Stay away from this apartment rental

From another forum, excellent advice on how to get a deposit back:

"Most foreigners don't know this, but it is very hard to evict someone in Buenos Aires, even for not paying rent.
If you are concerned about not getting the deposit back, you can simply not pay the last month's rent and have the deposit used towards the last month. The lawsuit to kick you out of the apartment will take at least 6 months, and by then you will have left.
Another, less aggressive way is that when you turn over the keys and they inspect the apartment, and when they agree that there was no damage, to hand over the deposit in cash. They will of course say that they cannot, but just sit on the couch, keys in hand, and say
"no hay problema, puedo esperar."
Smile.
They will yell, just sit there and say
"todo bien, hay un cajero automatico a pocas cuadras, puedo esperar. no hay problema."
repeat.
Even if they call the cops on you, the cops will not be able to evict you, and they WON'T call the cops.

Once I rented a place for three years and they wanted to use my deposit to repaint the apartment! I told them that after three years repainting is normal upkeep, not damage.
Boy did they yell! And my husband started to yell!
It was nasty. . . but I got my deposit back."
 
SaraSara said:
From another forum, excellent advice on how to get a deposit back:

"
Another, less aggressive way is that when you turn over the keys and they inspect the apartment, and when they agree that there was no damage, to hand over the deposit in cash. They will of course say that they cannot, but just sit on the couch, keys in hand, and say
"no hay problema, puedo esperar."
Smile.
They will yell, just sit there and say
"todo bien, hay un cajero automatico a pocas cuadras, puedo esperar. no hay problema."
repeat.


I did that once, it worked but after many yells (not from me, I was keeping on saying "bueno, me quedo entonces !" with a big smile).

Another very important point if you don't get your deposit immediately is before handing the keys, to sign a statement that you are leaving the apartment in good condition (or add an issue if there's any).
If you don't leave with such a statement, afterwards the LL can say whatever he wants and you'll have nothing to prove him wrong.

Another thing (caution : I need to check again, I'm sure I've read it) : the deposit should be given back added with interests (in accordance with the INDEC rate if I recall). Another motive for one more melodrama a la italiana.
 
French jurist said:
She was no Madoff neither, in fact she was not very clever (to tell you the truth she reminds me of my ex-wife or future-ex wife since I'm still married : likely an interesting girl, cute, liking art & fashion, but with a berzerk side and a strange relation to money).
Sorry to hear about your future ex, these things always materialize long after the glow begins to fade.
As for that satanic, sleazy, steaming pile of MF dog shit AKA Madoff; invoking his name makes my skin crawl. My arse is still burning and will continue to do so for the rest of my life. May he find a hundred husbands in prison. Unfortunately justice is not always just.
 
ghost said:
Sorry to hear about your future ex, these things always materialize long after the glow begins to fade.
As for that satanic, sleazy, steaming pile of MF dog shit AKA Madoff; invoking his name makes my skin crawl. My arse is still burning and will continue to do so for the rest of my life. May he find a hundred husbands in prison. Unfortunately justice is not always just.

Well, if you ask me, the whole economical system is a Ponzi scheme.
As for Madoff, too bad though he ruined quite many charities...
 
Ok, about deposits that are devolved.

The ley de alquileres :
http://www.inquilinos.org.ar/leyalquiler.asp

Art. 4to.- FIANZAS O DEPOSITOS DE GARANTIA
Fianzas o depósitos en garantía. Las cantidades entregadas en concepto de fianza o depósito en garantía , deberán serlo en moneda de curso legal. Dichas cantidades serán devueltas reajustadas por los mismos índices utilizados durante el transcurso del contrato al finalizar la locación.


It means that if you rental contract shows an indexation clausula (like referring to the INDEC or whatever), the deposit must be given back with interests using the same reference.

But quite usually, raises are imposed or negotiated. In this case (no external indexing), it wouldn't be surprising if it could be legit to ask back for the deposit raised by the same percentage your rental fees were increased (like you payed 1000 the first year and 1300 the second year. Your deposit was initially 2000, you should get back 2600 if there's no damage in the house).
 
I had started writing a post yesterday but can't actually remember if I posted it, so sorry if this is a repeat!

Beware that WHO IS does not necessarily give you the ID of the person that is actually running a website... it is just the ID of whoever registered the domain. IE in the situation that someone wanted to buy a domain name and they didn't have a valid credit card (often the case in Argentina) they may ask someone else to buy the domain name for them. This is a little bit tricky since then that person owns the site and could always take it down.

I know you have other evidence, and maybe I haven't read this all through in detail, but while those participating in the thread feel it's a clearcut case, all I'm trying to say is that WHO IS doesn't necessarily lead you to the right person.
 
quote of TomAtAlki
"Why would a person rent out an apartment cheap (apparently under market) to make $200US at the end of the rental period?"

Some possibilities:
1. Arrogance; self-delusion:
A landlord who knows he's a very special person who deserves way more from life. The world will just have to adjust to this. No victim with half a brain will object because the very fact that he's been humiliated so easily proves that the landlord is smarter and more deserving.

2. Jealousy; bitterness:
Why should these foreigners who deserve less than me have more money when they're trash? It's a badge of honour and success, and completely justified to deceive and defraud jerks.

3. Addictive personality, opportunistic, anti-social:
A landlord has become addicted to risk-taking and needs the high it gives him when his so carefully laid trap (no rental contract, a nice-guy facade, impeccable focus on the con) come to fruition in that irrevocable second when the victim discovers with a jolt that he's misplaced his trust and can't do a thing about it. Don't forget to chill the champagne for tomorrow night! ....It's not about the size of the treasure but the size of an ego, and an inability to change unless caught, exposed and penalized.
 
LAtoBA said:
You and Bailey seem to be missing the point. What I said had nothing to do with you and her and your particular incident. I don't need to read the thread again. You seem to be stuck on your issue, but what I find troubling has nothing to with that. It was more about moderation. Forget it.

ETA: There's nothing wrong about warning the public about a potential scam and saying, "Hey this happened to me with so and so who is renting out this apartment. I recommend you don't do business with him/her. By the way he/she has a new ad up on craigslist just so you know and can be aware....here's the link". There's also nothing wrong with giving advice like, "Report her to AFIP, or do this or that". But when people start digging up photos, numbers, law associations, etc etc within a matter of hours I think that's a problem, especially if an accusation hasn't been completely verified. You are messing with someone's career, with someone's reputation that could have lasting consequences.

My point was I think this is where the moderators should have stepped in to lay some boundaries. I think this became a free for all and a quest for blood by board members who are rightfully angry and frustrated after being scammed in Argentina. Hey it could just be the fact that public records are so readily accessible is what makes me uncomfortable. Again let me repeat I don't think this woman is innocent. I'm talking about situations like this in the future. Okay anyway good night folks and carry on as you wish.

Hey now, I already said I misread your post on the first go and explained how she could have defended herself if she wanted to. What I said about Florencia Daud rings true for any future cases similar to mine, which at this point is no longer about my measly $200 deposit that I've long since forgotten about so, no, this isn't "Bailey Essrog vs. Florencia Daud" anymore. Because this is a public forum, any of the accused will have an opportunity to tell their side of the story. In fact, we should all welcome it. Like I tried with Florencia Daud before the thread really took off, anyone can get a hold of the person's contact info and shoot them an e-mail saying they're being slated on the forum and that they need to do something about it. I also don't feel we did anything wrong here to warrant a slap on the wrist from moderators.
 
While this thread might have veered a bit off track lately, the volume of on-line research and helpful suggestions at the outset deserves a hearty round of applause! The cheaters and scammers are far outnumbered by honest and hardworking Argentinos in the temporary rental business..and these cheats richly deserve to be exposed. This protects wary tenants and protects honest landlords from being lumped together with the thieves. Well done.
 
LA to BA:
Re your comments of:
“But when people start digging up photos, numbers, law associations, etc etc within a matter of hours I think that's a problem”,
“You seem to be stuck on your issue, but what I find troubling has nothing to with that. It was more about moderation.”
“You are messing with someone's career, with someone's reputation that could have lasting consequences.” And
“Hey it could just be the fact that public records are so readily accessible is what makes me uncomfortable.”
Clearly, you don’t need to worry. The fact that this thread is intact and online implies that it has been properly moderated and that defamation has not occurred. You seem to think that people should start from a blank slate of having no information and remain uninformed because you call searching and finding published information “digging” and a “problem”. Didn’t you have to conduct research during your education?
No victim in connection with warning others of danger by reporting a crime has to sustain alone the impact of that by not finding out how that person has been conducting her business affairs, who else has been hurt and how, and generally the extent of dishonesty, and how to redress it. Ditto readers and contributors.
When we’ve known for over a decade at least how quickly info can be accessed, how genuine can our surprise be? It’s impressive, yes, to see what we understood beforehand occur in real time. Perhaps a century ago some felt it dangerous or uncouth to get from point A to B so quickly in a car but we probably didn’t tell this new kind of driver to stay home, ride a horse or cover the car with a blanket so as to not shock our sensibilities by moving so far so fast. A decade later, Henry Ford was mass-producing cars for the middle class. Quicker and broader access to published info is just another development in speed and breadth.
There is no duty of secrecy owed to the perpetrator of this fraud by Bailey, the defrauded renter, nor by we readers and contributors in respect of the published info reprinted, linked and shared here. We don’t live in China. Freedoms that exist only in important documents and that “shouldn’t” be exercised wouldn’t deserve the name.
Are you aware that this temporary rental industry being unregulated means that a landlord receiving rent doesn’t even have to provide the temporary tenant a written rental contract? Or that Argentina’s court system is not practically accessible to any visitor who must fly home as soon as a fraud is completed because the fraud was designed to separate the victim from all access to justice?
It’s easy to do nothing about injurious acts committed upon people. All one has to do to justify turning a blind eye to anything or everything is to propose a hugely generalized ‘what if - oh dear’ scenario as you have so as to ignore, in this instance, the significance of a fraud and its impact upon Bailey, a traveler like you and me. This thread with its mixed fact and opinion has stayed respectably clear of theory and speculation in order to not make wild suppositions or rash and unbased judgments about anyone. I think we’re proud of that. We’re examining a real event, not a theory or notion as you are. This is called “focusing on the problem” and not, may I argue, as being “stuck on our issue”. Focusing reduces the urge to defame or blow off steam. By the way, if you should temporarily rent in BA, this is your issue as much as yours as anyone if you respond to apartment ads.
It’s preposterous to be told that the human ability to read, find published facts, analyze, compare them and then draw or question one another’s and one’s own conclusions – something humanity has been doing since the birth of text - could potentially be an affront to modern society and a fraudster’s good reputation just because we don’t have to trek with 200 pounds on our back uphill thousands of miles to reach far-flung sources of published information . Especially when a lot of that info is out there because the perpetrator advertised her services and high standards towards clients to glean more business. She has been involved in offering online to the foreign public language training, cooking lessons, short rentals of her own property and other tourist services. She has advertised proficiency as a practicing lawyer on 3 continents in order to attract more clients. Thereby she held herself out as being formally bound to a higher than usual standard of care in her dealings with members of the public.
No acts but the perpetrator’s own can or have hurt the perpetrator’s reputation. Her choice of behavior is doing that, presuming it has been sullied. The burden of being personally responsible for one’s acts and their impact does not shift and convert to a duty to secrecy incumbent those hurt or incensed by that fraud.
Compiling and dispersing published info by using a computer available in even the most backward spots on earth is not wrong just because it exposes an intentional fraud by an individual who happens to have a business and used it to commit that fraud.
 
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