Recoleta . Zona Liberada - Entraderas

[fifs2]

Perhaps the more appropriate question is "do you feel safer or less safe in BA than you did 1-2 years ago?" or "Do you feel safer in BA than whatever other city you want to compare?" I think that the issue (statistics aside) is that many people that live here now have the sensation/feeling/perception that it is less safe in BA than one or two years ago. This may be because the media is reporting more crime, people are talking more about crime, and/or crime has increased, doesn't really matter, if you feel less safe, you feel less safe, may or may not be justified. I personally feel it is a little misleading to simply compare crime statistics of BA with those of another city, because as has been pointed out, in many cases crime in other cities is concentrated in particular areas, and is not prevalent city wide as it seems to be here.

Statistics can be useful in many cases and help answerer several questions, but they do not always change/influence perceptions. I remember one day in the late 1980's sitting on a Continental Airlines plane ready to take off at the Stapleton (Denver, CO) airport. It was snowing like crazy and on the second trip back into the cabin to look at the wings, the Captain sort of scratched his head and decided to return to the gate area for another de-icing. This was 24 hours after a Continental Airlines plane had crashed on take off at Stapleton because the crew failed to request a second de-icing. The passengers were clearly getting edgy and very nervous. I remember I said to my seat mate "hey, statistically we couldn't be much safer, same airline, same airport, 24 hours later, no way!" Do you think this made us feel any safer, nope, but a couple double gin & tonics did. So, in the same vain as Citygirl, I don't care what the stats say, I think a lot of people feel it is less safe in BA today than a couple years ago.

As a control freak who developed a flying fear I wish I hadnt just read this post...funny and pertinent but wish I hadnt read it...

 

[DavieW]

Statistics can be useful in many cases and help answerer several questions, but they do not always change/influence perceptions.

And they're totally skewed when comparing statistics for a US city and BA. Not only because in a US city the crime tends to be localized in known 'bad' neighbourhoods, but because in BA we (as in 'the expats') are very much a targeted minority. If you look like a gringo you're that much more likely to be targeted because of the assumption that you've got something worth stealing. And as this is a site for expats to discuss their experiences, you're going to get a lot of discussion about the crime rate.

An Argentinian view of crime in the US (or anywhere else) is completely irrelevant to any discussion about crime in BA amongst expats living here.

 

[joeteixido]

Statistics can be useful in many cases and help answerer several questions, but they do not always change/influence perceptions. I remember one day in the late 1980's sitting on a Continental Airlines plane ready to take off at the Stapleton (Denver, CO) airport. It was snowing like crazy and on the second trip back into the cabin to look at the wings, the Captain sort of scratched his head and decided to return to the gate area for another de-icing. This was 24 hours after a Continental Airlines plane had crashed on take off at Stapleton because the crew failed to request a second de-icing. The passengers were clearly getting edgy and very nervous. I remember I said to my seat mate "hey, statistically we couldn't be much safer, same airline, same airport, 24 hours later, no way!" Do you think this made us feel any safer, nope, but a couple double gin & tonics did. So, in the same vain as Citygirl, I don't care what the stats say, I think a lot of people feel it is less safe in BA today than a couple years ago.

BOOM! This is what I'm talking about!

 

[HGQ2112]

trennod,

And I respect your right to "feel" however it makes you feel "comfortable". However, could you tell me, please, how statistically if I get shot in the face by a gang member that is any different than if I get shot in the face by a white-collar suburban crackhead, who is a having a bad day? Still an attempted murder charge. Still a stat. And as far as those "peaky" unreported crimes, what makes you think someone in BA is less likely to report a crime than someone in Chicago? Where is the evidence for that? Do you think every rape gets reported in Chicago? Every assault as guys leave a bar at 4:00 AM? Seriously..I love this argument. Ignore the actual, factual statistics, because there is the imaginary "unreported crime behemoth", which of course only occurs in "my country... city...whatever". Feel away...I am sticking to facts. I'd walk blindfolded through BA, before I walked Chicago armed with an Uzi. Detroit anyone? Miami? East St.Louis? Baltimore? NYC? Please...crime everywhere.

 

[HGQ2112]

joeteixido,

I understand that stats don't = perceived mindset. Psychologically proven fact. However, it doesn't mean the distorted perception is correct...nor should we pander to those who preach it as a replacement for fact. Just cause everyone is living in an "imaginary world" doesn't make it real. Just ask "Alice"...and the American voters who still think they have an actual electoral "choice" come November.

 

[HGQ2112]

DavieW,

Why are stats "skewed" according to you, when comparing Chicago and BA? Is it solely based on your contention that in Chicago they only occur in "bad places". I mean, lets's be candid...that is somewhat true anywhere. However, there is no immune sector in Chicago to crime. I lived in the best zip code in the city, in a secured building, with door staff, front desk personnel and armed security. One night, a break in into the bike room and over 50 bikes were lifted. Crime finds a way...when it wants to...and there is no "safe place" in Chicago or BA. There are just some sectors safer than others in both locales. As for being targeted...man, just try being white and going into some Chicago neighborhoods, or try being black and going into other alternate Chicago neighborhoods. Targeting happens everywhere...based on perceptions of wealth, race, ethnicity...you name it. Nothing special about what is going on in BA...just that this time, it's happening to you. Keep it real...BA is a cakewalk compared to most USA major cities.

 

[HGQ2112]

fifs2,

Yeah, I get your argument. Presented this way, I have no quarrel with that. I travel globally quite a bit and I cannot think of one place in the world right now, at least major city, where folks are going, "I feel safer now than 5 years ago." Sad...but we are living in an increasingly violent world and my projections for the next 5-10 years...ehhhh...let's talk about airline flights and deicing instead. Can't be any worse. BA is getting worse, but so are many of the same places folks are fleeing to, in order to "escape". Insert proverbial frying pan/fire here.

 

[HGQ2112]

Sergio,

OK, fine...12 million in BA, proper, not 15 million. So, instead of a multiplier of 5, you now "only" multiply by 4, in order to just reach equilibrium with Chicago crime stats. Make you feel better? And, believe me, having literally lived in Chicago's "best zip code", bad crime, happens to good people. Nowhere was safe. You adapt and are vigilant is all.

 

[HGQ2112]

DavieW,

You posted: "I'm in no way saying it's not good to have locals on the site, as long as they're helpful and supportive and realize that they're likely to have to listen to their culture, pizza, president, women, men and crime-rate being spoken about in a negative light."

Wow. Unlike all the others who disagreed with me...this was "special". Soooooo...that "negative light" just keeps on shining, right? Not like some poor BA local could wonder onto this site and, you know...silly me...maybe hear one or two positive things...right? How's that whole assimilation thing working out for you, DavieW? As for me, I am clueless why anyone would target an expat...you know, given their positive spirit, amicable nature and positive contributions. Completely at a loss.

 

[Happy Camper]

I don't personally care WHAT the murder/crime rate is anywhere else. Why? Because I don't live there. I live here. And I'd be really interested to hear if anyone feels that Buenos Aires is getting safer these days. And if so - please tell me where you live.

Yes, Open Door-ish. Safer living come's at a cost, it's worth every cent/peso.