BsAs Safety

In an end of the world scenario the currency is:

1. Gasoline and Diesel fuel
2. Guns and ammo
3. Food
4. Generators, batteries, etc
5. Antibiotics & medications

Gold, silver, and other metals are useless. Land is also useless unless you have the means to defend it.
 
Ahhemm.. said:
Hi there. I am from Florida, USA. At the moment I am in Argentina on a 3-month-long trip to explore different places to return to during my retirement. On May 18 we will pass through Buenos Aires again for 3 days. Another group I belong to is having and asado (in a large part to meet the Americans) and I was excited to return until I read this thread on Lonelyplanet:

http://www.lonelyplanet.com/thorntree/thread.jspa?threadID=2200042

Now I just want to get in and out of there as quickly as possible. As residents of BsAs I am sure you can put this issue in more informed perspective.

Thanks,
Ahhemm..

I think this is overblown. It can be dangerous here, but if you are careful, you should be fine. You could just miss one of the best times of your life. Be careful, but you can't live life in a bubble, or you could stay home and read about travel, now this is very safe.
 
ElQueso said:
Yeah, my point exactly. I've not understood everyone buying precious metals if they really think the world as a whole is going to meltdown. In a local crisis, I can understand to an extent, as the outside world still exists, but that doesn't mean that a few people with precious metals will find sellers when products in bulk don't make it into the country. Unless the seller has a surplus from produce and such grown on his land and can afford to hold on to the gold when things get better.

I want land. And probably be a good idea to have weapons to defend it...

I'm actually thinking in more "agrarian" terms... "what service or product can I barter for things that I need for my family"? Most of my work history is in IT and computer related which would mean squat during something like that; I hold more faith in my carpentry skills and what I can produce that is TRADABLE.
In the absence of a working currency, you are left with your productivity to sustain you. I've been distancing myself from reliance on this digital age in favour of back-to-basics. You can't eat digital food!
 
garygrunson said:
I think this is overblown. It can be dangerous here, but if you are careful, you should be fine. You could just miss one of the best times of your life. Be careful, but you can't live life in a bubble, or you could stay home and read about travel, now this is very safe.

I don't know. Maybe a bit, but the truth is, I've seen a lot of crime happen to my family members and friends over the last year, year and a half or so. Granted, what I've seen has been over a bit more time than a few months (two years since I've moved back into the city, when I lived in the city previously crime wasn't nearly the problem it is now).

I still have a perfect record of never having been robbed during my six years here...knocking on wood now.
 
ElQueso said:
I don't know. Maybe a bit, but the truth is, I've seen a lot of crime happen to my family members and friends over the last year, year and a half or so. Granted, what I've seen has been over a bit more time than a few months (two years since I've moved back into the city, when I lived in the city previously crime wasn't nearly the problem it is now).

I still have a perfect record of never having been robbed during my six years here...knocking on wood now.

So you would tell people to not come? I have had a great time in BA and I am worried about crime too, but there is a balance. I would not change anything if I could do it over. Come to BA, have fun and be careful.
 
gpop said:
I'm actually thinking in more "agrarian" terms... "what service or product can I barter for things that I need for my family"? Most of my work history is in IT and computer related which would mean squat during something like that; I hold more faith in my carpentry skills and what I can produce that is TRADABLE.
In the absence of a working currency, you are left with your productivity to sustain you. I've been distancing myself from reliance on this digital age in favour of back-to-basics. You can't eat digital food!

Yeah, I'm in the same boat being completely dependent on the IT market right now to provide as well.

Thus my thinking about a move to Paraguay and eventually being able to go live with my in-laws and help them produce their farm - and defend it as well.

Right now, I know of so many Paraguayan families in their area (the poorest Department in Paraguay, which says a lot) that don't have electricity, internet or cars (although motorbikes are common). My father-in-law hires a couple of guys right now to plow the hectare and a half that he works with oxen (seriously). They often butcher their own meat (in which I have participated a few times) If anyone could survive relatively unscathed, it would be in an area like that where everyone is already used to fighting for survival on a daily basis.

I was a carpenter hobbyist when I lived in the States (I sometimes dream of my 3-car garage, one space of which was my small workshop, with all my tools and a bit of storage for my wood stock...:)). I also worked construction in various positions, from grunt dirt digger all the way up to drafting plans and erecting major commercial buildings (including many buildings on the ex-Compaq campus in Northwest Houston).

I'm right with you - physical skills are good.

I figure I can survive ok if it hits, but it will be a hard life.

Being in a place like Buenos Aires can be anywhere from difficult in a local economic collapse to downright deadly in a world-wide collapse.
 
garygrunson said:
So you would tell people to not come? I have had a great time in BA and I am worried about crime too, but there is a balance. I would not change anything if I could do it over. Come to BA, have fun and be careful.

I have to agree with Gary...and el queso.

Come on down and have fun. It's still possibile.

Just don't move here without knowing what you're doing...and have an exit plan in either case.

And, if you have the option, go to Paris for a week instead of two in Buenos Aires.

I acknowledge that most expats would feel too far from their home countries to love it as much as I do. But I am also applying for citizenship here as well.
 
garygrunson said:
So you would tell people to not come? I have had a great time in BA and I am worried about crime too, but there is a balance. I would not change anything if I could do it over. Come to BA, have fun and be careful.

No, I've never told anyone not to come, and I wouldn't do so. I don't try to sugar-coat anything, however (and I'm not sugesting you are either), so that people can make their own unbiased decisions. If I was looking for information on where to move from a site like this, I would hope that I would get both sides, the good and the bad. I think this site does a pretty good job at providing a good range of viewpoints.

There are good things here, for sure. But I'll be 50 near the end of this year and I'm personally not so much into adventure as I used to be, more into thinking about how I can be relatively comfortable for the rest of my life. It's just a personal feeling I have of impending crisis here (to an extent, I'm not trying to exaggerate the situation) related to how things are likely to be in the short term here.

I don't know if I want to go through a year of high prices getting higher and then another year or two of bad times while waiting for a recovery (or some variation thereof).

My comment specifically against the crime was more or less a caution that many people (myself included) have not been the victims of crime, or not very much, and for some it's easy to think it's not as bad crime-wise as others are thinking due to that lack of personal crime experience. Not a judgement on other people coming down at all.
 
I love BA and would certainly not tell anyone NOT to come, however I do cringe when I see a certain kind of naivete with some ex pats, especially those that get totally shit faced when they come here and then wonder why they get mugged in the middle of the night.

I will say this, however, desperation-based crime is getting more and more rampant. People who don't steal your stuff just for the hell of wanting a new phone but because their situation is quite dire now that they NEED that phone in order to sell to live off of.

Yesterday afternoon, an ex pat friend of mine was violently attacked and her clothes were then tried to be ripped off of her by her cab driver in Recoleta:

My friend naively got into the cab without first seeing if she had cash to pay the fare. She did not, low and behold, that is the day when her US bank also decides to do a possible fraud alert and she is also unable to use her debit card to withdraw cash for the fare (35 pesos) the fact that it looked like she may not have been able to pay a 35 peso fare sent this cab driver into mad man mode and he screamed at her that the ¨choferes¨ (those who sub-lease the cabs from the owners) have to pay 400 pesos a day now and that he NEEDED that money si o si, she said she would try to call a friend, but at this point he was like a rabid dog and lashed out at her and said that she would have to pay him some other way and started to try to remove her blouse. This was around 7 PM. Luckily the manager of a small hotel across from her apartment building heard her screaming and came to her defense, but I dont know what would have happened had he not seen this spectacle.

You can never be ¨off¨ here and let your guard down.
 
el_expatriado said:
In an end of the world scenario the currency is:

1. Gasoline and Diesel fuel
2. Guns and ammo
3. Food
4. Generators, batteries, etc
5. Antibiotics & medications

Gold, silver, and other metals are useless. Land is also useless unless you have the means to defend it.

you missed something...

1. Water
 
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