Argentina Crime a reality check

[perry]

I am fully aware that crime is an issue in Argentina and has increased in the last years . But to put this in perspective and compare us to Brazil we are very very far from their reality . Many here have posted about Brazil and its economic boom and its improvements but the facts prove that crime there is worse than a civil war .

According to the IBGE (Brazilian Institute of Geography and Statistics), around 600,000 people were killed in Brazil between 1980 and 2000, an average of 30,000 a year.
For purposes of comparison, the thirty-year civil war that devastated Angola killed 350,000 people, nearly half of that. This means that the number of deaths by killing in Brazil easily falls within the U.N. parameters designating a civil war.

http://www.brazzil.com/articles/188-february-2008/10042.html

If we compare these figures with Argentina at 2000 murders per year our rate is half way between Europe and the USA . Buenos Aires is actually the safest large city of South America for violence resulting in death.

http://www.argentinaindependent.com...murder-rate-in-latin-america-worst-in-world-/

 

[tangobob]

It has never bothered me walking the streets late at night/early morning in most cases. I have never felt worried or in danger.
Now if I were in Sao Paulo that would be a different matter as Jenson Button would attest to http://news.bbc.co.uk/cbbcnews/hi/newsid_9160000/newsid_9166800/9166863.stm

 

[erocifeller]

Yeah which is why I scoff at paranoid locals and weary expats. After spending time working in some of the less than favourable areas of Sao Paulo and Rio I find Bs As a cakewalk ...

 

[SaraSara]

Yeah which is why I scoff at paranoid locals and weary expats. After spending time working in some of the less than favourable areas of Sao Paulo and Rio I find Bs As a cakewalk ...

The locals have every reason to be "paranoid", when you look at things from their point of view. Ten, or even five years ago, there was far less crime in BA. They couldn't care less about higher crime rates in places like Sao Paulo - their lives are rooted in Buenos Aires, and that's the only reality they are concerned about.

Locals have access to first-hand reports of muggings and thefts through their extensive network of family and close friends, so they hear about incidents that don't even make the papers. Many of them own cars, which makes them prime targets for crime.

By contrast, most expats don't have cars, have a far smaller group of local acquaintances to draw upon, and are between 25 and 50. They don't have young children and elderly relatives to worry about.

Anyway, I'm happy to hear that for some of you BA is a cakewalk. It ceased to be one for me a year ago, when my next door neighbor was attacked at gunpoint by two men as she was pulling into her driveway. At ten in the evening, and with the private security guard in his corner booth.

After that, I stopped walking my dog at night. Paranoid, maybe. Safer, certainly.

 

[gouchobob]

Comparing B.A. to Brazil in crime doesn't mean much. Brazil has always been a lot worse in this regards. Comparing B.A. today with a few years ago is more relevant. Crime is usually associated with poverty, i.e. people with good jobs usually don't perform armed robberies as a sideline, people who don't have jobs and are desperate do. It calls into question government statistics here claiming everything is rosy. My guess is that the poor are getting poorer and that is driving the crime up.

 

[mini]

Not to mention the fact that comparing the civil war in Angola (pop. 18m) to "regular" crime in Brazil (pop. 192m) is just ridiculous. But whatever. It's more dramatic. We love drama don't we.

 

[philamote]

[According to the IBGE (Brazilian Institute of Geography and Statistics), around 600,000 people were killed in Brazil between 1980 and 2000, an average of 30,000 a year.
For purposes of comparison, the thirty-year civil war that devastated Angola killed 350,000 people, nearly half of that. This means that the number of deaths by killing in Brazil easily falls within the U.N. parameters designating a civil war.

http://www.brazzil.com/articles/188-february-2008/10042.html]


Population of Brazil: ~180 million
Population of Angola: ~14 million

If Angola were the size of Brazil, then proportionately more than 3 million Angolans would have died in that period.

Brazil is definitely more dangerous than Argentina...but civil war? I would doubt it.

Edit: You beat me to it, Mini. Cheers

 

[sergio]

It's sad to think that BA is now comparing itself to Sao Paulo. Argentines have always been more interested in Europe than dangerous, poverty stricken cities in Latin America. The point of reference has never been Latin America. I guess you could also compare Harlem to Angola. By comparison Harlem should look great.

 

[kre8ivelyXposed]

I see no use in comparing crime rates in BA to those in Brazil. The only relevant thing to do is to compare crime rates in Argentina to those of the recent past, and it is clear that 'inseguridad' is worse whether it be "sensed" (possible threats) or even "experienced" (actual crimes committed).

I for one was in the Palermo Subte "D" line yesterday near Plaza Italia and noticed that I was clearly being "sized up" by a couple of guys who were watching my reactions to their movements. Even though they figured out that I was not likely an "easy" target, it still left me unsettled for a few minutes. And I consider that a "crime" or violation of my being.

 

[SaraSara]

This may sound hard to believe, but ten years ago my 75-year old mother could drive herself home from dinner with friends a one in the morning, get out of the car, open the garage door, and get the car in without even looking over her shoulder.

Her house is two blocks away from El Solar de la Abadia shopping. Now the block has security booths at both corners, and yet homes are being robbed. People are held at gunpoint around the corner, on Maure street, and cars waiting for the light to change in Gorostiaga and LM Campos are attacked by kids carrying chains in broad daylight.

That's how much Buenos Aires has changed.