What happens after USD $12,000?

[Quilombo]

Thanks for clearing this up, @Quilombo! Looks like I had some half-baked information.

Always happy to help, it can be very confusing sometimes

 

[AussieSurfer]

Like you, we are in the midst of the 3 year process of pensionista visa, which then allows a 15 year temporary residency. The rule requiring that you wire money directly to a bank has only been in effect less than a year. It has, in that time, been changed without notice pretty radically in various ways several times, and the amount is only announced after the start of each month. There is no

This visa would be so perfect for me could you give me more details how you apply for it and what you have to do like I'm a 5 year old child

 

[Paige55]

I think there's some confusion going on here, so let me try and clear things up (not an accountant or lawyer, as always):

- Undeclared limit for bringing physical dollars in to the country is and remains $10K USD (you can exceed it, but must declare it at the port of entry)
- There exists no limit for the amount of dollars you can send from your USD account abroad to your USD account in Argentina without pesifying via SWIFT provided said funds aren't the result of employment, and were obtained legally
- If you're a freelancer, you can bring in 12K USD a year without pesifying, after which you must convert the remainder to pesos at the BCRA exchange rate, same as when Massa was in power

Hi Quilombo, in my case (as a rentista) I'm transferring cash obtained via a trust that I receive to my US bank and send here. A month ago, my bank here (Santander) sent information that suggested-as I'm not registered with AFIP-that I can only send 4x the legal amount (and not the 5x requested by immigration).

I was told that the trust can't be registered with AFIP-as it's not income from work for a company abroad. So, it seems that I can only transfer 4x the minimum monthly salary. I don't mind pessifying income above 12k, I just don't want my account flagged for closure or to get denied renewal of my immigration status on my next go. I was advised not to go to the bank with my trust paperwork to show them the funds are of legit and of legal means.

Suggested, is that I open a separate account with a whole new bank to transfer the remainder-I'm not certain that would be flagged also, as both bank accounts are opened using the same DNI and likely reported easily to government bodies.

So in my case-rentista means that aren't retirement or wages earned and registered with AFIP...seems there's a bit of a wall to maneuver.

This is the text of the email they sent me mid-March:
We tell you that - in accordance with UIF Resolution 14/2023, which seeks to prevent money laundering and the financing of terrorism - we need to better understand your financial situation and the origin of your income.

That is why, if you do not have your formal activity registered in the AFIP (either because you do not currently work, you are a housewife or a student) you will be able to receive monthly credits in your account (cash deposits and/or transfers) for a maximum amount of up to 4 (four) minimum vital and mobile salaries (SMVM).

It is important that you know that, if you currently work in a dependent relationship and your work activity is already registered or if you receive retirement benefits reported in ANSES, this communication is informative in nature and you will be able to operate with your account without restrictions and it will not be necessary to make a update.

 

[Quilombo]

Hi Quilombo, in my case (as a rentista) I'm transferring cash obtained via a trust that I receive to my US bank and send here. A month ago, my bank here (Santander) sent information that suggested-as I'm not registered with AFIP-that I can only send 4x the legal amount (and not the 5x requested by immigration).

I was told that the trust can't be registered with AFIP-as it's not income from work for a company abroad. So, it seems that I can only transfer 4x the minimum monthly salary. I don't mind pessifying income above 12k, I just don't want my account flagged for closure or to get denied renewal of my immigration status on my next go. I was advised not to go to the bank with my trust paperwork to show them the funds are of legit and of legal means.

Suggested, is that I open a separate account with a whole new bank to transfer the remainder-I'm not certain that would be flagged also, as both bank accounts are opened using the same DNI and likely reported easily to government bodies.

So in my case-rentista means that aren't retirement or wages earned and registered with AFIP...seems there's a bit of a wall to maneuver.

This is the text of the email they sent me mid-March:
We tell you that - in accordance with UIF Resolution 14/2023, which seeks to prevent money laundering and the financing of terrorism - we need to better understand your financial situation and the origin of your income.

That is why, if you do not have your formal activity registered in the AFIP (either because you do not currently work, you are a housewife or a student) you will be able to receive monthly credits in your account (cash deposits and/or transfers) for a maximum amount of up to 4 (four) minimum vital and mobile salaries (SMVM).

It is important that you know that, if you currently work in a dependent relationship and your work activity is already registered or if you receive retirement benefits reported in ANSES, this communication is informative in nature and you will be able to operate with your account without restrictions and it will not be necessary to make a update.

Hey Paige,

I saw several other users reported this issue with Santander specifically, and you have a couple of options, depending on how much of a "fight" you want to put up. At least in your case, it's pretty straight forward since as the beneficiary of a trust, your income should simultaneously not be classified as employment income, and be exempt from any limits related to the 12K a year.

The banks, and Santander in particular, likely have gotten their wrists slapped by the UIF for not combatting money laundering, which your situation is clearly not a case of. That being said, the way things (don't) work in Argentina you may have to trigger the bank's KYC process before being able to sort it out, so I see two potential options for you:

- Change banks to one that is more competently run (I have Galicia, it's not perfect, but my experience is better than w/Santander)
- Send your money as normal, wait until Santander limits your inbound transfers, and then denounce them to the BCRA Consumer Ombudsman

Now, you can proactively try to avoid this by getting a DDJJ completed by a licensed accountant which outlines your source(s) of incomes, but generally speaking banks like most institutions here are reactionary, and wait for something to be an issue before doing something about it.

If you can make an appointment with your account executive they may be able to at least lead you on the process to start getting this sorted out, or they may simply dismiss you for being a pain in the ass (that's what they did to me).

Finally, in terms of registering with AFIP, you actually have to issue invoices, not just pay the monotributo, it's a multistep process, so I think it's best to go about this the proper way: having your bank understand your source of income as legal and, as far as I know, tax exempt.

Regardless at some point you will likely need a licensed public accountant, and they will have experience (or know someone who does) that can help with this so I'd suggest starting there.

 

[antipodean]

I was told that the trust can't be registered with AFIP-as it's not income from work for a company abroad. So, it seems that I can only transfer 4x the minimum monthly salary. I don't mind pessifying income above 12k, I just don't want my account flagged for closure or to get denied renewal of my immigration status on my next go. I was advised not to go to the bank with my trust paperwork to show them the funds are of legit and of legal means.

Fiscalidad Internacional | ARCA

Conocé toda la información relacionada con intercambios de información, acuerdos y demás instrumentos y operaciones entre países.

www.afip.gob.ar

You can register a trust with AFIP (in fact strictly speaking you are supposed to if you receive distributions from one and live in Argentina as there is an annual reporting requirement, independent of any taxes due). This should then give you documents to present showing your income "en-blanco" here in Argentina, which is all banks care about.

Immigration lawyers are not the right professionals to give tax related advice, but they may be able to give you the contact of an accountant. Definitely speak to one as trusts, while complex, are fairly commonly used here and the tax and filing requirements may not be as scary as one may imagine depending on your situation.

For example, if it is a foreign trust you may also benefit from double taxation agreements that Argentina has with other countries.
Also, if you are not the settlor of the assets inside the trust then you should not need to pay bienes personales (wealth) tax on the trust (e.g. it should not be treated as personal property) and if you are considering buying/ holding property in Argentina (or anywhere in the world if an Argentine tax resident) using the trust as a vehicle for ownership/ purchase can be highly beneficial.

IMO it is not worth forever running bank to bank without at least consulting a professional to see if they can make your life easier by just doing things by the book... there is always the possibility the accountant will just say "I'll write you a letter certifying your income, don't do anything else" (wink wink nudge nudge) if your situation really is too complicated or crazy.

 

[Paige55]

Fiscalidad Internacional | ARCA

Conocé toda la información relacionada con intercambios de información, acuerdos y demás instrumentos y operaciones entre países.

www.afip.gob.ar

You can register a trust with AFIP (in fact strictly speaking you are supposed to if you receive distributions from one and live in Argentina as there is an annual reporting requirement, independent of any taxes due). This should then give you documents to present showing your income "en-blanco" here in Argentina, which is all banks care about.

Immigration lawyers are not the right professionals to give tax related advice, but they may be able to give you the contact of an accountant. Definitely speak to one as trusts, while complex, are fairly commonly used here and the tax and filing requirements may not be as scary as one may imagine depending on your situation.

For example, if it is a foreign trust you may also benefit from double taxation agreements that Argentina has with other countries.
Also, if you are not the settlor of the assets inside the trust then you should not need to pay bienes personales (wealth) tax on the trust (e.g. it should not be treated as personal property) and if you are considering buying/ holding property in Argentina (or anywhere in the world if an Argentine tax resident) using the trust as a vehicle for ownership/ purchase can be highly beneficial.

IMO it is not worth forever running bank to bank without at least consulting a professional to see if they can make your life easier by just doing things by the book... there is always the possibility the accountant will just say "I'll write you a letter certifying your income, don't do anything else" (wink wink nudge nudge) if your situation really is too complicated or crazy.

Thanks to you and Quilombo for the wonderful replies. I've tried to sort out an accountant familiar with these issues but can't seem to find one. I'll keep searching. I've had so many contradictory answers and I truly just want to be above board with any tax authorities and immigration and the banks. I'm an odd duck who really wants to operate by the book and ensure I'm allowed to renew my residency until I become permanent. I'm definitely not trying to evade taxes but sorting out the laws and getting everything set in motion and down the right track has me feeling like a hamster on a wheel. haha Again, thanks to you and Quilombo for the terrific responses. Now, if anyone knows of a good accountant...haha

 

[carride]

If you qualify for the proposed RIGI (Régimen de Incentivo a las Grandes Inversiones) investment incentives you will be exempt from all national and provincial taxes and allowed to import goods without paying duties. Simply invest US$200 million once the Omnibus ‘Ley de Bases’ reform bill is approved. Cabinet chief, Nicolás Posse Highlighted this proposal yesterday during his Q&A with congress yesterday.

 

[steveinbsas]

...we are in the midst of the 3 year process of pensionista visa, which then allows a 15 year temporary residency.

Is the pensionada visa (which grants temporary residency) still granted for one year at a time and has to be renewed annually, at least the first three times?

Previously, the pensionada visa could (with the approval of migraciones) be converted to permanent residency on the thrid renewal.

I know one expat who was required by migraciones to request the cambio de categoriato from temporary to permanant residency on the fourth renewal.

Is migraciones now only offering 15 year temporary residency to those who have had the pensionado visa for three years?

 

[Ries]

Is the pensionada visa (which grants temporary residency) still granted for one year at a time and has to be renewed annually, at least the first three times?

Previously, the pensionada visa could (with the approval of migraciones) be converted to permanent residency on the thrid renewal.

I know one expat who was required by migraciones to request the cambio de categoriato from temporary to permanant residency on the fourth renewal.

Is migraciones now only offering 15 year temporary residency to those who have had the pensionado visa for three years?

theoretically, yes, to all your questions.
BUT- migraciones is swamped, with tens of thousands of Russians applying for various visas, along with its normal workload, and appointed employees having resigned in December, it took the new government some time to fill some of those vacancies.
So nobody really knows for sure- some laws are still on the books, some are claimed to have been voided by the president, but not confirmed by congress, and many issues are not addressed at all. Some announcements are made in the boletin oficial, but sometimes they are contradictory, or retroactive, and in general, its a quilombo.
We are now in year two of the process, but there is certainly no guarantee that it will be only one more year, or that the permanent residency will be 15 years.
Online info is pretty spotty and rarely updated.
on the other hand, the actual process was streamlined due to covid, and the amount of tramites and office visits are fewer. Our renewal this year was a five minute wait and ten minute 1100 peso visit for fingerprints and photos, and about an hour at the main office, to get our renewal processed.
vamos a ver.

 

[vgba]

@Paige55 I am about to apply for the rentista visa and will need to open a bank account soon, and I was wondering if you were able to sort out this problem about 4x vs 5x?