Warning about working at one time events in bars/restaurants

[Dmiller]

Hey yall. For all you newbies who are looking for work in BA becarefull about working in bars and restaurants . They usually tell you " oh yeah its so many pesos plus tips!" so it doesnt sound so bad but well the tips are a lie. There is usually one or two locals working as a waiter and a couple of newbie expats. Well needless to say they usually try to make you leave early before the night ends so they dont have to share the tips. I got ripped off once but the second time ohhh no i wasnt going to leave till they gave me some tips.

A fellow expat and i were working at a place called complejo tango its location is 2608 av belgrano. they tolded us oh yeah it will 60 peosos plus you get about 100- 200 pesos in tips. Well an hr before the night was about to end they tried to push us out the door. We werent going to have this. they were trying to tell us oh the second night you work you get tips. Ofc we knew there wasnt going to be a second night so we werent going to leave untill the night had ended. Well after 20 mins of protesting they said ok stay and you can share the tips. the local waitress was trying to get us to do tasks down stairs when the night was ending so she could clean the tables herself . Well this didnt work either. We finished the work fast and got upstairs to help collect the tips.

We got our share of the tips. We might be expats but we are not stupid. Please dont let anyone try to take advantage of you even if its just for 5 pesos . Cause they think they can get away with it. Expats won this time and i hope it makes them think twice before trying it again.

 

[expatinowncountry]

Sorry but I think your position Expats vs Locals is not constructive and if that is the way you see your interaction with the Argies you won't get much from your stay here (except for the tips).
In any case, good you got your fair share of your work.

 

[mulderfox]

2 things i`m gonna say first not all customers tip so donpt expect too much money out of it. second in most places the waiter gets the tips of the tables he waited himself

 

[Davidglen77]

A very similar thing happened to a friend I had here who has since gone back to Australia. Saw an advertisement looking for waitresses at a tango / dinner show in San Telmo on Perú near Estados Unidos. They offered nightly salary plus tips. The first night she worked got $40 pesos, and when she asked about the tips they told her the host collects them and gives them to the waiters at the end of the week. When she went to ask for her tips she at the end of the week, she was told the money was in the safe and they couldn't open it at night. The enitre dining room were North American and Brasilian tourists who were told that they have to leave a tip of $10 dollars per person (one of the waiters told her this). She asked the next week about the tips for the days she worked and they fired her and said she was just on a trial period and would not get any tips. She told me this, so knowing how things are here I went with her to Correo Argentino and sent a carta documento demanding that they regularize her employment according to the law. The next day her phone rang, it was the manager of the club, he asked her to come in, offered her $1,000 pesos to sign an acta that she would take that money and not take any legal action against them. She called me to tell me this and I told her to ask for $2,000 pesos, which they counter offered to $1,500. She took the money and signed the document and that was it. Make sure salary and payment terms are clear before accepting any employment, THIS IS ARGENTINA FOLKS!!

 

[Dmiller]

Sorry but I think your position Expats vs Locals is not constructive and if that is the way you see your interaction with the Argies you won't get much from your stay here (except for the tips).
In any case, good you got your fair share of your work.

Thats not the way i see it thats just what happened to me more than once. Argentines will definitely test your will and all i am saying is that dont let them or anyone else in this world push you around or take advantage of you. I love Argentina ( Besides their driving) and i dont plan on leaving anytime soon.

 

[Napoleon]

Sorry but I think your position Expats vs Locals is not constructive and if that is the way you see your interaction with the Argies you won't get much from your stay here (except for the tips).

I think that Expats don't realize that this mindset exists until they get screwed over a time or two.

Tensions were boiling over in a friendly Saturday morning soccer match ever since one Saturday the Argentines decided to split the teams Argentina vs England (plus one former Yugoslavian dude). They locals expected to crush the Euros... but when it was quickly 10-2 for the English team of mostly bar going 20-somethings, things went down hill.

Week after week the teams were split Argentina vs Expats. The games got rougher (from the Argentine side). Eventually some of the English players went back to England because their time was done, but tensions remained strongly "Argentines versus the world" even when the teams were intermixed again.

It came to a head one Saturday when one American guy was crushed in the back during the run of play by an opposing player and flew head first into another player's chest in a very vulnerable position. (His head snapped back, but fortunately he didn't sustain a serious energy.) Clear foul, would have arguably been a red card in a real game situation.

But when the American guy got up from the ground and was like "WTF?!?!", it was an Argentine guy from his own team who came over and shoved him in the chest looking to fight. This made no sense what-so-ever unless you understood that often times there can be an underlying resentment that leads to "Argentines vs Expats". It's not always there, but it can also be there when you would not expect it.

It's best to be prepared and not to "give the benefit of the doubt" when you've been screwed before. Part of it is that this happens in a big city. Part is that it happens to "newbies". But then part of it is because sometimes Argentines (or any Latin American citizen) think that if you can travel to BsAs and live, then you can perhaps do without your share of the tips. Not always, but it's not surprising either.

 

[HeyBA]

Hey Napoleon (and anyone else)

Has that kind of thing, the silly, unwarranted social meanness, like taking the other team's side in a fight against your foreign teammate, increased in the past year or so, in your opinion?

 

[ElQueso]

Nothing is black and white here, not even necessarily working in black or white. I've posted many times about the prejudice we have faced, myself not too much as a Yanqui, but my wife and her family a whole lot as Paraguayans.

The guys who say everything is imagined, Argentinos aren't like that, you just had a bad break; well, in my opinion they are not cognizant of the total reality of living here yet.

It becomes a bit more complicated because the truth is, a lot of the things that have been described here in this thread are not necessarily Argentine vs Expat. It is what the Argentines themselves often do to each other as well. Most of my direct experience comes as being an expat and being married to an expat from another country, although I have heard sufficient anecdotes from Argentine friends who they've been screwed around similarly.

My wife's older sister works as a chef in Puerto Madero currently. She went through three years of school, got her certificate, and has worked at 6 different food service places, 4 of them being restaraunts and two being places where they make sandwiches, tortas, salads and such.

In EVERY SINGLE ONE OF THEM she has been screwed one way or another by some of the similar things I see mentioned here. There have been problems getting tips from those in charge of collecting. There have been statements of one salary, the reality being completely different when it comes time to be paid. There have been agreements of what the job entails, but never happens. There have been times when the money just didn't get paid, she was told repeatedly the money would be there the following day and it never made it into her hands. Promises of working in the white that turn out to be pure crap and she's sent home before she hits three months and has to work in the white.

But the thing is, she works with other Argentinos that have the same problems. It's not just necessarily an Argentina vs Foreigner attitude (although that attitude, believe me, exists as well!!).

My brothers-in-law and their cousins have worked a number of different jobs, including construction, stockers in "chino" supermarkets, and they now currently work in a Paraguayan-owned verduleria.

In the construction businesses, they were mostly run by Argentine owners, but with Paraguayan encargados. The crew lead always worked fairly with them, but somehow when it came time to get paid (once a month at the first, to pay the previous month), the money NEVER came on time. There were always reasons. One of the funniest (to me) reasons was because the owner was on vacation! It was a VERY common excuse. Sometimes payday would come as much as 10-12 days late. Once the entire crew quit because the money never came. One problem there is that the few Argentinos who came to work didn't last more than a couple of weeks (the longest lasting) because the work was long and hard, and they would show up late, goof off when they were at work, and not show up some days (particularly Mondays) because they'd been out partying the night before. And the Argentine owners know their Paraguayan employees fairly well - most of them never complain to the proper authorities due to "verguenza." Even when they work in white, which my brothers-in-law have. I can't convince them to go down and file against these companies!

The chino supermarkets were different in that the work was hard, the pay was relatively low, and the owners typically shouted and threatened a lot, but they were reasonably fair for the most part. They never made promises they didn't keep, they'd get rid of people who didn't work and reward people who did. They were NEVER late with their payments.

The Paraguayan verdulerias they've worked for have turned out to be the best places so far. They pay relatively decently, treat the employees good (no matter where they come from - as long as they work, and the Argentine workers usually don't last, just like the construction work) and always pay on time.

I have a friend of mine who explains some things of the Argentine culture thusly: "If an Argentino sees the chance to screw you out of something and doesn't take it, he's considered and idiot for not having doing so."

I'm not saying that EVERYONE here is like that, but there is a lot of attitude exactly like that here, doesn't matter too much if it's between Argentinos themselves, or Agentinos and expats of whatever origin. Too many people looking to get an advantage out of what they can with little regard how that makes them look in the future to either a client or an employee because there are always other clients and other employees.

When looking for jobs here that are not high-end office-type jobs, beware. Particularly beware if your job is in "black." There are always ways to get what's coming to you, but if you're a short-timer looking to augment your cashflow while you're here, you may have troubles at times getting what you think you were promised.

 

[Davidglen77]

Nothing is black and white here, not even necessarily working in black or white. I've posted many times about the prejudice we have faced, myself not too much as a Yanqui, but my wife and her family a whole lot as Paraguayans.

The guys who say everything is imagined, Argentinos aren't like that, you just had a bad break; well, in my opinion they are not cognizant of the total reality of living here yet.

It becomes a bit more complicated because the truth is, a lot of the things that have been described here in this thread are not necessarily Argentine vs Expat. It is what the Argentines themselves often do to each other as well. Most of my direct experience comes as being an expat and being married to an expat from another country, although I have heard sufficient anecdotes from Argentine friends who they've been screwed around similarly.

My wife's older sister works as a chef in Puerto Madero currently. She went through three years of school, got her certificate, and has worked at 6 different food service places, 4 of them being restaraunts and two being places where they make sandwiches, tortas, salads and such.

In EVERY SINGLE ONE OF THEM she has been screwed one way or another by some of the similar things I see mentioned here. There have been problems getting tips from those in charge of collecting. There have been statements of one salary, the reality being completely different when it comes time to be paid. There have been agreements of what the job entails, but never happens. There have been times when the money just didn't get paid, she was told repeatedly the money would be there the following day and it never made it into her hands. Promises of working in the white that turn out to be pure crap and she's sent home before she hits three months and has to work in the white.

But the thing is, she works with other Argentinos that have the same problems. It's not just necessarily an Argentina vs Foreigner attitude (although that attitude, believe me, exists as well!!).

My brothers-in-law and their cousins have worked a number of different jobs, including construction, stockers in "chino" supermarkets, and they now currently work in a Paraguayan-owned verduleria.

In the construction businesses, they were mostly run by Argentine owners, but with Paraguayan encargados. The crew lead always worked fairly with them, but somehow when it came time to get paid (once a month at the first, to pay the previous month), the money NEVER came on time. There were always reasons. One of the funniest (to me) reasons was because the owner was on vacation! It was a VERY common excuse. Sometimes payday would come as much as 10-12 days late. Once the entire crew quit because the money never came. One problem there is that the few Argentinos who came to work didn't last more than a couple of weeks (the longest lasting) because the work was long and hard, and they would show up late, goof off when they were at work, and not show up some days (particularly Mondays) because they'd been out partying the night before. And the Argentine owners know their Paraguayan employees fairly well - most of them never complain to the proper authorities due to "verguenza." Even when they work in white, which my brothers-in-law have. I can't convince them to go down and file against these companies!

The chino supermarkets were different in that the work was hard, the pay was relatively low, and the owners typically shouted and threatened a lot, but they were reasonably fair for the most part. They never made promises they didn't keep, they'd get rid of people who didn't work and reward people who did. They were NEVER late with their payments.

The Paraguayan verdulerias they've worked for have turned out to be the best places so far. They pay relatively decently, treat the employees good (no matter where they come from - as long as they work, and the Argentine workers usually don't last, just like the construction work) and always pay on time.

I have a friend of mine who explains some things of the Argentine culture thusly: "If an Argentino sees the chance to screw you out of something and doesn't take it, he's considered and idiot for not having doing so."

I'm not saying that EVERYONE here is like that, but there is a lot of attitude exactly like that here, doesn't matter too much if it's between Argentinos themselves, or Agentinos and expats of whatever origin. Too many people looking to get an advantage out of what they can with little regard how that makes them look in the future to either a client or an employee because there are always other clients and other employees.

When looking for jobs here that are not high-end office-type jobs, beware. Particularly beware if your job is in "black." There are always ways to get what's coming to you, but if you're a short-timer looking to augment your cashflow while you're here, you may have troubles at times getting what you think you were promised.

I couldn't have summed it up better myself!

 

[expatinowncountry]

Nothing is black and white here, not even necessarily working in black or white. I've posted many times about the prejudice we have faced, myself not too much as a Yanqui, but my wife and her family a whole lot as Paraguayans.

The guys who say everything is imagined, Argentinos aren't like that, you just had a bad break; well, in my opinion they are not cognizant of the total reality of living here yet.

It becomes a bit more complicated because the truth is, a lot of the things that have been described here in this thread are not necessarily Argentine vs Expat. It is what the Argentines themselves often do to each other as well. Most of my direct experience comes as being an expat and being married to an expat from another country, although I have heard sufficient anecdotes from Argentine friends who they've been screwed around similarly.

My wife's older sister works as a chef in Puerto Madero currently. She went through three years of school, got her certificate, and has worked at 6 different food service places, 4 of them being restaraunts and two being places where they make sandwiches, tortas, salads and such.

In EVERY SINGLE ONE OF THEM she has been screwed one way or another by some of the similar things I see mentioned here. There have been problems getting tips from those in charge of collecting. There have been statements of one salary, the reality being completely different when it comes time to be paid. There have been agreements of what the job entails, but never happens. There have been times when the money just didn't get paid, she was told repeatedly the money would be there the following day and it never made it into her hands. Promises of working in the white that turn out to be pure crap and she's sent home before she hits three months and has to work in the white.

But the thing is, she works with other Argentinos that have the same problems. It's not just necessarily an Argentina vs Foreigner attitude (although that attitude, believe me, exists as well!!).

My brothers-in-law and their cousins have worked a number of different jobs, including construction, stockers in "chino" supermarkets, and they now currently work in a Paraguayan-owned verduleria.

In the construction businesses, they were mostly run by Argentine owners, but with Paraguayan encargados. The crew lead always worked fairly with them, but somehow when it came time to get paid (once a month at the first, to pay the previous month), the money NEVER came on time. There were always reasons. One of the funniest (to me) reasons was because the owner was on vacation! It was a VERY common excuse. Sometimes payday would come as much as 10-12 days late. Once the entire crew quit because the money never came. One problem there is that the few Argentinos who came to work didn't last more than a couple of weeks (the longest lasting) because the work was long and hard, and they would show up late, goof off when they were at work, and not show up some days (particularly Mondays) because they'd been out partying the night before. And the Argentine owners know their Paraguayan employees fairly well - most of them never complain to the proper authorities due to "verguenza." Even when they work in white, which my brothers-in-law have. I can't convince them to go down and file against these companies!

The chino supermarkets were different in that the work was hard, the pay was relatively low, and the owners typically shouted and threatened a lot, but they were reasonably fair for the most part. They never made promises they didn't keep, they'd get rid of people who didn't work and reward people who did. They were NEVER late with their payments.

The Paraguayan verdulerias they've worked for have turned out to be the best places so far. They pay relatively decently, treat the employees good (no matter where they come from - as long as they work, and the Argentine workers usually don't last, just like the construction work) and always pay on time.

I have a friend of mine who explains some things of the Argentine culture thusly: "If an Argentino sees the chance to screw you out of something and doesn't take it, he's considered and idiot for not having doing so."

I'm not saying that EVERYONE here is like that, but there is a lot of attitude exactly like that here, doesn't matter too much if it's between Argentinos themselves, or Agentinos and expats of whatever origin. Too many people looking to get an advantage out of what they can with little regard how that makes them look in the future to either a client or an employee because there are always other clients and other employees.

When looking for jobs here that are not high-end office-type jobs, beware. Particularly beware if your job is in "black." There are always ways to get what's coming to you, but if you're a short-timer looking to augment your cashflow while you're here, you may have troubles at times getting what you think you were promised.

Thanks for making the point clear. I am half Argentine. I came back to this country to work after 10 years abroad... I arrived here with the whole family... and surprise, surprise, I am been paid half of what I was promised and I am not a construction worker but someone with a PhD. So it is not Argies vs Expat, or Skilled vs Unskilled people... it is the whole business culture/work ethic that is upside down. I have found some honest people so I do not want to generalize but overall the work experience has been negative. Of course, there are other good things here. I have lived in seven different countries and only a few cities in the world can offer the number of cultural events, BA has to offer. You can feel the city is alive.