Paying incompetent losers is just wrong!

[fifs2]

Sorry to gripe but this whole system of having to pay incompetent/lazy/malingerers (add adjective that fits) etc losers to leave a job is one of the main reasons this country is not as competitive/attractive or agile business wise as it could be. In any other part of the world when an employee can't be bothered to get to work on time, phones in sick 10 days a month or doesnt actually do any work it is pretty easy to build a case to get rid of them....here they have their hand out saying how much to get me to leave? I'm not anti-union as I've seen how well the system works in Sweden and I know there are abusive empoyers here but it really p****ses me off to see people making a living out of "liquidaciones"...I've experienced 2 this month with one new employee coming for 2 days to work and then phoning in sick and demanding a payoff of $1200 pesos and a guy in my team for 4 months who couldn't manage his way out of a paperbag demanding 10,000 pesos even though we both "agreed" last Friday he was a waste of space and would be happier gazing at his navel for a living.
Is it only me...say no and we are friends for life!
Yours in honest, ethical hard labor
F

 

[fedecc]

You don´t understand the argentine system. By employing someone you are exploiting them and stealing their genuine profit and wealth, therefore you should be punished by paying ridiculous indemnizations.

 

[CJLenBSAS87]

I am completely F'ing in agreement. This is one of the few aspects of the argentine system that drives me INSANE. One could make a living off of being a horrible employee. I recently lost a friend who became angered with me when i told him what he was doing was wrong. He hasnt worked in over a year because he made up a back injury that supposedly got sweeping movie theater aisles. once every six months he'd go back for 2 weeks to say that it still hurt him and take another 6 month leave. I've worked very hard my whole life and have thought about going into business here, but quite frankly the system has me a little bit scared.

 

[sergio]

It's true that the system is a mess. I am afraid, for example, to fire my cleaning woman for fear that she will start a law suit. What amazes me is that foreign companies often do no research into labor law here only later to discover that they have serious labor problems. I once asked a labor lawyer what advice he had for foreign companies thinking of opening here. His answer was : "Don't come"!

The other side of the coin is that Argentine employers can be very tough. The system is invariably hierarchical and anti-democratic. If there were no labor protection employers would dismiss employees at a whim. With little social umbrella and few job opportunities, employees might not be able to survive. To correct the labor law problems the whole society has to be reformed. Not going to happen any time soon.

 

[citygirl]

Nope, not just you. But the key is hiring good employees, giving them good working conditions and then cutting your losses early (if you can). The good thing is you can do a 6 month trial period. While you will still have to pay out, at least its not outrageous if it doesn't work out.

Edited to say - it's also important to do everything in blanco to protect yourself as an employer. I know the taxes are high but if you go en negro, the employee has a lot more power to screw you.

I've had amazing luck hiring young people in their early/mid 20s who are going to night school to finish up their degree and need a good day time job. They work hard, they don't cause problems and I can train them the way I want them. My team here gets consistent rave reviews from the client.

I will say (and this is horrible) that the 2 more mature employees I hired didn't work out - they wanted to do things their way, weren't flexible and wound up quitting in a really unprofessional manner. Both left before their 6 month probation period.

It took me a while to find a good team but knock on wood - it's been going great for the last 6 months.

I also, as an employer, make it a point to take care of my employees. I don't ask them to work OT unless it's something really important, they get to take study days, I give them quarterly incentives, I pay well above the norm, provide health insurance, take them out to lunch 1x a month, etc.

I want them to feel like they are an important part of the team and to take ownership and pride in their work. I'm sure most of them will move on after they finish their degrees but that's perfectly okay with me and I will give them glowing references. And while they are with my company, I want them to work hard but also enjoy the rewards of their work.

 

[Persyd]

Dear Citygirl,

Sounds like a great place to work!

Are there any positons available at the moment?

Seriously, could you PM me with the details of your company/industry. I am on the lookout and am interested to hear more.

I'm not one of those types that were described earlier in the thread!

Regards,

 

[Napoleon]

There's a reason that some small companies here won't hire Argentines.

 

[Bajo_cero2]

Well, if you have a bad employed you can fire him without paying him anything. But, of course, he must be en blanco. There is a procedure for that.
If you are paying him under the table, this is illegal and that´s why you have to pay so much. The indemnización is doubble.
Lawyers here aren´t as expensive as in the US, so the best is to have legal advice in advance instead of doing everything as you are used to do in you country and call the lawyer when your mistake is impossible to solve. Lawyers are lawyers not magicians.
On the other hand, you are probably paying a lot less than in the US or Europe, so, to do everything according to law will be less expensive. The philosophy behing the argentinian law is to force you to have all your employed en blanco, legals.

 

[crakenflux]

Fifs2.. Can you tell me if you hired this person blanco o negro? Are there laws against a black labor market in the books? Are they enforced? If so, are they enforced with prejudice against foreign companies doing business in BA?

 

[SaraSara]

Then the locals complain that there are no jobs...! Of course there aren't - employers are afraid of being burned and will go to great lengths to avoid hiring anyone..

Personally, l've heard so many horror stories that only hire people with at least ten years' references from friends and family. No references over the phone - anyone can answer a phone.