Disadvantages of Citizenship?

[French jurist]

Foreigners who get Argentinian citizenship has no duties regarding army for 10 years. However, concription doesn t exist anymore. Regards

Hence my "eventually". But it remains a valid question I think, getting a citizenship is also about respecting a flag, an history, etc. It's not a vulgar tool, it's an engagement somehow.

 

[steveinbsas]

Foreigners who get Argentinian citizenship has no duties regarding army for 10 years. However, concription doesn t exist anymore. Regards

Well, even if I could be drafted into the Argentine military ten years from now, at least by then I should be able to understand orders in Spanish.

But I will also be 71 and probably won't be able to hear them.

 

[Bajo_cero2]

Hence my "eventually". But it remains a valid question I think, getting a citizenship is also about respecting a flag, an history, etc. It's not a vulgar tool, it's an engagement somehow.

That s abolished

You mean this:

Art. 12.– (*) Los argentinos nativos también perderán la ciudadanía:
a) Por la aceptación de funciones políticas u honores de otro Estado, o la prestación de servicios militares a otro Estado, sin la previa autorización del Poder Ejecutivo nacional;
b) Por negarse a cumplir con el servicio militar en las Fuerzas Armadas en la oportunidad que les correspondiere;
c) Por la violación de la lealtad debida a la República, a su Constitución y a sus leyes;
d) Por la ofensa a los símbolos de la nacionalidad;

 

[Bajo_cero2]

Regarding the duties, they are related to political rights: ei. to be an authority during elections (one of the persons who work where you vote) and to vote.
Regards

 

[dennisr]

Foreigners who get Argentinian citizenship has no duties regarding army for 10 years. However, concription doesn t exist anymore. Regards

Funny, decrees of "necessity and urgency" sure have made a joke of what is constitutional and not lately.

 

[Bajo_cero2]

Funny, decrees of "necessity and urgency" sure have made a joke of what is constitutional and not lately.

Well, in fact this is at the Constitution:

Art. 21.- ... Los ciudadanos por naturalización son libres de prestar o no este servicio por el término de diez años contados desde el día en que obtengan su carta de ciudadanía.

Regards

 

[sab15]

One small correction to what was said above, you do have the option of permanent residency rather than citizenship even if you qualify for citizenship "por opcion". Argentina doesn't consider you it's citizen until you exercise the option. It's a waste though, because there's really no great reason to not get citizenship.

Hi ndcj,

Thanks for all your informational replies. In this response here I am specifically replying to your comment:

"It's a waste though, because there's really no great reason to not get citizenship."

In reply #7 citigirl said:

1) If you are an Argentine citizen and you have issues in Argentina, the US Embassy will not be able to assist in any way.

For some, this may be a very good reason to not get citizenship, no? I'm not saying I've come to any conclusions yet myself. Really just trying to get educated from the group. Except for having to come to Argentina every 2 years (although, you might want to anyway; and also, does that rule apply to Permanent Residents who are the children of Argentines?), wouldn't getting Permanent Residency then actually be the best of both worlds - i.e. you get a DNI, can work, buy property more easily, and do anything else that other Argentines can do, EXCEPT you will always know that you could call upon the Embassy for assistance if needed. I'd like others to chime in on this idea also, if you like.

After thinking about it a bit, it seems that this actually narrows the decision down even more to another question - Is Argentina, currently, a country where one would actually want or need the assistance of the US Embassy (assuming you're American, of course)? In other words, I guess what I'm getting at is how are the laws down there? Do Argentines have similar rights as US citizens? Is the court system similar? Are you innocent until proven guilty? Do cops have to have due cause before searching or arresting you? If all of these things are relatively similar, then I guess one would feel safe down there even knowing the US Embassy didn't have their back. Would love to hear facts on this and any thoughts also. (Just so you know, I'm probably so concerned/paranoid about this because I've watched too many episodes of that National Geographic channel show "Locked up Abroad" )

1 more question - you mention in reply #10 "...and also passes on the right of citizenship to your children." Are you absolutely certain about that? The reason I ask is because I have a paper from the consulate that says:

"Tienen derecho a optar por la nacionalidad argentina los hijos nacidos en el exterior de un ciudadano o ciudadana argentino NATIVO,..."

I capitalized "nativo" for emphasis. I was thinking that "nativo" meant you have to be born in Argentina and I wouldn't be able to pass it on to my children. Are you saying that I will also be a "nativo" and can pass it on even if my children are born outside of Argentina?

Thanks a lot.

sab15

 

[ndcj]

If all of these things are relatively similar, then I guess one would feel safe down there even knowing the US Embassy didn't have their back. Would love to hear facts on this and any thoughts also. (Just so you know, I'm probably so concerned/paranoid about this because I've watched too many episodes of that National Geographic channel show "Locked up Abroad" )

Do you notice the one thing starkly missing from all those shows? What consular assistance was provided?

Consular assistance is not like it is in the movies. In almost all criminal matters, the assistance you will get is a couple of visits from a low ranking consular officer, a referral to a lawyer, and maybe they call your folks for you. If you die, they might help repatriate your remains.

Other consular services, like lost passports, victim of crime assistance, etc isn't affected by dual citizenship.

1 more question - you mention in reply #10 "...and also passes on the right of citizenship to your children." Are you absolutely certain about that? The reason I ask is because I have a paper from the consulate that says:

"Tienen derecho a optar por la nacionalidad argentina los hijos nacidos en el exterior de un ciudadano o ciudadana argentino NATIVO,..."

I capitalized "nativo" for emphasis. I was thinking that "nativo" meant you have to be born in Argentina and I wouldn't be able to pass it on to my children. Are you saying that I will also be a "nativo" and can pass it on even if my children are born outside of Argentina?

Yes. Argentino nativo includes citizens "por opcion". Being born in Argentina or being born to Argentine parents both make you "Argentino nativo". Your citizenship was acquired at birth and is your legal right, if you opt to accept it.

 

[Trennet]

I think the biggest advantage of obtaining citizenship is that your future rights will be more secure: the rights of permanent residents are far more likely to be screwed with than the rights of citizens.

As much as I love Argentina, I think it's prudent to remember that it is a volatile country: the last 30 years have seen numerous Argentine economic or political catastrophes. With some of the highest inflation in the world + a lot of debt, there is a real threat of a financial crisis and the government tweaking permanent residents' rights in a desperate cash grab.

 

[surfing]

This is an important point. It seems to me that there is a huge mythology surrounding what the U.S. embassy would do for its citizens in a foreign land. Porteños in particular seem to believe that any problem I have locally, I can just go to "your embassy" and somebody will solve it. Not true. The fact is there is very little they would or could do in most cases short of a catastrophe ---and even then who knows?

Do you notice the one thing starkly missing from all those shows? What consular assistance was provided?

Consular assistance is not like it is in the movies. In almost all criminal matters, the assistance you will get is a couple of visits from a low ranking consular officer, a referral to a lawyer, and maybe they call your folks for you. If you die, they might help repatriate your remains.

Other consular services, like lost passports, victim of crime assistance, etc isn't affected by dual citizenship.



Yes. Argentino nativo includes citizens "por opcion". Being born in Argentina or being born to Argentine parents both make you "Argentino nativo". Your citizenship was acquired at birth and is your legal right, if you opt to accept it.