Being An Argentine In The Us Is Tough

[ariel81]

Well,the term latin american was created by the french,to be honest

 

[ElQueso]

According to the Real Academia Española, who has seen fit to define a common, accepted Spanish language dictionary (I hope most [maybe not all] understand that what we call in English "Spanish" is actually based on the Castillian dialect of Spain, but everyone changes foreign names in their own language and I've never heard a Mexican tell me I speak horrible castellano, but rather español but that was before I learned to speak it very well - and maybe things have changed among Mexican immigrants in Texas since I first learned Spanish some 30+ years ago!), and which I've seen students here refer to quite a bit when uncertain if a word is of Argentine (or other) origin, or of Spanish/Castillian origin.

latino, na.

(Del lat. Latīnus).

1. adj. Natural del Lacio. U. t. c. s.

2. adj. Perteneciente o relativo a los pueblos del Lacio, o a las ciudades con derecho latino.

3. adj. Perteneciente o relativo a la lengua latina.

4. adj. Propio de ella.

5. adj. Se dice de la Iglesia de Occidente, para diferenciarla de la griega. Los padres de la Iglesia latina

6. adj. Perteneciente o relativo a ella. Los ritos latinos

7. adj. Natural de los pueblos de Europa y América en que se hablan lenguas derivadas del latín.

8. adj. Perteneciente o relativo a esos mismos pueblos. Los emperadores latinos de Constantinopla Los países latinos de América

9. adj. Mar. Dicho de una embarcación o de un aparejo: De vela triangular.

10. adj. desus. Que sabe latín. Era u. t. c. s.

Seems like a lot of meanings of the word that do, indeed, apply to more than just the ancient Latins (who came before and were absorbed by the Romans). Indeed, 1 and 2 had to do with a right given specifically at the time to the province of España by the emperor Tito around 79-81 and improved upon by Domiciano from 81-96 AD.

But #7 is the telling one, to me, which should include France and Italy, as well as Spain and Portugal.

The idea that "latino/a" was an invention of Americans is not quite right, I think, although Latin Americans certainly picked up on it as a way to identify themselves proudly in a country where they were often prejudiced against. And again, goes to my previous argument as to how legislating tolerance may lead to a separation of ethnic groupings.

 

[ElQueso]

Well,the term latin american was created by the french,to be honest

Very true.

 

[ariel81]

Well, there you said it. First you say we are all different, then you say that you are better than "them." "By what we have here." That is so condescending and racist. (And don't come with the "that is not racism"-thing, because you are basically saying that people in Argentina are superior because they are European/white, while these other countries are Indian or mestizo or whatever. You know, many of them are descendants of Spaniards as well, but I guess that is not good enough for you. Why is that someone whose family has been in Argentina for 100 years is "better" because they "are European" than someone from Bolivia who is mixed with Spaniards who came 200 years ago?)

I can totally understand that it is annoying for an Argentinean in the US to constantly explain that no, tacos are not from Argentina, no, salsa is not in my blood, but that doesn't take away from the fact that, as others have pointed out, there are maaany similarities between Latin American countries.

Have you been to the surrounding countries?do you think we are the same?please....
Have you seen something useful coming from them?
As i told camberiu,we gave the world 5 nobel prizes,they gave the world,carnaval.
Enough said

 

[camberiu]

Have you been to the surrounding countries?do you think we are the same?please....
Have you seen something useful coming from them?
As i told camberiu,we gave the world 5 nobel prizes,they gave the world,carnaval.
Enough said

Have you been to the surrounding countries?do you think we are the same?please....
Have you seen something useful coming from them?
As i told camberiu,we gave the world 5 nobel prizes,they gave the world,carnaval.
Enough said

It must be really tough, my brother. You have my sympathies.

 

[ElQueso]

Ariel, you tend to take arguments to the extreme in an attempt to prove your case. I went back and re-read Noruega's post and I don't see anywhere that she says latinos are the same.

Not to answer for Noruega, I have indeed been to other "latino" countries, three of which do indeed border Argentina. And yes, there are many similarities. There are also many differences. There are many, many more similarities between Paraguay and Argentina, for example, than between Paraguay and the US, culturally. The same goes for the difference between Argentina and the US. I see cultural similarities between Argentina, Paraguay, Uruguay, Venezuela and even Brasil (the five SA countries I have spent some time in) and Mexico that I don't see between even the US and Mexico, who are next-door neighbors.

It doesn't by any stretch of the imagination (unless one is being obtuse) mean that Argentina, Venezuela, Uruguay, Mexico, Brasil and Paraguay are the same. In fact, of the five, Brasil, to me, has the greatest differences. But people who are so concerned about being above others may not actually see the similarities and focus only on the differences (even within their own culture!!!). Every culture has its differences, and that means every latino culture will be different from each other, while having some basic similarities because they have a common origin.

I see a much more common culture between Canada (except maybe Quebec ), the US, the UK (at least England and Scotland - never been to Ireland or Wales though I've known a few Irish and one Welsh [who has actually lived here for more than 30 years and is the only foreign-born PFA detective, according to him...]) and Australia than I do between any of those and Mexico, Argentina, Paraguay, Uruguay and Venezuela. And these cultures are very different while having similarities.

 

[ElQueso]

Have you been to the surrounding countries?do you think we are the same?please....
Have you seen something useful coming from them?
As i told camberiu,we gave the world 5 nobel prizes,they gave the world,carnaval.
Enough said

I couldn't help but add something here - 5 whole Nobel prizes? That must mean that the US has a right to feel that it is the best country in the world if we are measuring by that standard. 353 Nobel prizes!! More than twice that of any other country in the world! Woohoo we win!

You all also gave the world Peron and Cristina, and a government that keeps its people in poverty and thinks that continuity between governments doesn't exist and the money previous administrations borrowed were therefore invalid and as a result the money didn't need to be paid back.

We're all human, man. I'd rather meet a nice person from Paraguay than a person who is an a$$hole who won the Nobel from Argentina (I'm not saying any Argentine Nobel winners are a$$holes at all, just making a more human statement - that would hold true for any Nobel winner)

 

[ariel81]

Ariel, you tend to take arguments to the extreme in an attempt to prove your case. I went back and re-read Noruega's post and I don't see anywhere that she says latinos are the same.

Not to answer for Noruega, I have indeed been to other "latino" countries, three of which do indeed border Argentina. And yes, there are many similarities. There are also many differences. There are many, many more similarities between Paraguay and Argentina, for example, than between Paraguay and the US, culturally. The same goes for the difference between Argentina and the US. I see cultural similarities between Argentina, Paraguay, Uruguay, Venezuela and even Brasil (the five SA countries I have spent some time in) and Mexico that I don't see between even the US and Mexico, who are next-door neighbors.

It doesn't by any stretch of the imagination (unless one is being obtuse) mean that Argentina, Venezuela, Uruguay, Mexico, Brasil and Paraguay are the same. In fact, of the five, Brasil, to me, has the greatest differences. But people who are so concerned about being above others may not actually see the similarities and focus only on the differences (even within their own culture!!!). Every culture has its differences, and that means every latino culture will be different from each other, while having some basic similarities because they have a common origin.

I see a much more common culture between Canada (except maybe Quebec ), the US, the UK (at least England and Scotland - never been to Ireland or Wales though I've known a few Irish and one Welsh [who has actually lived here for more than 30 years and is the only foreign-born PFA detective, according to him...]) and Australia than I do between any of those and Mexico, Argentina, Paraguay, Uruguay and Venezuela. And these cultures are very different while having similarities.

There are similarities,but I dont think that too many,I have been to Paraguay myself too,never been to Venezuela,or mexico
Im not taking it to the extreme,it is the truth,this country,is in decadence,nobody can deny it,but its still much better than what surround us
You know what is the problem?in this last decade,as this country went down,the surrounding countries,went up,but it is just a short fase,and its ending now,the surrounding countries,for me,are like those lower class soccer players or boxers (take maradona or floyd mayweather for example) taht because they made some money,they think that they are the kings of the world,when in fact,they are no more than ignorants with money,and when they lose the money,.they become just low class ignorants.
With Uruguay,yes,we are more or less the same,but they are much nicer and polite :wub:

 

[ariel81]

I couldn't help but add something here - 5 whole Nobel prizes? That must mean that the US has a right to feel that it is the best country in the world if we are measuring by that standard. 353 Nobel prizes!! More than twice that of any other country in the world! Woohoo we win!

You all also gave the world Peron and Cristina, and a government that keeps its people in poverty and thinks that continuity between governments doesn't exist and the money previous administrations borrowed were therefore invalid and as a result the money didn't need to be paid back.

We're all human, man. I'd rather meet a nice person from Paraguay than a person who is an a$$hole who won the Nobel from Argentina (I'm not saying any Argentine Nobel winners are a$$holes at all, just making a more human statement - that would hold true for any Nobel winner)

Yes,but the US,has 300 million people and a much richer economy,in fact,per capita wise,Israel has been for example,much more succesfull than the US,on the nobel issue and other countries as well.The point is,taht no matter how decadent this country has been,is still has a much brighter past and probably a much brighter future thant the rest around here,and certainly,culture wise,is no competition.
You dont have to tell me about Peron,for me,he and his party,are the staine in the pages of this country history,for me,the 17 of October 1945 is the saddest day in this country history,and I fully agree with this country government.
Dont know,the nobel prize can be an asshole but i can allways learn much from him than with the ignorant,but on a social enue,maybe,but when I speak,i dont do it on a personal basis,I mean in general,im sure that theere are,for example,many peronists,who are nice people,but in general,the movement they belong,is disgraceful,get my idea?

 

[ElQueso]

I think the Brasilians would disagree with you that you are better than anyone around I think even Paraguayans would disagree as well, though admittedly they have not accomplished as much as Argentina. I don't mean to be disparaging towards Argentinos, but I find Paraguayans to be some of the nicest, friendliest, honestly warm people I've ever met - at least when treated with respect.

Accomplishments don't mean that the culture or the people themselves are "better". Unless you are solely basing that grade on accomplishments, and then Argentina doesn't fare very well, at least since the early 1900s perhaps. And Nobel prizes as any kind of measuring stick, even for individuals, lost all of their allure for me with Obama was awarded the prize just for getting elected president of the US.

And just because you feel you may have a better culture, it still doesn't mean that Argentina isn't latino. And being latino is no insult, unless one is a racist who thinks that latinos are somehow "below" others.