Malvinas Spat ( United Kindgom beating war drums )

[esllou]

Its ironic but the two most agressive posters Napoleon and Ellsou who believe that Argentina has no rights to islands are from two of the most rapacious nations of the world the USA and the United Kingdom.
1 million dead Iraqis and 100 thousand dead afganis later in the pursuit of your goals of colonising foreign lands and you are telling Argentina how to act. Let Argentina and argentinians decide their foreign goals without your hypocritical judgements .......

cabrera, I was the one who suggested in this thread a possible hong kong solution to the problem. I was the one who suggested power sharing. How is that aggressive?

Is it aggressive because I pointed out that 30 people stood outside the UK embassy last year and 3000 visited it this year, now that Cristina has made it even more of a political toy than usual. The great argentine people are being played for foolish puppets by this and previous governments over the Malvinas. As JP just pointed out, if the British just gave them up tomorrow, there would be tears inside the Casa Rosada because they'd have no more InstaDecoy™

 

[ElQueso]

Its ironic but the two most agressive posters Napoleon and Ellsou who believe that Argentina has no rights to islands are from two of the most rapacious nations of the world the USA and the United Kingdom.
1 million dead Iraqis and 100 thousand dead afganis later in the pursuit of your goals of colonising foreign lands and you are telling Argentina how to act. Let Argentina and argentinians decide their foreign goals without your hypocritical judgements .......

Cabrera you simply have no ability to think critically, like many of your countrymen.

Depending on how you define "rapacious" Argentina is quite up there on the list. They just rape their own fellow country men now because they have sunk from being a possible world power to a third-world nation and can't do anything else. Except attack Britain in 1982 in order to try to keep a corrupt bunch of bastards in pwoer a little longer.

Argentina was friendly with Germany and Italy during World War II, and only "declared war" on Germany in 1945 a few weeks before the war ended. Like the US, they also invited German individuals of checkered pasts to their country - however not a few but thousands, and most of them with really, really bad pasts as Nazis.

They blame everyone else in the world for their problems except for themselves, and make up a whole lot of crap to back up their whining.

The funny thing is you say people from the US have no right to say anything about your foreign goals because those countries themselves (note - not the people who are expressing the opinions) are, in your opinion, rapacious.

So it's ok for someone from a country who decides they're not going to pay back the rest of the world who loaned them money (and blame those who loaned the money in the first place for their default), sat out World War II because they didn't have enough guts to join in on the side of their buddies, slaughtered blacks and indigenes with gleeful abandon in the past, continue to oppress the poor of their own country, are so corrupt that they can't even provide the most basic of services in many cases to its own population, and so on and so forth - it's ok for someone from that country to make judgements on another country but look out if someone from one of those other countries makes judgements on their country.

And you still have not provided anything at all that gives Argentina a claim on the Falklands, except a lot of breast-beating and few poorly understood examples of bad history that Peron forced down your fellow countrymen's throats 60+ years ago.

Yeah dude, you're not at all hypocritical yourself, are you?

 

[ElQueso]

So I take you are the voice of truth then, we should bow to your superior overlord wisdom, lets shut all the f'up.

How could we missed your point? It's retarded for us argies to think that the islands are ours. Yeah they are rightfully british, along with all pirated outposts scattered through the globe.

Yeah, retarded.

Retarded no. Obssessed? Yes.

If you say that proximity is the basis for possession, well, numerous dictators have used that excuse to take lands from other countries. Why not invade Uruguay? It's close to you. I know, Chile is over the mountains, that will be more difficult. Paraguay should be an easy target too.

Go back and study the real history, from many different sources. There are even a few Argentine sources who agree with the rest of the world.

Argentina NEVER ONCE occupied those islands. Britain didn't steal it from anyone. Argentina had not yet even slaughtered all of the indigenes that lived in and occupied Patagonia, and therefore had not yet taken their land, when Britain had already established a colony there.

Argentina's government stated publicly in the 1800s that there were no issues between the Argentine government and the British government, and the British governmet occupied the islands at that time.

But that's ok, be as hypocritical as you all want to be - blame everyone else for your problems while your government goes tilting at windmills in order to make people who think with their hearts and not with the heads forget all the other crap that they are doing to their fellow countrymen.

And yeah, at the end of the day, it really doesn't matter to us. Britain will not give up the islands, there's no reason. Argentina will continue down its own path to ignominy like it has been for the last hundred years. Nothing will really change except your "leaders" will become richer while bleeding the sheep dry.

 

[cabrera]

El Queso and others who seem to support United Kingdom just because it serves your hatred of Argentinian people is clear to many as your public attacks on the people in the name of defending the Malvinas from Argentinian control is extreme as noticed by your numerous replies on this thread

I have found the Argentinians much more diplomatic and fair in this issue than all the others as they have shown that military power is the power that they bow too .

Can we deny the rights of the argentinian people in the claim for 150 years now for something that is rightfully theirs. Now all this talk about letting the kelpers decide is bordering on the ridiculous as you never let the Diego Garcians decide, the afghanis decide , the iraqis decide , and many more nationalities that have much more right to their land and culture than some british imports recently arrived in Port Stanley in the last few years who make up the bulk of the Kelpers you are painfully supporting.

Is it not about time you give up your empires..........

 

[jp]

The bulk of the population (60%) of the Falklands are indigenous kelpers, who have lived on the islands for generations. Only 30% are "british imports"

As for the kelpers....

We are as much a people as those in Argentina, Uruguay, Brazil and Chile and many other South American countries whose inhabitants are of principally European or African descent. (Councillor Mike Summers)

Seems ridiculous to criticise the worst excesses of british and american foreign policy, then advocate ethnic cleansing and subdugation of another culture based on a mouldy 200 year old territorial claim that barely holds up to scrutiny.

Leave them be.

 

[cabrera]

The bulk of the population (60%) of the Falklands are indigenous kelpers, who have lived on the islands for generations. Only 30% are "british imports"

As for the kelpers....



Seems ridiculous to criticise the worst excesses of british and american foreign policy, then advocate ethnic cleansing and subdugation of another culture based on a mouldy 200 year old territorial claim that barely holds up to scrutiny.

Leave them be.

Leave the Iraqis be and the afghans be and the yemenis be and the diego garcians that you kicked off their lands in one of the most brutal evictions the world has seen. Hypocrite = JP .

 

[ElQueso]

El Queso and others who seem to support United Kingdom just because it serves your hatred of Argentinian people is clear to many as your public attacks on the people in the name of defending the Malvinas from Argentinian control is extreme as noticed by your numerous replies on this thread

I have found the Argentinians much more diplomatic and fair in this issue than all the others as they have shown that military power is the power that they bow too .

Can we deny the rights of the argentinian people in the claim for 150 years now for something that is rightfully theirs. Now all this talk about letting the kelpers decide is bordering on the ridiculous as you never let the Diego Garcians decide, the afghanis decide , the iraqis decide , and many more nationalities that have much more right to their land and culture than some british imports recently arrived in Port Stanley in the last few years who make up the bulk of the Kelpers you are painfully supporting.

Is it not about time you give up your empires..........

I DO NOT hate the Argentine people. You can twist my words however you want, but I have stated many times that that is not the case. I have many Argentine friends and I would not be living here if I hated the Argentine people. You're an idiot for throwing something so idiotic and made-up like that in my face.

What I do DESPISE is your current government and the people who continue to put them in power. And the "true believers" (like yourself, if you're not a child) who will never look at the actual facts and keep making "carbon copy" answers taken from teachings that Peron forced on the Argentine people in the early 40s.

But you keep on ignoring what we're actually saying; definitely don't reply with any coherent and fact-based observations of your own. It just goes to show how far up your own rear-end your head is.

I've repeatedly cited points of history and other facts throughout my posts. All of the information that I've provided is generally available on the web. It is all pretty much in agreement - with the exception of things that Argentinos themselves have to say, which varies in many very important places from what the rest of the world remembers as history.

You have not posted anything, that I've seen, to back up your "opinion."

So you do what your government does - ignore what your opponents are saying in terms of replying with actual points of your own, vilify them in other manners with points that have absolutely nothing to do with the argument at hand, and completely make stuff up in between.

Again, I have removed my hands from my keyboard briefly to clap.

 

[ElQueso]

I have found the Argentinians much more diplomatic and fair in this issue than all the others as they have shown that military power is the power that they bow too .

And I really laughed when I read this. Argentina was VERY diplomatic in 1982, eh?

And how is it that Cristina has started up the drum beating for this again, just when her approval rating is the lowest it's ever been, and elections are coming up next year? Oh yeah, and about the time that Britain began thinking there might be oil there. Doesn't have anything to do with diplomacy, but varying shades of greed.

 

[gunt86]

The 1982 war was more in the UK's interest than Argentina's. UK was in terrible economic crisis (broke), the pound was getting pounded, the British Empire was dead, and Thatcher's gvmt was severely discredited. The 1982 victory for UK, clandestinely supported by US with intelligence info to deal with the Argentine (French manufactured exocet) weapons systems, instrumental in giving a huge boost to UK pride, self-worth, and showed the world that the UK was not a completely dead lost Empire. Thatcher said many times that the 1982 war was the most important event of her career. Both Argentina and UK needed that war, for different reasons, and the US decided which country should win. The US gave Argentina support before the war happened by saying that the US would not become involved. This was the green light for Argentina to attack. So it is not exactly clear who the aggressor was...there is a good case to be made that Argentina was tricked into the war by the US.

The current noise from Argentine gvmt is just noise to distract the public from a far worse economic condition than was the case in 1982. However, there is no possibility of Argentine military action this time as the military has been severely neutered since 1982 and doesn't have the equipment for such a venture.

 

[esllou]

The 1982 war was more in the UK's interest than Argentina's. UK was in terrible economic crisis (broke), the pound was getting pounded, the British Empire was dead, and Thatcher's gvmt was severely discredited. The 1982 victory for UK, clandestinely supported by US with intelligence info to deal with the Argentine (French manufactured exocet) weapons systems, instrumental in giving a huge boost to UK pride, self-worth, and showed the world that the UK was not a completely dead lost Empire. Thatcher said many times that the 1982 war was the most important event of her career. Both Argentina and UK needed that war, for different reasons, and the US decided which country should win. The US gave Argentina support before the war happened by saying that the US would not become involved. This was the green light for Argentina to attack. So it is not exactly clear who the aggressor was...there is a good case to be made that Argentina was tricked into the war by the US.

The current noise from Argentine gvmt is just noise to distract the public from a far worse economic condition than was the case in 1982. However, there is no possibility of Argentine military action this time as the military has been severely neutered since 1982 and doesn't have the equipment for such a venture.

there is only one answer that is worthy of:

Monica: Mom and dad just sent me in here to find out if you (points to Chandler) were trying to get Ross stoned!
Chandler: Your parents caught Ross smoking pot in college and he blamed it on me!
Monica: Ross, I can’t believe you’d do that!
Chandler: The reason we haven’t told them we’re together is because they hate me, okay? So will you fix this?
Ross: Okay, okay, I’ll tell ‘em it wasn’t Chandler who got high. Now who should I say it was?
Monica: You! It’s not like it’s a big deal! You-you don’t still do it or anything!
Ross: Alright, alright, now-now who should I say tricked me into doing it?