Change in expat attitudes?

[Roxana]

Capital Federal and Gran Buenos Aires together hold 15 million inhabitants so, are we going so easy to generalize their behaviour comparing to our narrowed environment, those 20-30 people we interact with often? I dont think thats a wise thing to do.

 

[jenandj]

I'm also an expat, and unfortunately agree with many of the sentiments expressed in this thread, though for now still have enough optimism to want to stick around a bit longer.

Sorry but I am a foreigner and the people of Buenos Aires always makes sure that I know that. But, if the same people came to America they would be treated like all other Americans.

However, come on, Americans aren't known for treating foreigners well, even if those "foreigners" were actually there first! There are more examples than I can list of this, but a few off of the top of my head are Japanese-Americans interred in camps during WWII, Native Americans who had their land (and often their lives) taken, reactions against anyone who looked Arabic after 9/11, and more racist jokes about Mexicans than I can list.

I feel more like a local here than in some of the smaller towns I've spent time living in, in both Argentina (Mendoza) and Chile (Vina del Mar.)

 

[Davidglen77]

Sorry but I am a foreigner and the people of Buenos Aires always makes sure that I know that. But, if the same people came to America they would be treated like all other Americans.

Ok wait a moment, do you really think that is true, I used to work with a human resources manager that would sort resumés by last names and any resumé with a hispanic last name would be put right in the garbage, neighborhoods in New York City and other places in the United States are divided by ethinic groups, I find all of that a lot less likely here in Argentina. Foreigners are not really made to feel very welcome in the united states, I grew up in an all immigrant family every body spoke english with a very heavy accent (except me 'cause I was born in the united states) and we were treated like crap all the time because we were considered foreigners and any inkling of a complaint we were always told go back to your country.

 

[LAtoBA]

I lived in the US for 10 years before moving here and before the US i lived in Mexico, Venezuela and Brazil. Argentines who have never left the country don't know how good they have it here compared to the rest of 3rd world countries. People from 1st world countries living here that have never lived in another 3rd world country before i can tell you that it can be much much worse. Higher crime rate, no public transportation, zero customer service, lack of basic goods etc etc etc.

I'm not sure what parts of Mexico or Brazil you lived in but I can assure you that neither Mexico or Brazil are considered "third world countries" in the traditional sense. If you were living out in the campo then yes it can feel a bit like the third world but the metropolises in Mexico and particularly Brazil are just as cosmopolitan, if not more so than Buenos Aires. Brazil is currently the economic giant of South America, not Argentina.

But yeah I get your point. Argentina is a cake walk to other places. If you want third world try living in the Dominican Republic....rolling blackouts, rolling blackouts, did I mention rolling blackouts everyday? Air conditioning.... what's that? Culturally acceptable to cut in line? You bet. Crime everywhere? If you're white with light eyes you are a sitting duck in the capital. And lastly, my all time favorite.....god forbid you wear shorts in 30 degree Celsius and plus weather with 100% humidity. Must be uneducated or a tourist. Lets wear wool pants so that we can sweat like dehydrated mammals and show off our sweat stains to the world. Okay rant over .

 

[Amargo]

Sorry but I am a foreigner and the people of Buenos Aires always makes sure that I know that. But, if the same people came to America they would be treated like all other Americans.

I hope you really don't believe that. It the USA starts already at the airport, going through inmigration...but that would be another topic.
From my experience in Argentina, foreigners from neighbouring countries are surely not treated like Argentines. But foreigners from developed countries are treated very well, sometimes better than poor Argentines (putting aside trying to charge you more money sometimes).

 

[tomedison]

That's great you are enjoying living here, however there needs to be more people living well on income earned within the country for people to feel like their country is worthwhile. If the only people who can live well are foreigners with income sources that come from outside the country, well then, something is terribly wrong. No political system can sustain itself solely relying on foreigners. They need the support of the actual people who are natives of that country.

I don't disagree that more native Argentines need to be living well; however, as this is the BA EXPATS forum I have an expat take on things. Consequently, I opine that for expats wih a foreign based income source, Bs As is a good place to be/retire/seek adventure/enjoy life.
I hope you don't begrudge me that I can live well here on a foreign income source. I didn't make the rules - I'm just playing by them. Who was it that said people get the governmment they deserve?

 

[tomedison]

I hope you really don't believe that. It the USA starts already at the airport, going through inmigration...but that would be another topic.
From my experience in Argentina, foreigners from neighbouring countries are surely not treated like Argentines. But foreigners from developed countries are treated very well, sometimes better than poor Argentines (putting aside trying to charge you more money sometimes).

I've heard US Immigration authorities can be unpleasantly rough on So Americans coming in to visit US shores and on those seeking visas to do so. It's the times we live in. Not that long ago immigrants were welcomed permanently with open arms and a beacon of light to show the way. That's sort of what the statute of liberty is (was) all. Nowadays, with so many non-Americans seeking entry for various reasons (some of which are downright nefarious) coupled with a dwindling job market, Homeland Security has to take a different approach although I agree at times their harsh treatment of visitors at the borders is unwarranted.

 

[CDNinBA]

I've been here since the end of september - i've sort of used BA as home base and done a bunch of traveling (south africa, tokyo, back home to Vancouver and then back to BA in the last few months)

there really are some things in Argentina i appreciate.

#1 - it's taught me patience. When i first got here, trying to walk down Santa Fe in front of Alto Palermo was enough to give me major sidewalk rage. seriously? you need to walk THAT slowly? oh yeah, i'll wait while you saunter along and peruse things you obviously aren't going to buy. Hell i'm from Vancouver which is supposed to be a relaxed city - Vancouver's got nothing on BA. Now i can walk down santa fe and the worst you'll get from me is a bit of grumbling.

#2 - While i agree there are a ton of people hoping to rip you off, i've also seen some genuine acts of kindness that you wouldn't even see in Canada (and we think we're the nicest people ever) case and point - one time when i was very new to argentina i was trying to get a sim card from claro for my iphone, and struggling - i didn't speak a word of spanish and emphatic hand gestures, unfortunately, only go so far. A very kind woman saw me struggling and sat with me for about a half hour translating, even haggling with the women to try and get me a deal. I thanked her and asked her what i could do in return - she just laughed, patted me on the hand and walked away.

and yes, i still had my wallet.

I WILL gripe a bit about the food. I went to culinary school and my heart breaks every time i go to the grocery store. There's only so much produce that looks like it fell off the back of a truck that i'll eat.

That being said, i've been to some pretty amazing restaurants here at the same time.

Osaka in Palermo. do the tasting menu. one of the best sushi restaurants of my life, and i've eaten GOOD sushi in Tokyo and also eaten at Tojo's in Vancouver (the guy who invented the california roll)

El Baqueano in San Telmo. Llama Carpaccio. 11 course tasting menu of all sorts of local critters. it was amazing.

It's funny - i'm very much in love with this city in some ways, but it's very upsetting in others. Nothing in Argentina works like it's really supposed to.

I still find it very cheap here - it's about half the cost of living in Vancouver (when you factor in rent, food expenses, and eating out regularly) earning USD also helps.

I didn't have to come back after christmas - i just chose to. I'm not quite done with it yet but alas i think i'll only be here another month. I've sort of run out of things to do in the city, and as a result i drink WAY too much. $1.50 for a liter of beer?

you kidding me?

 

[LostinBA]

It seems one has to put on an "ass-hole games face" just to survive a three block walk anymore. There was a time when walking around was most enjoyable, not anymore. Common courtesy is the exception, not the rule. Maybe it is me that has the problem? Either way, do not enjoy Buenos Aires as I once did.

Yes, I agree. I was feeling pretty negative yesterday. I guess we all have our days...pero...what I wrote is valid. I too, find myself walking around with an "I don't give a flying fuck" face almost all of the time now. A swiss girl married to an Argentine once told me that she didn't like the person she was becoming and I didn't really understand. I understand now...the only wonderment I feel here comes at the bottom of a glass. Pretty sad.