Obamacare: Say goodbye to Grandma and the grandkids!

citygirl said:
Facts Harpo?? We don't need no stinking facts:rolleyes: Much better to utilize hyperbole, hysteria and extremist (on both left & right) publications to bolster our positions. What were you thinking? :confused:


And perhaps the President could prevaricate a bit less...

That would be a change we might believe in.
 
There's a little bit of talk about the rich a few comments back. Maybe part of the problem in the USA is the excess (or GREED) that is so prevalent - thousands of people with way too much money, millions of people with way to little. Check out this list, I find it really telling. (Remember, 1,000 Million make a Billion)

LIST OF SOME OF THE WORLD'S BILLIONAIRES BY NUMBERS, BY COUNTRY

I've taken out many countries, just left the few that seem excessive, less than expected, or some other reason. Check out the numbers, some of the best countries in the worldd have very few Billionaires - they understand what you get when you stay more in balance financially.

COUNTRY - NUMBER OF BILLIONAIRES - TOTAL POPULATION

ARGENTINA - 1 - 41M
AUSTRALIA - 10 - 21M
BRAZIL - 12 - 192M
CANADA - 20 - 34M
CHILE - 1 - 34M
CHINA - 28 - 1,4B
FRANCE - 10 - 63M
GERMANY - 55 - 82M
ITALY - 12 - 59M
JAPAN - 17 - 128M
MEXICO - 9 - 110M
RUSSIA - 32 - 141M
SPAIN - 12 - 41M
SWEDEN - 9 - 9M
THAILAND - 3 - 66M
UK - 25 - 61M
USA - 700 - 305M

Tax the rich? (heavens no, they'll all run off to the UAE/Dubai like Haliburton did a few years ago) Well, let's take a look at the list. One country seems to be OVER FLOWING with billionaires (mostly Multi Billionaires) but yet it can't seem to dig up any money for Universal Health Care for the poor - this is also a big , self proclaimed Christian Country that even protects fetuses by telling women what to do with their bodies when pregnant and assassinates Abortion Doctors. What would Jesus do, use a Glock or Smith and Wesson?

They just can't seem to get off a couple Million more bills so the poor and needy can have some health care (seems like once the fetus becomes a person you stop caring for it). I mean 700 BILLIONAIRES/MULTI - BILLIONAIRES !!! I tell ya, I think if I tried real hard I can make it through life on maybe 20 million..... I think I could. They say Americans are very generous (like helping out after the massive tsunami years ago) but in reality , per capita, they give very little compared to other countries. So much for that little much repeated myth.

I love the story when Warren Buffet (at times the riches man in the world) asked his secretary what percentage she paid in taxes and was shocked that she paid something like 39% and he paid 14%. Yep, gotta leave those super rich alone so they don't leave. Remember, AMERICA CARES !!! Dudester
 
Dudester said:
What would Jesus do, use a Glock or Smith and Wesson?


I doubt it, but he might say that you're not on the list.

That could be good or bad, depending on which list.

And didn't Obama tell us to judge him by those with whom he associated?

Wasn't Warren Buffet one of the first he named?
 
Goodness, Dudester! It really sounds as though you don't like America. Yet you're still there . . . could it be to get more money?
 
RWS said:
Goodness, Dudester! It really sounds as though you don't like America. Yet you're still there . . . could it be to get more money?

How PERCEPTIVE RWS. AND my family and I worked our ASSES OFF FOR DECADES to build a successful business, don't plan on having some corrupt-to -the-core, only for the top 1%, Military Industrial Complex, and Multi- National Corps get their greedy little EVIL hands on my hard earned, sweat/blood/tears cash. F**K them, let them go rob someone else !!! Why should I like it? Tell me what's so great about AMERICA. RULE # 1 : It doesn't care about it's own people - that's good enough for me, bye-bye !!! Dudester

PS We all NEED money, nothing wrong with that - it's when the balance between ultra rich and piss poor gets perverted...... no one NEEDS 1 Billion dollars.....
 
steveinbsas said:
I doubt it, but he might say that you're not on the list.

That could be good or bad, depending on which list.

Get outta here with your "List" fantasy. You (and your little blind religious followers of charlatans and plastic preachers) don't have A CLUE to what Jesus was REALLY talking about.... it's all so OBVIOUS and so RIDICULOUS........ (you can't be a Republican - which is all about me/myself/and I, harshly judging everyone around you, not caring at all for your fellow man, and being 100% Pro war/death - and a TRUE Christian at the same time - it's IMPOSSIBLE)...... you can take that one to the bank ......
 
harpo said:
False. I'm living in France right now and a very cautious line is being taken. Where do you get your 'facts'? Do you ever check them? Do you believe any fatuous piece of propaganda that's pumped in your direction?

Have you ever bothered to read the alternative media Harpo or are you in Cuckoo land believing that God is Obama and the world is full of sugar and honey. I suggest that you educate yourself instead of attacking everyone here who has a different view to yourself as a freak or as a conspiracy theorist which is a means of silencing freedom of speech from psuedo left wingers like yourself. So read Harpo just read.........................................

The French education minister said in an interview with “Le Figaro” today that he is ready to close down all the country’s schools after a crisis meeting in the Ministry of Interior over the swine flu pandemic.
Preparations for the closure of all schools comes as France switches over from civil to military government under the ultimate authority of WHO, which has declared a pandemic level 6 emergency.
Luc Chatel, the education minister, refused to rule out the vaccination of all 12 million children in France with an untested and potentially deadly vaccine.
When schools close, children will be expected to study at home using the radio and the internet.
Luc Chatel : «Je suis prêt à fermer les établissements»
Propos recueillis par Bruno Jeudy
11/08/2009 | Mise à jour : 22:12 | Commentaires 72 | Ajouter à ma sélection
Luc Chatel (ici en juin dernier) précise qu’une brochure sera distribuée à la rentrée donnant les règles à adopter en cas de grippe A (H1N1).
INTERVIEW – Le 18 août, le ministre de l’éducation nationale réunira la cellule de crise de son ministère afin d’anticiper un éventuel pic de l’épidémie de grippe A.
LE FIGARO. – Vous attendez-vous à une pandémie de grippe ?
Luc CHATEL. – Le rôle du gouvernement, c’est d’être prêt à faire face à une éventuelle pandémie. On se prépare à toutes les éventualités. Il ne faut ni minimiser, ni dramatiser. Pas question de baisser la garde. Le 17 juillet, j’ai réuni une première fois la cellule de crise de mon ministère pour mettre au point notre plan pour la rentrée. D’autres réunions auront lieu avant la rentrée.
Qu’avez-vous décidé ?
Une première circulaire a été adressée à tous les recteurs pour fixer les règles à suivre lorsqu’il y aura survenance de cas groupés de grippe A (H1N1). Nous avons préparé une brochure de quatre pages qui sera distribuée à la rentrée, à 12 millions d’exemplaires. L’objectif est de rappeler les gestes à adopter pour se protéger et les mesures décidées par le ministère en cas de pandémie. Le 18 août, je réunirai la cellule de crise du ministère et les correspondants académiques pour faire le point à quinze jours de la rentrée. Enfin, le 25 août, le directeur général de la Santé, Didier Houssain, fera une communication devant tous les inspecteurs d’académies et recteurs de France.
À partir de combien de cas fermerez-vous l’établissement ?
La procédure de fermeture d’école fera l’objet d’une réunion aujourd’hui au ministère de l’Intérieur. Une circulaire détaillera les instructions à suivre pour les préfets et les directeurs d’établissement. Aucun seuil n’a été fixé pour fermer une école. On s’adaptera au cas par cas. La décision sera prise par le préfet, en concertation avec les autorités de l’Éducation et les directeurs des établissements, après examen de la situation épidémiologique nationale et locale. La procédure de réouverture suivra les mêmes règles. En cas de pandémie totale, si les circonstances l’exigent, nous nous tiendrons prêts à fermer les établissements.
Envisagez-vous une vaccination généralisée des enfants ?
À ce stade, la vaccination généralisée n’est pas d’actualité. Les vaccins sont bien en cours de fabrication mais il n’est pas prévu, pour l’instant, de vaccination systématique d’une population particulière. En fonction de l’évolution de la pandémie, la ministre de la santé peut toutefois être appelée à revoir cette doctrine.
Qu’avez-vous prévu en cas de fermeture généralisée ?
Nous avons préparé un plan de continuité pédagogique. Il s’agit de programmes éducatifs destinés aux élèves privés de cours. Ils ont été préparés pendant l’été par le Centre national d’éducation à distance et seront diffusés sur France 5, Radio France et Internet.
 
Dudester said:
BBWOLF, as usual, I DO agree with you. The problem is the day the "American people take it to the streets in droves" is the day I have U2 play a concert in my backyard for Labor Day - ain't gonna happen. This is the problem, your idea's are great and spot on.... except they'll never happen. The vast majority of the American people would have to wake up - that ain't gonna happen. Most people on this board know what's REALLY going on but that's not even enough to fill out my U2 Backyard B-B-Que !!! I'm right there with you Wolf (in agreement) but this ain't never gonna happen - the deed's already been done - you said it yourself - "Quiet Coup over the last 40 years". I say it STARTED on Nov. 22, 1963 when the fools bought into Oswald and his $25 dollar single bolt garbage rifle - Oswalds interrogations include no sound recordings (tape or video) nor note taking. He is killed 24 hours later by Ruby who dies a few years later, taking all his secrets to the grave. That was probably the beginning of the end of any sanity in the USA.

As far as HEALTH CARE here's my solution - outsource it - beat the bastards at their own game. I'm ready to go anytime if needed.

BUMRUNGRAD INTERNATIONAL - World Class Expat Hospital in BANGKOK, THAILAND - Bypass surgery and kick ass vacation combined into one trip, now that's efficiency !!!
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nZyIx27jAwo



i'm with you on JFK. he was the last true American president i.e. someone who was not bought and paid for by the bankers. he was originally brought in by his bootlegging, Nazi sympathizing father to be a puppet but somehow he didn't fall in line.

a little known fact was that in 1963 he signed executive order 11110, which essentially created a currency(silver certificates) that was backed by silver, not debt based and which no bankers earned interest. this basically would have ended the federal reserve's private banking monopoly over our money supply. five months later he is assassinated. a prominent banker was then placed on the warren commission. coincidence? hmm........

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ggADLt4s4pM

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Executive_Order_11110

*******************************

i think you, BBWOLF and myself all agree that the US standard of living is going to drop off a cliff. how can it not? look at the economic fundamentals of our nation. number 1 and number 2 components of GDP are consumer and government spending. We have invested barely nothing into new infrastructure or new energy.

one of their idiotic solutions is the cash for clunkers program and they can't even run that right. let's take perfectly good running cars that are useful and have value. let's destroy them, go into more debt to by a new car AND on top it, let's by foreign made cars. the Toyota corolla is the most bought car in the program. so we'll go further into personal debt AND increase our trade deficit with Japan while we're at it. wonderful.

as others have mentioned, the damage has already been made/created. it's just a matter of time. they're just driving the final nails into our coffin now. the anger you're seeing in the town hall meetings is NOTHING compared to what is coming. There will be no economic recovery. At best we will see 1 or 2 quarters of a “bounce” that the public will confuse as a “recovery”. The only question is how will the dollar fall, slow and controlled or like a stone. In short, buy gold/silver folks. It’s your best hedge against inflation and best method to preserve the wealth you’ve all worked so hard to obtain. Don’t let a corrupt, out of control gangster/thug government rob you of your purchasing power.

Support Peter Schiff and Rand Paul for senate.

http://www.schiffforsenate.com/

http://www.randpaul2010.com/
 
cabrera said:
.. now we are living in a World Police State where even our own body is not ours to control.
That's right - and in the quiet of the night, at around 03 - the :eek:Secret World Police is coming to get you! :eek::eek: and drag you to a deep cavern, where they do unmentionable things to you, using chain saws and picks.

I think there is a free mental care clinic in BsAs.
 
Ries said:
If you guys are so rich, why do you live in Argentina?
Seems like the current low tax USA, where you dont have to pay taxes for health care for those nasty poor people would be a much better place?

Look- every other civilized country has single payer, "government" health care.
And they spend LESS doing it.

Overall tax loads are pretty similar across europe, japan, and other first world countries- and in the USA, for poor people.
In the USA, tax rates for the rich are quite a bit lower.

Medicare is a benefit program.
It spends taxpayer money, no doubt about it.
And it actually saves quite a bit over what it would cost to cover those same people under a private plan, OR what it would cost, in social costs, if we just let old people die.

Which seems to be what many right wingers are advocating- if they cant afford health care, let em die.
Dump em out of the van, like those homeless people in LA.
Because, after all, its better than paying higher taxes.

I have said it before, I will say it again- I am willing to pay higher taxes in the USA for universal health care. And so are most people- but, really, we should SAVE money by eliminating all those insurance companies.


ries....

you make some great points but like always, what typically happens is that a movement that should be a good thing – like health care reform – is hijacked by special interests for the “benefit of the people” and then distorted toward their own agenda. It’s a classic game of bait and switch.

I think what steve is trying to say is that IF our health care reform followed something similar to what you’ve outlined and stuck to it, then that would be an ideal model. However, we all know it never works out this way. Quite simply, they will never allow it happen this way.

The average person is buying into how the bill SHOULD reform, not how it WILL reform. The stated intention(lie) is always to “makes things better”. Take an issue that almost everybody can agree needs reforming i.e. the environment, economy, food, disease, health…etc., get the public to “buy in”, then once passed, implement the big business game plan.

What steve is saying is that the currently proposed reform bill has certain elements to it that are anathema to our way of life – any human being’s way of life. I think these points have been lost in the debate somehow and I’m not sure why. We all agree that health care needs reform however no reform bill should give any government the degree of power which it currently proposes - the power to euthanize or the power to ration health care. The bill proposes to give death counseling to “prepare” seniors for premature death. Read that last sentence again. Then read it one more time.

Again, we all want reform – just not this kind of reform.

And why are we not discussing the manner in which they are attempting to pass it? A bill over 1000 pages that nobody is reading? At best, this is clearly an issue that deserves more transparent debate.

And let’s stop making it political. I still can’t believe that anybody today believes in democrats, republicans, left, right, center, right wing, left wing, extremists…etc. Pull the curtain back, take the red pill, take off the glasses – do whatever you need to do in order to stop living in the matrix. See beyond politics. There are no politics! It’s us against them now. That’s the way it is and has been for decades. Our government has been hijacked by a bunch of self serving, big business gangster thugs that trample over the constitution and the bill of rights.

We are treading a very thin line here. Orwell’s book is much more fact than fiction these days.

http://startthinkingright.wordpress...-analyzes-what-the-health-bill-actually-says/

http://www.hunteridge.com/blog/america/health-bill-summary-heres-what-citizens-see/
 
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