Argentina - Racism?

[globulus]

i'm caucasian so I can never be sure about my observations about racism in a predominantly caucasian community, but I really don't agree with any conclusions that the Argentines, . . . or the Portenyos, are racists. I am continuously studying the world around me, much like a cultural anthropologist might be. I, in fact, find the Argentines to be quite open-minded & liberal about that issue, as well as about so many other issues.
There will always be, though, it seems, exceptions to the rule. One racist can spoil your, or anyone's, day.
I have been ignored in restaurants here, on more than one occasion. If I were of a darker hue, I would have automatically ascribed it to my color, but not having that option, i could only ascribe it to my foreignness. After 20 minutes of patience, & watching more recent arrivals getting served around me, I left & went elsewhere to spend my pesos. It's their loss, in more ways than one. I tend to tip more generously than most, even when I do get marginal service. These incidents are much more rare than common & I'll not let them colour what the macroexperience is in Buenos Aires. It is better than good. That's why I'm here.
I've been discriminated against, for one reason or another, wherever I've been in the world, . . . for being white in a black community in Washington, D.C., . . . for being a gentile in a Jewish community in NYC, . . . for being a "Westerner" in Jeddah, Saudi Arabia, . . . for wearing short pants in Rome in 1990, . . . etc., etc., etc.
Come to Buenos Aires, . . . you will love it. These people are grand, . . . & there is quite a racial mixture here. There are Incas, Guarani, Koreans, Chinese, Semitic Arabs, European Jews, & many others. I just don't see a great number of "Indian Sub-Continent" descent, yet, . . . nor do I see a great number of "Sub-Saharan African" descent.
Perhaps Obama's victory can help in the residual racist population everywhere in the world. Here, it seemed, almost everyone was happy to celebrate his victory.
Be an ambassador of your people & make the world a more tolerant, a richer place.

 

[RWS]

Honest comments, "globulus". I hope you continue to post in this forum.

 

[kanguro]

Hi expatalex,

I'm not criticising your post in any way, I'm just expanding on a part of it.

I think that clarifications need to be made when one points to 'racism' here in Argentina. First there is the clear cut racism based on your ethnicity where no matter what your moral codes or social standing , you'll always be excluded based on your genes. And then there is the resentment from locals towards illegal 'economic emigrants' .
So here in BA, what some call racism towards Bolivian, Colombian, Peruvians, Paraguay, could also be seen under a diferent light.

Try having a Korean surname in Japan.

It's a little more complex when you have poor people with little or no basic education flooding the system for scarce jobs, there's going to be resentment by the locals just like there is everywhere else in the world. This fact does not make the 'racism' in Argentina the same as the nasty racism that occurs elsewhere.

You make some excellent points Globulus, I agree with them totally.

R.

Yes, Argentineans (not all, but those from Buenos Aires) are racists towards dark skin people but NOT FROM INDIA, they are racist towards Bolivian, Colombian, Peruvians, Paraguay, out of ignorance...... But in their discrimintaion and their act of racism they will just not talk to you, means they will not harm you like in United States for example that they will beat you up for being from India..... off course not all of United States, just them red neck boys.......

Come to Argentina, you will have no problem, if you ever do, call me, you have a friend here, my phone at your service 15-6374-1962 Alex

 

[bigbadwolf]

It's a little more complex when you have poor people with little or no basic education flooding the system for scarce jobs, there's going to be resentment by the locals just like there is everywhere else in the world. This fact does not make the 'racism' in Argentina the same as the nasty racism that occurs elsewhere.

Actually the "nasty racism" that occurs elsewhere -- e.g. in Europe, in the USA, and so on -- mostly has its roots in the same phenomenon of a deluge of low-skill migrants looking for jobs and competing with locals not only for work but also for social services. And if you listen to the arguments of these "racists," they're often making sensible points that their communities and economies cannot cope with large influxes. But the thought police are out in force to tarnish such people with appellations such as "racist," "homophobe," and "Nazi."

 

[kanguro]

Good point, and I guess what I meant to say is that in these 'other places' you already have the racial/ethnic/cultural problem to start with, & when you add the 'economic migration' factor into it then it's 'nasty' like a match to gasoline.
Maybe Argentina doesn't share the same 'high voltage charge' in race issues that other countries have to begin with.

Actually the "nasty racism" that occurs elsewhere -- e.g. in Europe, in the USA, and so on -- mostly has its roots in the same phenomenon of a deluge of low-skill migrants looking for jobs and competing with locals not only for work but also for social services. And if you listen to the arguments of these "racists," they're often making sensible points that their communities and economies cannot cope with large influxes. But the thought police are out in force to tarnish such people with appellations such as "racist," "homophobe," and "Nazi."

 

[jp]

But the thought police are out in force to tarnish such people with appellations such as "racist," "homophobe," and "Nazi."

If the cap fits...

 

[santelmofire]

Hi Indiboy,

I am black Guyanese and have grown up in the UK. I'd heard great things about BsAs back in 2007 and wanted to make a trip there myself to check the place out.

In the process of researching BsAs on this forum and other places, the topic did pop up of how few blacks there are in the city/country. This made me want to find out more. My research at the time satisfied me that being a different skin colour was not a satisfactory reason to stay at home.

Am I glad I went? Hell yes! I have travelled to many parts of Europe, North America, the Caribbean and South America. I never fealt badly treated or uncomfortable while in Argentina.

The occasional person passing you in the street might look at you for a fraction of a second longer than would be normal in somewhere like London. However, the looks are not malicious or unpleasant. I would even go so far as to say I was treated as if I were a little exotic by some people.

New people I met invited me to their house for asado (bar-b-q) with their family. I was always treated fairly when dining out, going into shops and riding on public transport. A friendly Portenyo even helped me transfer some image files from my camera at his apartment when the service in the internet cafe broke down. He introduced me to his wife, daughter and newly born granddaughter in the process.

I did meet 1 or 2 other black people while I was in BsAs. There is a nightclub in Palermo which had an RnB party and there seemed to be quite a few brothers from west africa in the place.

As your post was all the way back in December 2008, I hope that by now you've made it to BsAs. If not, what are you waiting for?

 

[santelmofire]

Hi Indiboy,

I am black Guyanese and have grown up in the UK. I'd heard great things about BsAs back in 2007 and wanted to make a trip there myself to check the place out.

In the process of researching BsAs on this forum and other places, the topic did pop up of how few blacks there are in the city/country. This made me want to find out more. My research at the time satisfied me that being a different skin colour was not a satisfactory reason to stay at home.

Am I glad I went? Hell yes! I have travelled to many parts of Europe, North America, the Caribbean and South America. I never fealt badly treated or uncomfortable while in Argentina.

The occasional person passing you in the street might look at you for a fraction of a second longer than would be normal in somewhere like London. However, the looks are not malicious or unpleasant. I would even go so far as to say I was treated as if I were a little exotic by some people.

New people I met invited me to their house for asado (bar-b-q) with their family. I was always treated fairly when dining out, going into shops and riding on public transport.

A friendly Portenyo even helped me transfer some image files from my camera at his apartment when the service in the internet cafe broke down. He introduced me to his wife, daughter and newly born granddaughter in the process.

As your post was all the way back in December 2008, I hope that by now you've made it to BsAs. If not, what are you waiting for?