New Entry "Reciprocity" Fee for US, Canada, Australian Citizens...

[mendozanow]

So it's 130 dollars for a 10 year visa. Really, not the biggest deal and quite reasonable. It's over 100 USD for a 1 year visa to India.

However, I do think it will impact short-term tourism. Btwn the rise in airfares (this trip was 1400 USD), thing in sds flyi new entry fee and the rise in prices, Buenos Aires isn't quite the bargain it once was. So for a couple to come for a week, they could easily spend $2500 USD just getting to/into the country.

Will be interesting to track tourism numbers over the next year.

But if you have a lot of family or friends flying in for the holidays, it sucks big time, regardless of ank political arguments.

 

[fifilafiloche]

Two quick reactions to Istar who loves the quotes pingpong game. Since i like to please...

All I can say is poor is the country who's survival depends on another.

Doesnt make sense, since we live in a globalized world with interdependent economies. Each economic zone has its specialisation, and as a matter of fact depends on others. Last year US credit crunch proved it. Experts were expecting asian countries to be delayed into the crisis, supported by internal consumer demand, like other financial crisis, they were proven wrong.

It's called refused entry with probable cause. Every country in the world has that right including Argentina

Asumption. This is precisely the probable part that poses a problem, especially with citizens of a country of the same economic zone (NAFTA). I can t imagine any member of the European Community being refused the entry to France...for "probable cause", it would have to be proven, face profiling would be regarded as a violation of reciprocal agreements.

Anyways, there is an obvious turnaround to this tax. Out of the 5 Argentine neighbours, Uruguay is the only one not to requiere a visa, nor to tax the entry of North Americans. Buenos Aires is right at the border with Uruguay and that tax will not be levied at borders, only in Eizeza .... I bet north american companies will understand the benefit of this situation, like some north american tax payers understand the benefit of escaping taxes in that fiscal paradise.

 

[mini]

Asumption. This is precisely the probable part that poses a problem, especially with citizens of a country of the same economic zone (NAFTA). I can t imagine any member of the European Community being refused the entry to France...for "probable cause", it would have to be proven, face profiling would be regarded as a violation of reciprocal agreements.

Yes, it was an "assumption" on the part of the border guards. I can't believe they didn't know they might have a problem entering. It is mentioned several times on that same site the issues with people needing proof of employment, a house & ties to their home country. They knew the rules. There is even a German guy on that site saying he got in and how he had a fake letter from his employer saying he was still employed! Come on! I feel bad for them but they based on the rules, it wasn't completely out of the blue.

NAFTA is not the EU. The agreements are not the same. The husband was a UK citizen. North American citizens certainly CAN be refused entry into the EU.

Please. Pay attention.

 

[sesamosinsal]

So it's 130 dollars for a 10 year visa. Really, not the biggest deal and quite reasonable. It's over 100 USD for a 1 year visa to India.

However, I do think it will impact short-term tourism. Btwn the rise in airfares (this trip was 1400 USD), this new entry fee and the rise in prices, Buenos Aires isn't quite the bargain it once was. So for a couple to come for a week, they could easily spend $2500 USD just getting to/into the country.

Will be interesting to track tourism numbers over the next year.

Tourism is already way, way down. Assuming Spanish is understood here:

"En los últimos tres meses, la caída en el número de visitantes extranjeros fue profunda, ya que a Ezeiza llegaron un 31% menos de visitantes que en el mismo período del año pasado, aunque la baja se suavizó en septiembre. La salida de argentinos al exterior, en cambio, aumentó un 0,4% con respecto al período de julio/septiembre del 2008. El saldo positivo en el número de visitantes fue de 15.456 turistas, el más bajo desde que se retomó la ETI en 2004 después de que fuera suspendida en 2002 y 2003."

(Source)

I think this tax will affect tourism, but not as much as it affects Brazil. I think the biggest deterrent for Brazil is the fact that Americans, Australians, Canadians, etc. have to send their passports to a consulate along with an application form and fee. In this case, you'll just have to stand in line and pay. It's not as much of a hassle..

Even with Brazil's reciprocity policy, in 2006 and 2007 the U.S. was in 2nd place after Argentina for entries into Brazil for tourism. They all must go to Rio de Janeiro. I lived in São Paulo for a few months, and I never met a U.S. citizen. Thank goodness for the Irish folks that I met...

 

[iStar]

Two quick reactions to Istar who loves the quotes pingpong game. Since i like to please...

Sorry that you see it as a game but like I said we see what we what to see.

All I can say is poor is the country who's survival depends on another.

Doesnt make sense, since we live in a globalized world with interdependent economies. Each economic zone has its specialisation, and as a matter of fact depends on others. Last year US credit crunch proved it. Experts were expecting asian countries to be delayed into the crisis, supported by internal consumer demand, like other financial crisis, they were proven wrong.

You seem to forgotten that Argentina is a third world country in a globalized world, with short-sighted government policies to match. And when you are a third world country in a world of globalization the last thing you want to do is restrict the free flow of goods which Argentina does by placing high duty and import taxes. For reciprocal reasons as-well? HA! Maybe to protect it's own industry? HA! Last time I checked Blackberry, Apple, Nokia and LG were not made in Argentina. Another cash grab? Hmmm...

The same logic now seems to be applied to visitors. Well guess what? Argentina receives more tourists vs. being tourists themselves. You do the math.

Argentina seems to think if they tax themselves off the map to foreign visitors and goods it will be the answer to their prosperity. Ain't gonna happen!

It's called refused entry with probable cause. Every country in the world has that right including Argentina

Asumption. This is precisely the probable part that poses a problem, especially with citizens of a country of the same economic zone (NAFTA). I can t imagine any member of the European Community being refused the entry to France...for "probable cause", it would have to be proven, face profiling would be regarded as a violation of reciprocal agreements.

Assumption correct but unless you or I were there we don't know exactly what went down. But as I mentioned, if the people had their stuff in order in the first place they wouldn't be need to try another border crossing. Unless you are assuming both border crossings were at fault? Well at least they are consistent which is more than the story of the travelers.

The EU economic zone and NAFTA are two completely different things. Mini has already touched on that.

 

[fifilafiloche]

Argentina lives mainly off agricultural exports. It s its global specialization and its competitive advantage, being a large underpopulated country with fertile soil. This didnt prevent the Kirchner governement from reducing voluntarely the volume of exports in its war against agricultural lobbies. So yes Argentine logics are not only financial which contradicts your assumption that financial interests outweight any other criterias in international reciprocal agreements.

The assumption remark was outlining your assumption that every country in the world could base its entry decisions on ethnic profiling. It s false since reciprocal agreements are different in different parts of the world.

And yes, chitchatting (rethorics) on forums and redoing the world is an entertaining leisure activity, I don t see how it could be understood otherwise, unless you can t take enough distance with yourself. It also recreatively helps me improve my vocabulary in a foreign language.

Thanks for the fun

 

[iStar]

Argentina lives mainly off agricultural exports. It s its global specialization and its competitive advantage, being a large underpopulated country with fertile soil. This didnt prevent Kirchner governement to reduce voluntarely the volume of exports in its war against agricultural lobbies. So yes Argentine logics are not only financial which contradicts your assumption that financial interests outweight any other criterias in international reciprocal agreements.

No the Kirchner didn't reduce the volume of exports, they just raised export taxes! RAISED TAXES... say it ain't so!

Some facts, you know I'm all about facts

Argentina has a competitive processing sector dominated by a number of large firms with a clear export orientation. Despite these advantages, Argentina's dairy sector faces significant challenges in expanding its production and exports. Since the financial crisis, a great source of uncertainty for investors in Argentina has been the instability of the Argentine currency and the threats of price control.

Argentina's domestic and trade policies add to the uncertainty for dairy producers. Argentina imposes a 15 percent export tax on most dairy products, handicapping the industry. Value-added-tax refunds on exports were eliminated as well after 2001. The government has a history of adjusting the export tax rate as international prices change, and this discretionary approach to taxation adds to the uncertainty of future profitability for dairy producers and processors.

The export tax raises government revenues and lowers the cost of food for urban constituencies. Exports are a convenient source of fiscal resources. In addition, the government has threatened to impose a price freeze on dairy products, effectively resulting in administered price controls. These tactics have been employed in other agricultural sectors, most notably in beef. Price controls on consumer products have ripple effects; processors are then forced to lower raw milk prices to offset their lost sales revenue. The negative impact of these disastrous policies is seen in Argentina's country risk rating, which is among the worst in Latin America. Market access issues, mostly tariffs and TRQs, are the primary barriers to Argentine dairy exports.

I guess the policies are working after-all

http://www.card.iastate.edu/iowa_ag_review/summer_06/article2.aspx

Tell me how is it that I can buy an apple from Argentina cheaper in Canada than I can buy it locally here?

The assumption remark was outlining your assumption that every country in the world could base its entry decisions on ethnic profiling. It s false since reciprocal agreements are different in different parts of the world.

Show me where I said "every country in the world could base its entry decisions on ethnic profiling".

The only assumption I made was, there was probable cause in refusing entry and I also said unless you or I were there to see and hear what really went down that's all we can do... assume. NEVER did I mention anything about ethnic profiling. Again show me where...

And yes, chitchatting (rethorics) on forums and redoing the world is an entertaining leisure activity, I don t see how it could be understood otherwise, unless you can t take enough distance with yourself. It also recreatively helps me improve my vocabulary in a foreign language.

Thanks for the fun

Hmmm that's a change of tune from what you actually said "Istar who loves the quotes pingpong game".

Glad I've been able to assist you in furthering your education

 

[fifilafiloche]

I don t know about Canada, but apples in France are cheaper too, mainly due to the overproduction induced by european agricultural funds. We sell some food to Africa that is being produced there, at cheaper prices than local production and make them dependent on our productions for the same exact reason.

On another hand, we externalize the production of non subsidized vegetables in India get them shipped down here and process them while local producers can t compete with labor costs.

It's called refused entry with probable cause. Every country in the world has that right including Argentina

This is the assumption i m challenging. As stated before, you can t refuse the entry of a member of the EC in any nation member of this economic zone without PROVEN cause. This is a principle of freedom of movement of goods and persons within that zone.

Yes, i m naturally curious and try to understand better my environment, blow off the dust of appearances to find a coherence behind opinions. Chatting is one way to do it. Sounding provocative is just a means to feed the debate, initiating reactions to bring more material to the debate.

Hurray for the reciprocity tax

 

[iStar]

I don t know about Canada, but apples in France are cheaper too, mainly due to the overproduction induced by european agricultural funds. We sell some food to Africa that is being produced there, at cheaper prices than local production and make them dependent on our productions for the same exact reason.

Wouldn't that be the government giving the people of Argentina a false perception that they are paying less for the goods they produce? Wow if the word got out they were paying more domestically to subsidize being globally competitive you would see people banging pots on the street!

It's called refused entry with probable cause. Every country in the world has that right including Argentina

This is the assumption i m challenging. As stated before, you can t refuse the entry of a member of the EC in any nation member of this economic zone without PROVEN cause. This is a principle of freedom of movement of goods and persons within that zone.

Again you are changing your tune... you said that I assumed denied entry based on ethnic profiling. I asked you to show me where I said or even used the the word ETHNIC.

You can't because I never said that.

I still stand by what I originally said which was every country has the right to refuse entry to someone with probable cause, including Argentina. The word is PROBABLE not PROVEN very BIG difference.

Besides you were making the charge that Canadians are restricted in their movement with the USA and compared NAFTA to the EU economic zone... which you were wrong about which was highlighted in the post by MINI.

 

[fifilafiloche]

We agree that we can t agree on anything, just for the sake of it, Istar

Here is some more of the 80s british classics subliminal marketing. That s where i learnt by horrible english.

Right or wrong