Change in expat attitudes?

[clooz]

I checked out the UK again before moving here. It was obvious. Sterile me-too global food brands pre-packaged with an endless shelf life. Three hour wait at Hertz to get a pre-booked car at Heathrow... Traffic gridlock. CCT over the entire country. Hassled by the police for reading a map while driving on Marylebone High Street. I'm sure there were great things somewhere, hidden behind the glazed eyes and sad weary faces.

 

[steveinbsas]

Maybe I'm odd but after 18 months I still love it here and could list innumerable advantages over London and quite frankly very few disadvantages. The only thing that depresses me is all the whining on this site!!

I wonder what the whining you refer to is all about. I also wonder if it's all whining.

Was Davidglenn whining when he told us the story about having his business shut down (illegally) just before Xmas or was he relating his experience so that others might think twice before starting a business here?

Was I whining when I told the story of the airport vet extorting $100 USD to "allow" me to bring my dog into the country or just relating my experience so others would know how to avoid what happened to me? (Same goes for all who had to pay bribes at customs to get their household goods into Argentina "duty free" while living here as temporary residents.)

Was anyone who ever related stories of being robbed, ripped off by a dishonest landlord, or dating an Argentine whining or just trying to help others who might fall victim to these predators?

The longer you live here the more you know about the good, the bad, and the ugly aspects of BA and the more you have to share with as well as warn fellow and wannabe expats about.

I do agree that BA is vastly preferable to London. I spent a total of four years in BA and only a week in London. It took four years for BA to lose it's charm (for me), even though it is still full of beautiful women who are beautifully dressed and have lovely accents when they speak English...

 

[Tangerine]

I checked out the UK again before moving here. It was obvious. Sterile me-too global food brands pre-packaged with an endless shelf life. Three hour wait at Hertz to get a pre-booked car at Heathrow... Traffic gridlock. CCT over the entire country. Hassled by the police for reading a map while driving on Marylebone High Street. I'm sure there were great things somewhere, hidden behind the glazed eyes and sad weary faces.

Hassled by the police for reading a map while driving....
That is a good enough reason not to live in the UK.... Map reading is a Right!!!

 

[tomedison]

BA continues to make the lists of best places to retire in. I live in the Recoleta near the Brazilian and French embassies. I don't feel apprehensive on the streets. My condo fees, electricity, cable and tel bills are relatively low. I like the food and the wine is good. Seems like there's always something to do. Life is pretty good here if you have a non-peso income.

 

[MatiArg]

I lived in the US for 10 years before moving here and before the US i lived in Mexico, Venezuela and Brazil. Argentines who have never left the country don't know how good they have it here compared to the rest of 3rd world countries. People from 1st world countries living here that have never lived in another 3rd world country before i can tell you that it can be much much worse. Higher crime rate, no public transportation, zero customer service, lack of basic goods etc etc etc. I basically can get everything here that i could get in the US (accordingly to what i like). I might have to do a little walking to get it, wait in line a bit longer but hey, i enjoy the ride. And there is always stuff to do as well. I feel alive en la Ciudad de La Furia! Im not saying all is wonderful, but i make the best of it.

 

[John.St]

A month ago I returned from a month visiting my family in my old country.
The last week of the visit I began to miss my real home in Argentina.

My friendship base is huge, about a hundred friends and acquaintences - about 50/50 Argentinos and expats - acquired in a couple of years, and expanding. Tip: If you have a hobby, join a club. I visit friends, receive visitors and go to meetings with friends 2, 3 or 4 times a week and we have a party almost every week.

Customer service works although not always as fast as elsewhere.
Last night when I was in Carrefour, the key to the locker with my backpack got stuck. After a couple of attempts to make the key work, the man from customer service apologized for the inconvenience and resolutely broke the door open, so I didn't have to wait all evening.

Police officers are very friendly.
Before I got to know the town and asked an officer for directions, it happened several times that he broke off in the middle of his explanation and said "No I better show you, so you don't get lost" and walked me through town. You can also tell from people's attitude, that they generally trust the police.

Electronics are double the cost, because in a country where some 40 percent live under the powerty limit, they are a luxury.

I live in a wonderful old, modernised house at a cost about 1/6 compared to my old country.
The cost of gas, electricity and water is ridiculous - about 100 pesos per month as opposed to 800.

My nearest neigbour and wife welcomed me and gave me a bottle of (local) champagne, when I moved in.

Lines in banks and post offices are the Argentino way of life - get used to it or despair.

All the shops close late and supermarkets and local tiendas even later. When I come in they always smile (like I do) and say things like "hola, cómo le va?" or "buenas tardes". When I have bought something they say "gracias" (also in supermarkets and large stores) and when I leave "se vaya bien".

Crime is almost non-existent outside the tourist season.

- and Oh! how I love the leaned back attitude.

But then I live in Argentina and not that other country, Buenos Aíres
You always know when there is a porteño in the bus. All the locals are sitting with their arms crossed - hrmph!

 

[sergio]

"About our arrogance: I feel that expats think that because they are not in Sweden people should be more humble. It is after all our country and it is not a bad country at all. I am sorry that we think of ourselves as (gasp!) equals to you, but as the joke goes "we are Italians that speak Spanish and think that we are French".

The problem is, it isn't just Europeans or Americans that think this--all of Latin American does too. Ask them.

I've quoted two posts. The revealing thing about the first is that the writer doesn't apologize for or deny the arrogance but seems to revel in it! That is the problem! Arrogance is a vice, not a virtue. It is something to be ashamed of. It is precisely because Argentina is NOT like Sweden that many Argentines are defensive and arrogant. As the second poster said, ALL of Latin America resents the Argentina arrogance. This may change, though, as the "European" racial makeup is changing with the massive immigration from neighboring countries that has been taking place in recent years. Just walk around BA and you can see that the population is really not so "European" (by European most Argentines really mean white but they don't want to appear racist. What they overlook is that Europe has undergone major demographic changes and is no longer all white, and far from all Christian). Recoleta and Barrio Norte do not represent Argentjna. Before long Argentina will more closely resemble the rest of Latin America in terms of ethnicity and then, hopefully, the arrogance will diminish as the country assimilates more with he part of the world to which it belongs.

 

[steveinbsas]

Electronics are double the cost, because in a country where some 40 percent live under the poverty limit, they are a luxury.

Electronics such as flat screen TVs are still relatively expensive in Argentina thanks to taxes and import duties, but they are much cheaper than they were four years ago (for comparable models). The fact that so many can't afford an HD (or even a flat screen) TV should not affect the retail price. Some "poorer" individuals actually pay even higher prices for TVs when they buy from private resellers and make monthly payments.

I live in Argentina and not that other country, Buenos Aíres.

Buenos Aires is also a province as well as a city. Neither are a country, but I understand your point. Life in Provincia Buenos Aires (at least where I am) is much like the life you enjoy in Mendoza, but without the "tourist season" crime.

 

[John.St]

Buenos Aires is also a province as well as a city. Neither are a country, but I understand your point. Life in Provincia Buenos Aires (at least where I am) is much like the life you enjoy in Mendoza, but without the "tourist season" crime.

I consider Buenos Aíres (Capital Federal) a different country - know it, won't ever return unless I absolutely have to.

I know Mar del Plata (off season, no porteños), Bahía Blanca, Tres Arroyos and Tandil from a number of visits (have friends there) - Provincia BsAs is part of the real Argentina.

BTW: If memory serves me right, you have moved to somewhere near Bahía Blanca. If you haven't visited the funny little immigrant museum "Museo del Puerto", do so. It is very, very small and full of knick-knacks from the old immigration days.
Take bus 500A in Moreno across the street from Plaza Rivadavia in Bahía B. (the guy in the tourist office spent ten minutes writing a very detailed description of how to get there, have kept is as a souvenir)
Saturdays and sundays they serve coffee and tea with delicious home baked tortas, be there early, around 16:00, to get the best cake.