Life in USA vs. Argentina

[Redbeanz]

Wineguy -- I agree with your thoughts. We love passing conversations with shopkeepers in our neighborhood, people we see infrequently, even a portero who still remembers us from 9 years ago when our visiting friends stayed in his building. There is a personal connection that comes with the neighborhood community. And as you said, the availability of "stuff" is far less important to us than this feeling of human connection with those around us. Just haven't felt that in the same degree, in either smaller towns or cities in the U.S., and we love it.

 

[DontMindMe]

Funny timing to sign in for the first time in ages and see this thread. I moved back to the U.S., to my hometown of Houston, new legal permanent resident husband in tow, on Dec. 29, 2014. It has been...interesting being back. Some good, some bad. I'll write a detailed "Six Months Later" post eventually, maybe. But for now, the good things: I got my dream job in three weeks, I don't have to look over my shoulder all the time or live behind an electric fence/doorman/what have you, tasks like going to the post office or bank are a breeze, I love the apartment we moved into a few weeks ago in the Heights, the food is outstanding, I am back near my parents, my husband loves this city (but is discouraged to not have a job in his new field yet), your average Joe on the street/at the bar/in line for the bathroom is smiley, polite and friendly as all get out. Oh, and I love the diversity. I work with people who were born in Armenia, Greece, Israel, South Africa, Mexico, Vietnam--I'll stop there, but I could keep going.

The bad: I feel like an alien--like I'm not "from" anywhere anymore, huge stupid trucks and SUVs annoy me, I HATE having to drive almost everywhere, the extreme capitalism and marketing of absolutely everything gets on my nerves, grocery stores are too big and it takes me forever to buy anything because there are too many choices, far too many people love being super busy for reasons I can't understand (I was never like that), social gatherings seem to be built around an activity (baby shower! birthday! wedding! let's try a new restaurant!) rather than just hanging out for free, I had to wait 90 days for the health benefits to kick in at my job and must wait until I've been there a year to get sick days and paid vacation time, and let's not even get started on the healthcare system or the fact that so many doctors just did not take any Obamacare plans at all the one month I had it (ugh)...

Even with the bad, Houston is pretty laid back and I must admit we have it pretty good here. My hours at work are 10-6 and I wear pretty much what I want. No one bats an eye if I need to leave to take care of a personal matter. I see kids and dogs at the office on a regular basis. I have a lot of free time, actually. My most difficult, lowest-paying jobs with zero benefits that had me waking up the earliest and working the most hours were the ones I had in Buenos Aires. They were en negro; that's just how it is. I made that choice, so I'm not complaining. But in general, my most stressful, taxing lifestyle was the one I had in Buenos Aires (not counting two study abroads)--both as an underpaid employed person and during the time I spent as a housewife. Go figure.

If I have to pick a place, Madrid was the perfect city for me in every way. I felt so at home there. The culture was a perfect fit for me. But Spain is a mess, so I don't dare let myself dream. There's always retirement! I do think Argentines have their priorities straight, though, so if there's one thing I miss about living in BA, it's that.

 

[rickulivi]

Hi All

The original question to this post was "[background=rgb(252, 252, 252)]What do you american expats find about living in Argentina that you cannot find in the US?" There have been some wonderful and insightful replies but I would like to modify the question to the following:[/background]

[background=rgb(252, 252, 252)]How do you find joy in life? If you fi[/background][background=rgb(252, 252, 252)]nd more of that in BA, then that's the place for you. If you find more of that in xx city, that's where you should be. What brings me joy in life? I love to spend time with my wife, my four kids, my four grandkids, my private practice, and been busy but not stressed out. I love my life in California because that's where I find lots of joy. If you gave me the choice to spend time at an asado, to use that social gathering as an example, or spent a few hours alone in my office catching up, I would rather choose the latter. And I am a very friendly, outgoing guy. If, on my way to the bank I bump into a friend and I am given the choice of going to a coffee with him or continuing to the bank, I would choose the latter. Getting things done bring me more joy than spending time with someone chit chatting.[/background]

[background=rgb(252, 252, 252)]My wife goes for lunch with a few friends once a month. They meet at 1 pm and stay together until 5 pm or later. I just cannot understand how she can sit there and enjoy spending hours talking about nothing! They certainly never fix the world. When I go to Bolivia, my wife and sister in laws and friends gather to play cards from 7 pm till one, two in the morning. It blows my mind that they can sit there for hours and do nothing but play cards and talk. Those activities bring me no joy. I go to bed at 9:30 pm. Please don't try to imagine what kind of reputation I have in Bolivia![/background]

[background=rgb(252, 252, 252)]I do spend four months a year in BA now. What brings me joy there? That's a great question and one that I hope to be able to answer in this trip. Previously, we were remodeling an apartment, so we were super busy in that process. That brought me joy. It wasn't the spending, it was the building, the challenge. In this trip, I have no challenges, nothing really to do, nothing to try to build, so I am a bit unsure as to whether I will enjoy the stay. It's an exploration. I do hope to find joy in new ways for me.[/background]

[background=rgb(252, 252, 252)]In sum, I have lived 40 years in the USA, and found much joy here. I like being busy and I love challenges that I want to pursue. I was raised in BA, so each year we would go down for 2 weeks. Yes, in those short trips I found lots of joy, the joy that comes from re-living those experiences that cause nostalgia. But spending four months is a totally different adventure. Whether I will find joy in BA for that long of a period is an open question.[/background]

[background=rgb(252, 252, 252)]What brings joy in your life? If the things that are available in BA brings that to you, that's your city.[/background]

 

[Noesdeayer]

i imagine that Redbeanz is a U.S. retiree living in Argentina so I can undertand his point regarding the more personal and people oriented way of life here.However,wher I would definitely differ with him would be on his view concerning "achieving".I have spent a good part of my 36 years in Argentina helping Argentine professionals in the fields of medicine,business,the arts and IT to immigrate to the U.S.to do exactly that,to ACHIEVE.Somehing they were,and still are, unable to do here due to high to hyper inflation,corrupt and incompetent governance and continual government interfence in the economy.In short a huge lack of opportunities.Not only does this "creole brain drain go to the Goliath (I love the name Lula called the U.S.) but also to Brazil and Mexico & now lowand behold to Chile and that "colonia siempre fiel" ( the term Spain used for Cuba until 1898) of B.A.'s elite -Uruguay.Hopefully,this Oct. Argentines will make a choice that will enable all her people to achieve right here "en casa".

 

[Redbeanz]

i imagine that Redbeanz is a U.S. retiree living in Argentina so I can undertand his point regarding the more personal and people oriented way of life here.However,wher I would definitely differ with him would be on his view concerning "achieving".I have spent a good part of my 36 years in Argentina helping Argentine professionals in the fields of medicine,business,the arts and IT to immigrate to the U.S.to do exactly that,to ACHIEVE.Somehing they were,and still are, unable to do here due to high to hyper inflation,corrupt and incompetent governance and continual government interfence in the economy.In short a huge lack of opportunities.Not only does this "creole brain drain go to the Goliath (I love the name Lula called the U.S.) but also to Brazil and Mexico & now lowand behold to Chile and that "colonia siempre fiel" ( the term Spain used for Cuba until 1898) of B.A.'s elite -Uruguay.Hopefully,this Oct. Argentines will make a choice that will enable all her people to achieve right here "en casa".

Not retired, but working perhaps too frantically part of each year in the U.S. In order to live the rest of the time NOT working, but living life, in BsAs. So in that sense, I guess we would have our time in Argentina more in common with retirees. When working in the U.S., we often awake to the 5:45 am alarm clock, and ask ourselves why people in other countries don't feel compelled to work 12 hrs/day, choosing, instead, less stressful, perhaps more fulfilling lives. What we call material achievement, some would call a wasted life. Yet we eagerly hop on that treadmill for the daily stress test until the day we die? Wondering what we missed in life....

 

[EricBluegrassFiddle]

[background=rgb(252, 252, 252)]Hopefully,this Oct. Argentines will make a choice that will enable all her people to achieve right here "en casa".[/background]

[background=rgb(252, 252, 252)]Don't count on it.......[/background]

[background=rgb(252, 252, 252)]Argentina really is struggling as a democracy and basic freedoms, there's no real freedom of press and it's a one party system controlled basically by a Mafia-esque-oligarchy of extreme leftist idealogs..who pillage and rape public funds like it's no tomorrow. The perronistas will never relinquish the strangle hold they have on Argentina and the gov't....it just won't happen, they have too much power. Perronismo is almost like a "cult" like a religion for too many[/background]


My wife and I are thinking about returning to the US as well ( she's argentine and has visited the US 2 times )

If you are a retiree or come here on a fixed income from outside of argentina you can do well. Have all of that + Spanish you can do even better.. They say "Buenos Aires te mata" ....and it's true. My wife and I just can't handle "capital" and she's argentine. It's too big, noisy and stressful for us.... We love to come in and visit for 3 or 4 days but then we usually can't wait to get the heck out. Plus I find porteños to have alot of "conchetaje" and they get on my nerves sometimes...

However, my wife is feeling burned out in her career of teaching ( working for the Prov gov't ) and also as Psychopedagoga for more than 20 years. She works in the poorest neighborhoods and works with kids that are so "screwed" up from screwed neighborhoods and screwed up families it's really starting to get to her. She feels "locked-in" and feels she can't advance and she's really beginning to be affected negatively by her working conditions and situations that she delas with daily.

Even more serious for us is the erroding security and the hyper vigilance that we now are forced to live with on a daily basis in Argentina like never before. We live behind a maze of bars, gates and alarm systems. It's really been dissconcerting. Unless if your wealthy or you have a huge amount of savings in US dollars, it's virtually impossible to own a home here...and we dont' want to be renters for life.

The educational curriculum here is really bad and we want our 2 year old son to have better educational opportunities and live frankly in a more secure environment.

Even so I like that Argentines have a bit more "laxed approach to life and things in many ways as opposed to the structured rat race of living in the US where everyone is just another "cog" in the wheel. I like the comradery of argentines, they're always "tons of fun" to be around...mates and picadas, huge asados with family...

I'd love to have me about 5 acres in Tandil or "La Sierra de la Ventana" and a typical argentine cabaña type house...fitted with floors of alagarrobo, a quincho, fireplace etc... But that's virtually impossible and my wifes not going to live in the middle of nowehere LOL...

 

[ajoknoblauch]

[background=rgb(252, 252, 252)]Hopefully,this Oct. Argentines will make a choice that will enable all her people to achieve right here "en casa".[/background]

[background=rgb(252, 252, 252)]Don't count on it.......[/background]

[background=rgb(252, 252, 252)]Argentina really is struggling as a democracy and basic freedoms, there's no real freedom of press and it's a one party system controlled basically by a Mafia-esque-oligarchy of extreme leftist idealogs..who pillage and rape public funds like it's no tomorrow. The perronistas will never relinquish the strangle hold they have on Argentina and the gov't....it just won't happen, they have too much power. Perronismo is almost like a "cult" like a religion for too many[/background]


My wife and I are thinking about returning to the US as well ( she's argentine and has visited the US 2 times )

If you are a retiree or come here on a fixed income from outside of argentina you can do well. Have all of that + Spanish you can do even better.. They say "Buenos Aires te mata" ....and it's true. My wife and I just can't handle "capital" and she's argentine. It's too big, noisy and stressful for us.... We love to come in and visit for 3 or 4 days but then we usually can't wait to get the heck out. Plus I find porteños to have alot of "conchetaje" and they get on my nerves sometimes...

However, my wife is feeling burned out in her career of teaching ( working for the Prov gov't ) and also as Psychopedagoga for more than 20 years. She works in the poorest neighborhoods and works with kids that are so "screwed" up from screwed neighborhoods and screwed up families it's really starting to get to her. She feels "locked-in" and feels she can't advance and she's really beginning to be affected negatively by her working conditions and situations that she delas with daily.

Even more serious for us is the erroding security and the hyper vigilance that we now are forced to live with on a daily basis in Argentina like never before. We live behind a maze of bars, gates and alarm systems. It's really been dissconcerting. Unless if your wealthy or you have a huge amount of savings in US dollars, it's virtually impossible to own a home here...and we dont' want to be renters for life.

The educational curriculum here is really bad and we want our 2 year old son to have better educational opportunities and live frankly in a more secure environment.

Even so I like that Argentines have a bit more "laxed approach to life and things in many ways as opposed to the structured rat race of living in the US where everyone is just another "cog" in the wheel. I like the comradery of argentines, they're always "tons of fun" to be around...mates and picadas, huge asados with family...

I'd love to have me about 5 acres in Tandil or "La Sierra de la Ventana" and a typical argentine cabaña type house...fitted with floors of alagarrobo, a quincho, fireplace etc... But that's virtually impossible and my wifes not going to live in the middle of nowehere LOL...

Peronism is not leftist. It is merely opportunist.

 

[EricBluegrassFiddle]

Peronism is not leftist. It is merely opportunist.

Yup!!

 

[Noesdeayer]

Ericbluegrassfiddle: I'm not counting on it.I've been here too long to count on anything for more than a month or 2.Except during the 11 years of the "one to one".Nonetheless,we can't give up hope.Watch who Moyano backs.This one could be a game changer.
Ajoknoblauch: What was the name of the union leader about 30 years ago who used to say that Peronism was like an umbrella under which many totally different entities could unite? .His famous grammatically incorrect saying was,"Conmigo o sinmigo".He died of lung cancer."El pucho lo mato,."

 

[EricBluegrassFiddle]

Ericbluegrassfiddle: I'm not counting on it.I've been here too long to count on anything for more than a month or 2.Except during the 11 years of the "one to one".Nonetheless,we can't give up hope.Watch who Moyano backs.This one could be a game changer.
Ajoknoblauch: What was the name of the union leader about 30 years ago who used to say that Peronism was like an umbrella under which many totally different entities could unite? .His famous grammatically incorrect saying was,"Conmigo o sinmigo".He died of lung cancer."El pucho lo mato,."

No thanks...Like a hole in the head...I try to stay out of Argentina politics ( unless it involves the wicked witch of Olivos of course....