Francisco Time Mag. Person Of The Year..

[sergio]

Well I'll just quickly weigh in here and try not to disturb anyone.

I think Francis getting the title is interesting. I don't know what I really think of him but I do like the anti-poverty
and frugal, more down to Earth persona. I do however think he needs to work harder at reforming the
Roman Catholic Church Inc. and it's subsidiaries around the globe.

I wish that the state and it's institutions were non-religious here. I don't like the fact that there are pictures/cards
of Mary or Jesus in the police station or that the Church is even referenced in the constitution. I also think that
Churches should not but tax exempt as they benefit from the services of the state while pushing and advocating
an agenda, whether I agree with it or not.

As for respecting religious beliefs, I think there is a fine line to walk. I don't believe that all components of all
religions should be respected, such as homophobia, misogyny, violence, 100% unquestioned obedience,
forced wearing of certain clothes or religious paraphernalia. I respect peoples beliefs but that does not give
you a right to force them upon others.

Regarding kids, I don't believe in forcing them go to religious services or baptizing them, etc. as this removes
the right of the child to have a free choice in what they believe is right for them. I think it is important to educate
kids that there are multiple religions, no single one is the correct one and just because the family members
practice one doesn't mean it is right either. I think it is also important to teach kids that being agnostic or
atheist is ok too and that it does not make them bad people.

Morals and the like do not come from religion. There is no proof of this at all and even Francis/others have
said that the morally superior person is the one who lives their live to the betterment of humanity irregardless
of their religion or lack there of.

Finally, what am I? I don't know. I am a non-practicing Christian. I guess the closest branches of
Christianity to me are Quakers and Unitarians. I think the most important thing you can do with
religion is find the one that works for you and follow it. As long as you don't violate the rights of
others you can worship anything or anybody you want all day long as far as I care, but I do worry
about the spread of fanaticism in American and European Christians and Subsaharan Muslims.

You have to be a relativist to do what you suggest. Anyone who follows orthodox Christianity, Judaism or Islam is going to believe that their children MUST be raised in their faith and will not consider agnosticism or atheism to be good.

 

[ajoknoblauch]

Best Christian Song Ever:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mH85htjLDEI

 

[ghost]

All religions are equally delusional, but some are less pernicious than others.

Oh yes. I have been a long time devout follower of Our Lady of Perpetual Motion.

 

[2GuysInPM]

...
So the Vatican policies with Benedict were too much conservative, closed, reactionary, traditionalistic, etc...
And with Francis they tried to re capture those people whose faith was in crisis, those people who in some way or another were apart from the church. Gays, for example. Francis this year brought MILLIONS of gays back to the church.
...

That's impressive. Where can I find the stats for this?

 

[French jurist]

mhhh... Was our universe (everything) born from a "nothing"?
Then, if God created the universe, who created God?

 

[Gringoboy]

God created God of course.

 

[ajoknoblauch]

God created God of course.

To believers, circular reasoning makes sense.

 

[Matiasba]

That's impressive. Where can I find the stats for this?

I wasnt talking precisely, just a way of expressing how his policies work. He in numerous times talked in favour of gays, so it must have an effect I think. I know of gays who believe in god and with the past pope started to think of leaving their believes aside, to not go to church, a faith crisis, etc, and now are euphoric with this new role.
It surely happened to lots pf people around the world, lots of people who now are back to the church.

I said millions figuratively, but it must be a huge number.

 

[internationalguy]

To believers, circular reasoning makes sense.

The idea of God might seem circular reasoning to you and I do see where you're coming from. A universe that created itself is ALSO extremely circular and it doesn't even begin to explain why the Universe broke every single one of it's own laws of physics during the creation of itself.

 

[Rich One]

The Vatican denied a statement published by La Republica quoting the Pope to have said " that he will eliminate the concept of Sin"

What a visionay...!!