Science is under threat in Argentina — we must call out the danger

[on the brink]

Some fact-checking: https://www.euronews.com/my-europe/...ts-sign-declaration-denying-climate-emergency

"The two main Dutch actors behind the declaration are Guus Berkhout, a retired geophysicist who has worked for oil giant Shell, and journalist Marcel Crok.

Both have been accused of receiving money from fossil fuel companies to finance their climate-sceptic work. They deny the allegations,

When looking closer at the list of signatories, there are precisely 1,107, including six people who are dead. Less than 1% of the names listed describe themselves as climatologists or climate scientists.

Eight of the signatories are former or current employees of the oil giant Shell, while many other names have links to mining companies.

One of the signatories is Ivar Giaever, a joint winner of the Nobel Prize for Physics in 1973 for work on superconductors. However, he has never published any work on climate science.

According to an independent 2019 count of the declaration's signatories, 21% were engineers, many linked to the fossil fuel industry. Others were lobbyists, and some even worked as fishermen or airline pilots."

Quite right, Pintor.

Pieces like that remind me of P.T. Barnum's saying: "There's a sucker born every minute"
Apocryphal or not, it is the plain truth.

 

[Pierre Smith]

It's a funny measure of the impotence right now of the far left, here in America and especially over in Europe, that they're trying in their domains of control (the media, mainly) to assist the left in Argentina, without any understanding that the reason that Milei may or may not become the president of Argentina is precisely because of years of extreme mismanagement of the economy by the longstanding political class.

Like, they think that everything is culture wars and post-material or "luxury" values. But in Argentina it really is that people just desperately need some sort of basic competence in government, and are willing to take radical actions to get there.

 

[Quilombo]

Do you always get this upset when people don't share your religious beliefs?

Exactly what I was talking about; we've reached the point where bad faith actors have created an environment in which facts now
are treated as akin to belief, and you can answer the question "what's the square root of 9?" with "purple" and we should somehow
respect this because someone doesn't believe the answer is 3.

Anyways, I encourage those who don't believe in climate change to take a flight captained by a pilot who doesn't "believe" in gravity
or fuel utilization ratios, and let us know how that works out.

 

[carride]

No wasteful spending on scientific R&D that directly helps improve the future financial growth of the country. Currently only at only 0.5% GDP vs Israel and South Korea each invest around 5% of their gross domestic product; the United States invests 3.46%.

Yet this is a possible good science thing?

Mr. Milei has also signaled that cloning could find a place in his government. Last month he said that, if elected, he would appoint an Argentine scientist who has dedicated his career to cloning animals as the chairman of an influential national scientific council.

From NYT Thread 'The 5 Mastiff Clones in Argentina’s Election'
https://baexpats.org/threads/the-5-mastiff-clones-in-argentina’s-election.46351/

 

[Macanudo]

Anyways, I encourage those who don't believe in climate change to take a flight captained by a pilot who doesn't "believe" in gravity
or fuel utilization ratios, and let us know how that works out.

Without science, we could not travel by air. Is that the point you are trying to make? If you believe that airplanes contribute to climate change, are you willing to do your part and take a vow to never fly again? Because that is the endgame that the climate change narrative could be heading toward.

 

[gringoexpress]

Exactly what I was talking about; we've reached the point where bad faith actors have created an environment in which facts now
are treated as akin to belief, and you can answer the question "what's the square root of 9?" with "purple" and we should somehow
respect this because someone doesn't believe the answer is 3.

Anyways, I encourage those who don't believe in climate change to take a flight captained by a pilot who doesn't "believe" in gravity
or fuel utilization ratios, and let us know how that works out.

There's a difference between climate change (the sun goes through periods of increased output and decreased input) and the cult of anthropogenic climate change which tends to appeal to the same insane whackos who wanted to force me to poison myself. Most corporate and government funded "science" these days is actually scientism, and good riddance to the government being involved. Any time the state and religion become married all kinds of bad stuff happens.

 

[gringoexpress]

Without science, we could not travel by air. Is that the point you are trying to make? If you believe that airplanes contribute to climate change, are you willing to do your part and take a vow to never fly again? Because that is the endgame that the climate change narrative could be heading toward.

Don't forget eating bugs. You gotta eat bugs or the earth is doomed.

Thankfully most of the true believers in the manmade climate change scam are busy vaccinating and boosting themselves out of the gene pool and into the big safe space in the sky, so the problem should resolve itself eventually.

 

[BobbyHank]

Who said that government should get involved with science? the purpose of government is to secure borders, and institute and enforce laws that the people want, period! The problem with the world today is that too many people want too much stuff from their robin hood governments! other than the aforementioned, I can't think of anything that a government can do better than industry! Too damned many snowflakes and chicken littles in this world! If you want something done, then do it yourself, don't rely on a government to steal someone else's money, line a bunch of bureaucrats pockets and spend 10x times as much money to come up with an answer that industry could have deciphered in 1/10th the time, at 1/10th the price. Ronald Reagan (my fav. pol. ever!) said, "The most terrifying words in the English language are: I'm from the government and I'm here to help". I tend to agree with that! He also said: "If more government is the answer, then it was a really stupid question." I agree with that one too!

 

[Alby]

Quite right, Pintor.

Pieces like that remind me of P.T. Barnum's saying: "There's a sucker born every minute"
Apocryphal or not, it is the plain truth.

There seems to be no way to know the extent to which human activity is increasing natural warming. Everyone qualified to opine on the subject (i.e., argue that the impact is significant or that it is not) can be argued to have a financial incentive to do so. So we can disregard recourse to the financial incentive argument when trying to decide which side´s debunking of the other to believe. It gets us nowhere. Both sides make the same argument, seemingly oblivious to it also applying to them.

The fact-checkers also have financial incentives to do what they do. So we can disregard their efforts too. In any case, revealing that hardly any signatories to a letter stating that climate change is not an emergency are themselves climate change scientists is irrelevant given the multidisciplinary arguments the letter makes. There are many highly distinguished scientists from my country on the signatory list. I doubt many of them are suckers.

Waiting to see if CABA is suffering week-long 40-degree heat waves in ten years won’t help us get to the bottom of this either. I was here in the summer of 2012/13 and found it so excruciatingly hot that I built plans to move here based on the assumption that I would need to escape in December and January. After eventually arriving, for various reasons (including the pandemic), I could not escape and spent four of my first five summers in the city amazed and relieved at how much milder and bearable it was. The most recent summer, though, was certainly a hot one. But then again, no hotter than an earlier summer I experienced here, 1995/96, a long time ago.

 

[WoodbridgeNJ]

Exactly what I was talking about; we've reached the point where bad faith actors have created an environment in which facts now
are treated as akin to belief, and you can answer the question "what's the square root of 9?" with "purple" and we should somehow
respect this because someone doesn't believe the answer is 3.

Anyways, I encourage those who don't believe in climate change to take a flight captained by a pilot who doesn't "believe" in gravity
or fuel utilization ratios, and let us know how that works out.

A better comparison would be you are in an airplane waiting to take off and the pilot comes over the loudspeaker to say "Ladies and Gentlemen I've just had some disturbing news in 5 minutes this plane will become an inferno inhospitable to human life but if you all pass $100 to the front for my retirement fund I think we can take off safely on schedule"

The terrified passengers all obey but then 5 minutes later the pilot repeats the message... and repeats... repeats... repeat

Why complain about Trump being president in 2016 according to the prophet Al Gore we all should have been dead by 2015. Just thank the climate lord and be grateful for every day