Soon To Expat - Home Buying Info Sought

[Vex]

Hi All,

Rob here... I just joined the group and wanted to introduce myself. I'm really glad to have found you all and look fwd to interacting with and potentially meeting some of you one day!

I'm currently in the planning process and soon to expatriate the US. My fiance is Brazilian. We are both very interested in Argentina for a number or reasons, not the least of which is the presence of US expat communities, culture, weather, etc, We're considering moving there within the next year or so, and I've been researching and looking at the BsAs area as our destination.

Our current situation is thus: We're both in our early 40s, have no kids, speak English, Portuguese and Spanish, and own rental properties in Brazil. These rentals will be our primary source of income as we put our plan into motion. My fiance is currently in Brazil and living off the rental incomes quite well (has been for a little over a year now). I'm in the US, actively employed in a fortune 500, but ready to leave the rat race behind and "retire". I will continue working in the US until my expat planning is complete, at which time I will quit. Initially, I'll be moving to Brazil, but we subsequently plan to relocate to Argentina.

In terms of income, we should be realizing about 7-10k Arg. per month (at current exchange rates) which, based on what I have read thus far, should be adequate to cover living expenses if we own a home rather than rent. Please correct me if I'm wrong on that account. I should also note that we have monies set aside to purchase another home.

And, that brings me to my question - home buying: Where are the nicer, quieter, safer suburban areas to live, and what should we expect to pay, ballpark, to purchase a decent single family home in such an area?

I know things like "nicer" and "safer" are very subjective, so I'll expand by saying, we'd prefer to be outside the city, with something like a 2bdrm, 2ba, w/ garage, a yard for the dogs to play in and room for some gardens, etc. We'd like to be close enough to the city to commute and enjoy all it has to offer, yet far enough away that there's little noise pollution and we can enjoy serene, quiet evenings under star-filled skies.

I'd also greatly enjoy being nearby other expats who share a common experience and understanding so there's some level of community we can integrate into fairly easily and get the weekend BBQ crew going!

As a logical extension of this, if you know of or have worked with any reputable companies who assist with expatriation generally or home-buying specifically in suburbs of BsAs, please advise!

As you might expect, I have lots of other questions, but I think I'll leave it at that for now and follow-up in future posts with other fun. As you know, this entire process is pretty daunting, but we're enjoying the adventure!

Peace and love to you all! And, thanks in advance for any and all insight you may be able to provide! It's greatly appreciated!
-Rob (aka Vex).

 

[Matiasba]

You have two kinds of suburbs here: the Zona Norte which is Vicente Lopez, Olivos, La Lucila, Martinez, Acassusso, San Isidro, Beccar, etc, which are near town, you have decent public transport, like buses, train, Tren de la Costa, etc.
And the "countries" of Tigre and Pilar. The term "countries" envolves gated communities and country clubs. They are far from the city, like 40 or 50 kms of highway. Tigre a little less, 30 maybe, and you also have train there. But in Pilar and Tigre the gated comunity prevails while in the Zona Norte is open (but with private security in every corner -which in lot of cases cant avoid robbery)
I would say due the proximity to La Cava, one of the bigger shanty towns, the San Isidro zone is less safer. But curiously is where the richest people live.
In general, both kind of suburbs are fine considering security.

About prices, I dont know that much, but the closer to the city the more expensive you go. Try zonaprop.com.ar and search in these neighbourhoods I mentioned. You can search for 2 bedrooms and two bathrooms as well. It is a good time to buy property, but will get better. Soon.

Good luck.

 

[PhilipDT]

Provincia eh?

So rob, time to chose.

Do you want to live surrounded by barbed wire fences or do you want to live in constant fear of armed robbery.

Crimen en Buenos Aires, activa como nunca.

 

[Davidglen77]

Some advice regarding income 7-10K ARG is a very tight budget for living in the suburbs. To be comfortable you will need more like 20K especially if you are going to own a car. A tank of gas costs about $400 pesos these days, and then you have insurance, "patente" and repairs. Your car alone will cost you at minimum $1500 pesos per month just in gas, taxes and insurance. Owning a house in the nice suburbs right outside of the city is expensive, also utilities are expensive in those areas to, many of those communities have lost any subsidies they used to recieve from the government. And maintenance of your house - that adds up too, one can of housepaint is now around $230 pesos, a paintbrush $30 pesos and a can of turpentine $100 pesos. I bought a pack of sandpaper last month - 44 pesos, 2 drill bits, 40 pesos and a screwdriver - 30 pesos. And don't forget health insurance - 2 people in their 40's you are looking at a minimum of $1500 per month. You need to reassess your budget.

 

[Vex]

Thanks for the input thus far everyone!

@Matiasba: Great info! Much appreciated! I'll check out the site your recommended as I continue to dig and explore. 40-50km is not too bad in terms of "visiting" the city center now and again. The gated community may be our best bet anyway...

@Davidglen77: The budget I mentioned is the rental properties alone. I plan on and expect some additional income streams. Will we total 20k+ / mo? I'd imagine it could be that or more, but we'll see. Honestly, my goal is to work at little as possible, but as long as I have some high speed internet, I'll be able to work and earn from home. Just, out of the gate we'll have the rental base as we put everything else into motion. I greatly appreciate the heads up on costs you mentioned, that helps a lot and I will definitely examine the income and budget closely before we make a move.

@PhillipDT: Hmm... barbed wire or armed robbery? Great choices! LOL I've lived in Brazil, which is no safe haven for gringos (or locals), so I'm no stranger to walled living and being smart about my surroundings, what I wear, how I act, where/when I use my phone, etc. That said, I was actually hoping to get away from the walled in / electric fence / dogs on patrol living of Brazil. So, it's sad to hear crime is so active in BsAs.

Perhaps to realize the dream in BsAs, we should stick to the gated communities or a condo? That's a big part of the reason I started posting here - for exactly this type of info. My experience in Brazil is that police are nonexistent and pretty worthless in the majority of situations. Home invasions are rampant as are broad daylight robberies and you really have to be cognizant of what's going on around you at all times. I was hoping Argentina was a bit better. Perhaps not...

 

[Alicia karr]

Argentina is at least a bit better, but on the devolve. I chose it over Brazil for the crime issues seven years ago and my decision still remains the same. But unfortunately the gap in the differences is narrowing...the next year will be very bumpy. Good time to wait watch and see.

 

[citygirl]

Just something to consider - how will you plan on accessing the money from your rental apts? I'm sure you are aware of the challenges of the banking system here, you can't just transfer money into Argentina easily if you plan on setting up bank accounts, etc here. You can of course use ATMs but those have fees and you will get the official exchange rate (although not really an issue if you are withdrawing from a brasilian account with reals)

I quite like the San Isidro area and you would be close to capital. Pilar and those areas are quite pretty and there are some lovely countries but with traffic, it can be a good hour. I wouldn't choose to live there if I had to commute to capital every day. However, there are plenty of good restaurants, shopping, etc out that way as well and if you don't need to come to town for work, it's perfectly feasible to live out there and go in to town more occasionally.

 

[citygirl]

David raises a good point. Assuming you are buying a car, that alone will easily be 3500 a month I would say, not 1500. My Bora costs around 600 to fill up weekly (2400 right there) + another $1000 in insurance/patentes, etc. Tolls to town, another 30 round trip each time you drive in (or more depending where you live).

 

[AdrianB1983]

It's a little too far from Capital but the best place to me is Adrogué (I live quite near, in Jose Marmol). Much safer than any zona norte neighborhood as there are no hardcore slums near and it's not that expensive. If you need to travel every day to capital then it may not be the better option. If you only have to travel during weekends to enjoy nightlife and own a car it's great.

 

[Matiasba]

I beg to differ with almost everyone concerning insecurity. I find BsAs safe, of course not at european levels, but very safe overall. I go to countries in Pilar since 1980, and almost lived in San Isisdro like for 4 years, and never had a single problem. Not even an ugly face I crossed.
Besides, due to the heavy social plans this government has, and after 11 years of growth with social inclusion, poverty numbers are at their best, at least since 2001 crisis.
So crime is fine in general, theres too much propaganda on TV about not real cases, yes you have to take precautions, to look around, but like in any big city of the world. The more common crime is pickpocketing and other kind is rare to happen.

To the OP, please search of the last threads talking of insecurity, you will find that in general is ok, except from some forum members that tend to exagerate. Buenos Aires is by far the safest of big cities in Latin America. Of course, I repeat, not at european levels.