"Insecurity is just a perception"

[Bajo_cero2]

I was a lawyer for Legal Aid in the Latino barrio of San Francisco for several years. I have worked for indigent people. I do not fear poor people as you seem to insist. I do not assume a poor person looking at a store item wants to steal it.

I am a former CELS lawyer, wich is the most important argentine NGO about human rights. Civil rights here means something else: the right to work, study, sell, buy, etc.

http://www.cels.org.ar/home/index.php

I used to prosecute police men who were suspected of murder and torture. Torture at comisarias was a standard procedure to people from villas until no so long ago. Killing them too. Torture was standard at San Martin and murder them was standar in San Isidro and sourroundings.

So, I have some first hand info about how do they deal with people from villas that are close to nice places like San Isidro.

I suggest you do some research about the wittis case wich was prosecuted by CELS lawyers. I was in that trial. Judges were protecting this criminal in an obvious way.

http://www.pagina12.com.ar/diario/suplementos/las12/13-766-2003-09-01.html

Police kill the kidnaped and the kidnaper. The criminal had no weapons. The victim of course neither. The mothers of both victims united to prosecute this police man. This cop had over 12 cases of murder of gunless criminals before. The second kidnaped survived because he miss the shot.

I do, however, still believe that poverty is a cause of crime and that there is a relationship between the proximity of villas as they now exist and street crime. In particular drug use exacerbates street crime. If that makes me paranoid, so be it.

It is a myth. Poor people steal when they starves that`s why K politics is focus on social plans. Otherwise they work very hard. A mayority of them are believers.

Drugs in general neither. Paco yes.

Do you remember thar at the beggining of the year there were some very violent criminal bands that were robbering and killing in the north of Gran Buenos Aires? Were they from the villas close to San Isidro? No.

They were from La Matanza, 30 kilometers far away. They were recruited by the police who had the dutie to protect those places in San Isidro. So they free the area to let them rob for them.

http://24con.elargentino.com/conurbano/nota/19075-%C2%BFLa-polic%C3%ADa-quiso-usar-a-Luciano-de-pibe-chorro/

Many of your responses still make no sense to me especially as they purport to define civil rights, rights of indigents to services, etc, but then I don't speak Spanish sufficiently well to comprehend the Spanish text. But Spanish text aside, sorry, I simply can't follow much of your reasoning or legal explanation.

I know, the legal systems are differents and we are debating about some topics I am very sharp.

Further, it seems you are an apologist for the status quo. We can never accomplish anything because of corruption

I don´t do that, I just mention that if you use this methods here it will be a disaster because they are naive. A different strategy has to be used here.

Villa narcotrafficantes keep good order in the villas, so lets not try to change that

They don´t. People at Villas hate them since they started selling paco inside the villa.

Did you hear about "las madres del paco"? These ladys have big balls. They kicked narcos out of the villa several times gunless.

http://www.lanacion.com.ar/nota.asp?nota_id=940329

This is a group from Ciudad Oculta of moms of victims of paco. Paco is worst than crack.

Villa residents pay IVA so they don't need to pay for other municipal services (except to the narcotrafficante mafia boss). The urban renewal will never work because the crooked politicians will steal, etc.

In fact many of them pays for the services. The villas are well organizate, united and they aren`t naive (that`s why your ideas are impossible to acomplish and all the projects alike failed). Many of those villas are very old. Did you know that the villas arround San Isidro were made By Peron just to molest his political enemies?

All of us, Argentines in particular, need to try do the right thing even if its hard.

I don´t believe that to do the right thing is related to move people because they make the city ugly, it is superficial.

I used to work at CELS, it is an NGO that was created by a group of ladies during last dictatorship government. Their sons, daugthers and grandsons were disappeared (an euphemism for raped, tortured and murdered). Some of they were disappeared too. They did the right thing for 30 years looking for justice with non violence methods until they got the abolishment of the law that protected the genocidals. Now all of them are being prosecuted. From CELS they work to enforce human right through claiming rights at Court. (This is my background, that`s why I have some weird ideas that I acomplish at Court)

So, we know some about doing the right thing. But I am not naive and I know our limitations.

So, argentinian had done a lot to improve this country and there is a lot to be done.

I wonder if Bush will ever being prosecuted for torture for example. Because this is a crime against humanity. I know that my former boss was working on it while he was prosecutor of the international criminal court.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Luis_Moreno-Ocampo

http://www2.ohchr.org/spanish/law/cat.htm

Argentinians might have many issues but we learned a lot during last dictadura about how importants rights and its enforzability are. But gess what, our war criminals didn´t disappear, many of the issues we have about security are related to this people who became mayors, police boss, etc, etc.

Regards