will like better - that's so subjective. Are you fluent in French or Spanish? That will make a difference in how quickly you acclimate.

I've lived in both (well, to be fair, I lived in Paris for 6 months when I was younger so not a real expat) and am currently thinking about moving back to Paris for a work opportunity. It's an amazing city. So is Buenos Aires. Both have their challenges and both have their advantages.

If you plan on heading home (not sure where home is) to visit friends/family - Paris has a decided advantage as its much closer to North America and flights are much cheaper.

 

[French jurist]

Where to start ....
I'm a Parisian, I have lived there for 25 years. I've lived too in California for two years, London for one year, and now in Bs As since 7 years.

Reading your post makes me think you have kids and are around 25/45 years old ?

Well, anyway let's start :

- Education : both public schools are free but in Argentina, better send your kids to a private one. Public schools in France are among the best (even better than the US, but US universities are better than the French ones).

- Healthcare : both are free (generally speaking), but same as for the education. In Argentina better have a private medical insurance. French healthcare is among the best in the world although it might start to degrade with the crisis (anyway, same applies to all countries).

- Cost of life : You know it already, Bs As is way much cheaper. Rent a 2 BR in Paris, 60 sq meters in a normal location runs about 800 Euros minimum, while in Bs As, it will cost you 350-400 Euros (2 years contract).

- Culture : Paris is one of the main place to be (with NY, ..). Since you are an artist, you will make many useful contacts there. BTW, many Argentinean-Uruguayan artists live in France (Segui, Arden Quin) or live between both cities (Luis Felipe Noe).
Bs As lacks decent museums, decent exhibitions (if you come from Paris), decent cultural life, decent jazzclubs, etc...
But I think the creative vibe is very much alive in Bs As, maybe more than Paris which is a bit conservative under certain aspects (even if frenchies will consider themselves as very original people).

- Start a business (design related) : Clearly better to do it in Bs As. Less paperwork, lesser costs, etc... Starting a business in France (although it's the second country in the world attracting foreign investment, surprising but it's true) is a pain in the culo.

- Taxes : Argentina is much better. In france, someone single earning a lot could pay taxes up to 70% of his income, this has been limited with the new President (bouclier fiscal), so now, the total taxes cannot exceed 50 or 60% of your income.

- Infrastructures : Day and night of course. In France, you'll have the bullet train, perfect highways, etc...

- Employment rate : we're heading towards difficult times (crisis is not over) in both countries. Better spend the crisis in Argentina imho.

- Benefit from the fact you are a foreigner : slight to decent advantage to Bs As since there are less foreigners here. Paris has a long past of a multicultural city so you will benefit less from your differences.

- Residency permit : I don't know how tough it is now in France for Canadians but my guess is that they are tightening a bit the rules. Immigration enforcement is very loose in BA while it's tougher in Paris.

Well, it could be discussed extensively, it's really tough not knowing you telling you more.
On another hand, if there's a place anyone should live for some time some day, that would be Paris (or New York, Tokyo, Milano, maybe London too), and the same cannot be said of Buenos Aires.

But if you are in you are in your 25-45s with kids, wanting to start a business design-art related, maybe the best option would be to come to Buenos Aires and find a way to spend some time during the year to come to Paris to sell your products, make contacts, see exhibitions, etc...

 

[D!Di]

Thanks qwerty, We are planning on being self employed. How difficult is it to set up your own business there as an expat?

 

[qwerty]

Thanks qwerty, We are planning on being self employed. How difficult is it to set up your own business there as an expat?

I have never started a business so I can't really tell but what I hear it's pretty hard, but probally nothing a good lawyer can't fix

If you can get round starting your own business and work over the internet, in negro, etc I would definitly do that but that depends on what kind of business you want to start

 

[D!Di]

Merci French Jurist! very helpful!
I am a 31 year old passionate and opinionated Persian/Canadian who is in search of place to call home. I have so much creative ideas coming out of me, that I need a place to use them all. A place that I can be the artist I was born to be. I have been to Paris 6 times, and I feel alive every time I am there. The art culture just could not compare to Canada. The history and the the social interactions are what my husband and I fell in love with. We felt at home in Paris...the only problem was always our little knowledge of the language. However, my husband is fluent in Castellano, which is we started considering BA.
We don't have kids, but we will when we find our new home.
Hoping for la dolce vita!

 

[French jurist]

Merci French Jurist! very helpful!
I am a 31 year old passionate and opinionated Persian/Canadian who is in search of place to call home. I have so much creative ideas coming out of me, that I need a place to use them all. A place that I can be the artist I was born to be. I have been to Paris 6 times, and I feel alive every time I am there. The art culture just could not compare to Canada. The history and the the social interactions are what my husband and I fell in love with. We felt at home in Paris...the only problem was always our little knowledge of the language. However, my husband is fluent in Castellano, which is we started considering BA.
We don't have kids, but we will when we find our new home.
Hoping for la dolce vita!

My best friend when I was living in California had for first name Reza, I love the Persian culture.

Well, I work too in the art world (but strictly dealing).

I'd say that if your artistic project involves setting-up a business (like making handbags, etc... ), then BA could be a little better.

If your artistic project involves you and only you (painter or whatever, without setting up a business), then Paris is clearly the winner.

French official website for opening a business is here :
http://www.apce.com/

Nevertheless, really consider that if you don't intend to apply for residency in France, and if you break the rules, upon reentering France after a trip you will have a very hard time (big difference from BA).

 

[qwerty]

Merci French Jurist! very helpful!
I am a 31 year old passionate and opinionated Persian/Canadian who is in search of place to call home. I have so much creative ideas coming out of me, that I need a place to use them all. A place that I can be the artist I was born to be. I have been to Paris 6 times, and I feel alive every time I am there. The art culture just could not compare to Canada. The history and the the social interactions are what my husband and I fell in love with. We felt at home in Paris...the only problem was always our little knowledge of the language. However, my husband is fluent in Castellano, which is we started considering BA.
We don't have kids, but we will when we find our new home.
Hoping for la dolce vita!

Get maybe 100 hours of private teaching(probally easy to get in Canada) and there won't be a language problem anymore I guess

 

[D!Di]

Thanks French Jurist.
I will do all that is creative, but my art only involves me. My art is surreal, controversial and provocative (not for everyone, specially here). Ideally I want to do what all artist want: to exhibit, and to have the right open minded audience who will get it. My Husband teaches Taijutsu, and he does film choreography and that's what makes him happy, again not something that's widely appreciated here.
Are the Parisians forgiving when it comes to our poor French? How far will I get in BA with my broken Spanish? We will of course be further developing our language skills once we decide...but it takes time to become perfect and we are leaving in December.

 

[French jurist]

Thanks French Jurist.
I will do all that is creative, but my art only involves me. My art is surreal, controversial and provocative (not for everyone, specially here). Ideally I want to do what all artist want: to exhibit, and to have the right open minded audience who will get it. My Husband teaches Taijutsu, and he does film choreography and that's what makes him happy, again not something that's widely appreciated here.
Are the Parisians forgiving when it comes to our poor French? How far will I get in BA with my broken Spanish? We will of course be further developing our language skills once we decide...but it takes time to become perfect and we are leaving in December.

Parisians are quite forgiving about poor french, even though like any inhabitant of a major city they are obnoxious, look sad in the subway, etc...
The cliché of the french guy being unpolite to foreigners pertains to the past, more or less (and french women shave their underarms now, another cliché lol).
Most of the french people under 50, middle class, speak at least another foreing language now.
Anyway, since you'll gravitate around the artistic world, it will be even easier (open minded people).

If your art involves only you, then Paris is a better place, that's for sure.
Furthermore the parisian audience will be much more receptive to your oriental roots than the portena one.

As for your husband, I don't really have an answer (Taijitsu and film choreography), it might be tricky for him to work if he doesn't have a work permit but well, impossible n'est pas français !

 

[D!Di]

Thanks French Jurist! You have been exceptionally helpful!