Trying To Move Asap To Buenos Aires

[Hybrid Ambassador]

"[background=rgb(252, 252, 252)]So, do I switch now, and not have debts"[/background]

[background=rgb(252, 252, 252)]I vote for no debt. How many young folks are graduating today in the US with $100K debts and ending up working as baristas - it's a major scam! 10 years ago car loans were a much bigger part of total debt than student loan debt - now it's reversed (see chart)[/background]

[background=rgb(252, 252, 252)]Seems like for you Argentina is a good choice for school. And then perhaps you can go back after you graduate and work a few years earning a US income.[/background]

[background=rgb(252, 252, 252)]

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Yeah, whilst at Toyota long time ago, being scrutinising car loan application sent in and when I seen student loan being paid as agreed, "inmmediate OK for this young person's car finance application" those young chaps that has the courage to keep paying off their immensely huge student loan balance, are to be coming out very useful and soon they would prosper in the world of mature society thus once can gamble on them not to defaul anytime soon! But as soon as I seen the "derog" late or just awaful re-payment habit from many then NO GO !

 

[Montauk_Project]

I work in the film industry. Got my undergrad at Colombia in History, came here, spent two or three years studying acting/teaching English/being young and then studied film down here. I highly recommend the film schools down here, there are also many good professionals who give private classes. You will learn to film with no resources and solve problems, if you choose to go back to the US you will be able to produce with 10% of what they use up there.
Remember, film is a profession that does not value degrees much, in fact, you can study at a school like the FUC without taking your HS equivilancy, they will give you an "unofficial" dimploma that means nothing legally, but you can hang on your wall, and no employer will care. You can also study at the UBA, it will take about 7 years, it is free but you need your HS equivilancy.
As film is such a hard profession to break into, I suggest getting a degree in something else, something you like, maybe related to film, but something more solid so you can have a plan B. Also, in addition to film school you need to become an EXPERT at one thing. Something technical, like color correction, special effects, film accounting, sound recording, etc so you are employable. Film school can give you a very general education but to make money you need to be an expert in something (this applys to the US and here). It is a long road to be a director, and most people do not direct professionally, so you need to be able to support yourself. Plan on taking additional classes or doing an internship (unpaid) to get this skill.
I have directed two films but I don´t live off of that, it is my technical skills as an editor and also having a production company that keeps food on the table.
Your plan to get jobs in the film industry to support yourself is not realistic. There are 14000 film school students in Buenos Aires, in the entire industry there are maybe 1000-3000 jobs per year (and most are jobs for only the duration of the film, 4-6 weeks). There are 400 production companies in Buenos Aires, 90% have NO employees, meaning they are one person operations who hire free-lancers on a per-job basis. Estimate 1-3 years working for FREE to break into the film industry, to get your first paying job. Estimate 3-7 years to be able to live off of it (there are exceptions, some people get lucky or have an amazing skill. Note that I didn´t say talent, talent doesn´t count, but being the best chroma corrector does. Sound people always get jobs).
I love the film industry in Argentina, without the support of people here I would have never become a director. It is much nicer than working in Hollywood, there are some jerks but you can avoid them.
Also, there are many jobs in TV that could be had and other industries (filming parties, web videos, etc)

 

[natykerouac]

I work in the film industry. Got my undergrad at Colombia in History, came here, spent two or three years studying acting/teaching English/being young and then studied film down here. I highly recommend the film schools down here, there are also many good professionals who give private classes. You will learn to film with no resources and solve problems, if you choose to go back to the US you will be able to produce with 10% of what they use up there.
Remember, film is a profession that does not value degrees much, in fact, you can study at a school like the FUC without taking your HS equivilancy, they will give you an "unofficial" dimploma that means nothing legally, but you can hang on your wall, and no employer will care. You can also study at the UBA, it will take about 7 years, it is free but you need your HS equivilancy.
As film is such a hard profession to break into, I suggest getting a degree in something else, something you like, maybe related to film, but something more solid so you can have a plan B. Also, in addition to film school you need to become an EXPERT at one thing. Something technical, like color correction, special effects, film accounting, sound recording, etc so you are employable. Film school can give you a very general education but to make money you need to be an expert in something (this applys to the US and here). It is a long road to be a director, and most people do not direct professionally, so you need to be able to support yourself. Plan on taking additional classes or doing an internship (unpaid) to get this skill.
I have directed two films but I don´t live off of that, it is my technical skills as an editor and also having a production company that keeps food on the table.
Your plan to get jobs in the film industry to support yourself is not realistic. There are 14000 film school students in Buenos Aires, in the entire industry there are maybe 1000-3000 jobs per year (and most are jobs for only the duration of the film, 4-6 weeks). There are 400 production companies in Buenos Aires, 90% have NO employees, meaning they are one person operations who hire free-lancers on a per-job basis. Estimate 1-3 years working for FREE to break into the film industry, to get your first paying job. Estimate 3-7 years to be able to live off of it (there are exceptions, some people get lucky or have an amazing skill. Note that I didn´t say talent, talent doesn´t count, but being the best chroma corrector does. Sound people always get jobs).
I love the film industry in Argentina, without the support of people here I would have never become a director. It is much nicer than working in Hollywood, there are some jerks but you can avoid them.
Also, there are many jobs in TV that could be had and other industries (filming parties, web videos, etc)

This is very helpful, thank you!
I experienced some machismo attitudes in Argentina, and wonder if this affects the industry at all? It's encouraging to see that you like it though.
As far as the high school exams go, is it possible for foreign students to take them? Would I have to take them before or after applying to UBA (for example)? And would that require going there in person, coming back to US, applyng, then going back for school?
What other degree would you suggest for plan B, that actually gets people jobs there? I'm not sure what I'd want to study. English, or teaching?
Do you think working in the film industry first in LA would help get a head start, or does it need to start from the ground up there, to build connections and all?
Is the TV industry more viable than film? Would I be able to support myself off of that?
Sorry, so many questions. thank you!!

 

[natykerouac]

Hi there, I am an expat originally from New York City and have lived here in Buenos Aires for 7 years. I followed my "dream" and came to live here, already in my late 30s at the time, now in my mid 40s. I found a job immediately upon arrival. I was working for a US based company within 3 weeks of arriving, without having even sent a single résumé while I was in the US. However I was already bilingual english-castellano prior to coming here, so if you are truly bilingual you will definitely have an advantage. Salaries here are LOW especially if you are young and have little work experience. When I first got here 7 years ago, I was earning $6,000 pesos, which was about double what my co-workers were earning. At the time it was equivalent to $2,000 U$D when the dollar and peso were 3:1, so it was considered a "good" salary. That salary today, which many people still earn, is worth around $500 U$D and is barely enough to live on. Today you need at least an $8,000-$10,000 peso salary to live on your own and be able to have any quality of life and decent health insurance. Teaching English you can make some money to survive but very low budget, and paying student loans from here while you are earning pesos will be next to impossible since you will have no way to wire the money out of the country. While breaking into the film industry is VERY difficult, it's not impossible, but you will need savings to survive untll you start to make money doing it. Your first jobs will certainly be grunt work and while that may be okay for you as a young person, it will not feed you. If I were you I would finish school in the US, make some contacts via internet and keep in touch with those you already have. Save up some money, get your student loans deferred for 6 months or a year and then come down and try your luck. Make sure you have things in order back home before you try making it here, because if for some reason it doesn't work out, you don't want to have a big financial mess waiting for you back home. Good luck and follow your dreams, but make sure you PLAN carefull, in this case I would NOT throw caution to the wind.

I haven't heard about the wiring money problem, could you explain that more?
If I get my loans deferred, I'll still have to pay them off living in Argentina and with my peso salary, right? Woudl you suggest I try to pay them off as I go while in school in the US?

 

[natykerouac]

I agree with the above, I recommend moving. Even if you get an incredibly expensive U.S. liberal arts degree, you're even less likely to find a job with it in the U.S. than you are here. And like Joe mentioned, why saddle yourself with all that debt for nothing? Since you're bilingual, there's a lot of good job opportunities for you, at least to keep you afloat. You can start off teaching, but I'd recommend trying to break into translation. It's what my bilingual girlfriend and her sister do, and it helps because they can do it from home and just freelance.

Don't be too worried about culture shock. I had more culture shock living in Amsterdam than I have here.

How are the salaries for translating and teaching there? Enough to live on? Would it be hard for a 19 year old to work in translation? Would I need to get some sort of degree in Argentina to be able to teach English?
Ah, yeah of course, I was referring to my culture shock coming back to America. I had no culture shock in Argentina..I felt quite at home!!

 

[natykerouac]

I would suggest that US university education is still far superior to what you can get in Argentina, especially with all the disruptions that occur in Argentine universities. Certainly some people overcome those obstacles but, on balance, US universities are better. That's unless, of course, you choose something like http://www.bju.edu/ (who chose their URL, anyway?) or http://www.oru.edu/ (no relation?).

What sort of disruptions?

 

[natykerouac]

There are a number of people on this list who actually work in the film industry here in BA. They can give you the realities of that world.

Regarding US university and student debt - If you can get a decent job that will help you pay off your student loan and still have money left over for a real life then that path will work. The question is really about your job prospects. I'm almost 50 and have just now paid off my undergraduate and graduate school student loans. For my career path (Business) it worked because many employers in that field are looking at the quality of your degree + experience and I had degrees from two highly regarded schools.

At the same time, you can get a liberal arts degree and be saddled with heavy debts right out of school. Try paying those off while waiting tables at Olive Garden! We have two kids here in Argentina. I've recommended to my daughter to get her undergrad here in BA and then, if she wants, get her graduate degree in the US.

In my opinion, consumerism is rampant in the US. We all had to have new(ish) cars, and houses, and a boat, and a truck to pull the boat, and furniture, and university degrees, and landscaping, and new flatscreen tvs, ... and ... and ... all of that is bought on credit. It is almost impossible to escape. Having a life with very little or no debt frees you to do what you really want to do. Just think about quitting your 9-5 job that pays for all that stuff in order to pursue what fulfills you. Not going to happen.

So would you say a US degree truly helps to get jobs in Argentina? Or it depends on the field? Like would a film degree help get jobs unrelated to film, simply because it's from a good university in the US? Or it should be field-specific? Because of course film degrees are not required for any job in film..

 

[natykerouac]

I think we can give advice but we don't know you so it's rather difficult to tell you what to do. The advantages of coming here is that you can study on the cheap and get a decent undergraduate degree without being saddled with a huge debt. Later, if you need a U.S. degree you can go on to get a masters in the U.S. in whatever you want. Definitely a huge advantage for you, and though schools here may not be on par with schools in the U.S., I think in this field you can find some quality schools, for sure in Capital. The downside is the work issue. You are going to have a hard time making a living here as a young person. Most young people here have the advantage of living at home into their late twenties or even thirties, so they have few financial duties. The money they make goes towards their clothes, school, and living expenses, so a high salary is really not necessary for them. But you don't have a family here, so finding a place to live, a job that pays enough to live off of, and getting everything you need done will be difficult to the utmost. Not impossible, but very difficult. Don't say we didn't warn you. Also, be prepared that studying at universities here is extremely bureaucratic and the system is annoyingly different. But a degree from a university here is not as worthless as some might now chime in and tell you.

The upside on staying in the U.S. is that you know what to expect and your family can help you out more. You can find a good university with ease, and it will be a very safe choice, at least for now. The big downside is that you will be saddled with huge debts when you get done. If you can't get a good job it will be a massive burden to you down the road. Student debt can become a major hamper on a person's life, so Argentina is well worth your consideration or another country if you feel like you can put up with the disorder, the culture shock, the bureaucracy, and learning the lay of the land.

Also, you are young, so if you try this and it doesn't work out, you can always go back home. You only live once is my philosophy. Some people that live their lives "safe" never end up happy, but bored and empty. If you come here, though, understand it is NOT a bed of roses. This is a tough place to live, a dog eat dog world, especially capital. Hope that helps.

I completely agree..I really dislike the idea of having an American-dream style future...not really passionate about anything..everything stable..nothing worth living for. No thanks!
Would you say it'd be hard for me to work especially because I'm young, and when I'm older, people will look at me more seriously for translation/teaching jobs, or any job that requires English speaking? Or could I feasibly find something good involving that now?

 

[natykerouac]

I've been back in the US for a little over 5 weeks and am already ready to move back to Argentina for this very reason. Buy, buy, buy!

To the OP, I would suggest that you go for it, but keep in mind that getting an undergraduate degree here is a long-term project. Few people finish an undergraduate degree in fewer than five years. Many take much longer, working during the process.

Also, you won't be able to "finish" your degree here, you'll have to start from the beginning and, in addition, pass high school equivalency exams that will probably take a full year, depending on your level of Spanish. There are several threads on BAExpats that describe in detail what you need to do study an undergraduate degree.

Edit: Here is one of the threads:

http://baexpats.org/...ate#entry198568

I included a link in that thread that describes the process. Also, search for "undergraduate" and you'll find other related threads.

Hope this helps and that things work out.

Thanks for the helpful links!!
Do you know anything about study abroad in UBA or la Plata? Would it be easier to take a year off from school, study in Argentina, get rid of a year of tuition?

 

[Napoleon]

Yes, there is. Thanks go to sleslie for posting the information.

This also raises the question of whether or not getting an undergraduate degree in Argentina would prepare someone to pass the tests required to get into grad school in the USA

They don't have tests that you have to "pass" to get into grad school.

They have GRE, GMAT, MCAT, LSAT... these are standardized tests that can measure your logistical thought process, your vocabulary, your reading comprehension, your math, your essay writing skills... but all of these tests have prep books and prep courses. Medical School will have science requirements, but a biology class for majors here in Buenos Aires, with a photocopied English text book is going to equal a biology course in the US. The same with a Chemistry course, and Physics course... and if you don't have specific courses that you need, you can always go back to the US and take one or two individual courses from a public university in your home state.