So effing rude!

[Gringoboy]

My brother's first name is Caradoc.
Would that get passed the censors?

 

[Lovin BA]

I know what you all mean. It's like they don't like foreigners but can't wait to take advantage. It's too bad. This is a lovely country but get some manners.

 

[Guillo]

I find it strange that there are so many Argentinians on an expat site, taking offence. If I was on Londonexpats I couldn't see myself slagging off a Pole who didn't like the English food, the weather, or found some Brits rude.....but here it's like the secret police, who do you guys really work for?

Sorry, I'm a local. Can I also post here? Should I ask you for authorization?

If you trash talk people, people will take offense. It you don't want anyone to discuss with you, you probably should try a blog instead of a forum. Or perhaps a private forum where you can discuss with whoever you want to discuss.
Really, nothing personal but your original posts where quite aggressive.

 

[Celia]

That's because I'm stuck in the country against my will. And I was treated badly by someone who laughed and derided my accent, which would get them the sack in many other countries because it's racist behaviour. And I am traipsing around with an infected c-section scar, an injured sacro-iliac joint, a two week old baby and a 2.5 year old child doing useless tramites over and over....so maybe I was feeling a little postnatal anger, but it wasn't against the country, just the people answering the phone at the registro who were incredibly rude...

 

[Celia]

Sorry Gringoboy, Caradoc's not on the list (great name btw)...here's the link to the name list so you can check it out.
http://www.buenosaires.gov.ar/registrocivil/nombres/busqueda/buscador_nombres.php

 

[fifs2]

That's because I'm stuck in the country against my will. And I was treated badly by someone who laughed and derided my accent, which would get them the sack in many other countries because it's racist behaviour. And I am traipsing around with an infected c-section scar, an injured sacro-iliac joint, a two week old baby and a 2.5 year old child doing useless tramites over and over....so maybe I was feeling a little postnatal anger, but it wasn't against the country, just the people answering the phone at the registro who were incredibly rude...

For goodness sake have some empathy guys, try going to any country and being held up at gun point with a small child and see how happy and positive you are feeling afterwards as in Celias case.

 

[Sockhopper]

Ptolemy, re your "we refuse to name our child Che, Nestor, Anibal, etc. AND we REFUSE to have our child held as a political and cultural hostage to this country!!!!!!!" ..............Your latter sentiment is, I'm upset to say, exactly what foreign extremists say when they emigrate to OUR countries and detest our social givens and values. That you're white and British and referring to Argentine culture don't make that attitude acceptable. I don't see any difference. I’m white, British and Canadian. You've confused me as to which group behaves how.

I visit BA 5 weeks a year only, took an audio beginners' course at home only, in Castellano, before my second trip, have almost no vocabulary and haven't studied enough. But still, a BA cabbie told me that I spoke Castellan 'exactly like a university professor' and refused my tip due to the fact we’d had a good conversation. Ugh? He was the first person I'd tried my Spanish or Castellano on! I thought he was just flattering me at first but he saw that and quickly put pay to it. I told him in Spanish, "But I have no words!". He said that didn't matter because what I did say was correct.

The point is that accent is not some tedious embellishment meant to scourge foreigners' attempts to speak. How you pronounce something goes to the root of comprehension, what people hear or can’t hear you say. I had to go to school in Paris to straighten out the pronunciation of 'faim' from 'femme' and undo my confusion. I had to do that again in Quebec when I lost out on securing theatre tickets because I didn't know that Quebecois French says 'oh' for the French sound 'oooooooh' as in "groupe". Very frustrating but nonetheless it was my problem, not something I could blame a culture or some person for – particularly not to their face!

When I run into communication stalemates often in BA, it's my job to apologize - I'm the one who's not speaking the official language of where I am, Argentina! 'Phone conversations are the hardest for me, impossible. Had a bureaucrat invited me to her office so that she could glean my meaning from visual cues from me, I would have been grateful for her interest in my matter and asked, "Donde, senora....manana?" Surely Celia can say that and count to 12 after 4 years in Argentina? Had she done so and attended, she just may have made an ally.

Argentina's list of 13, 800 permitted names did not limit you to choosing names for your children indicative of aspects of Argentine or South American political history which you seem to find disagreeable. "Britain" is a listed acceptable name for boys and girls. "Zenobio" is another possibility for a boy since it sounds similar to 'xenophobia'. (Scrap that -it's not a good idea to pass to your children negativity about their land of birth.) How then about "William", or "Kate" if it's a girl?

If British acceptance of immigration has, in fact, at a personal level between different cultures, moved beyond white British eating curry in Indian restaurants from the 1950's on, then calling your daughter "Salome" would indisputably support your claim. But you needn't go that far. How about "Zara" in recognition of every British city's high-street's fashion shopping?

For a boy, how about "Nick" (like the head of the British Nationalist Party)? Or "Aiden", the most popular US name in 2010 for a boy? These are on Argentina's list too. That list is not old-fashioned as I mistakenly pre-supposed. You could even have called an Argentine-born son, "Mohammed" spelled in either of 2 different ways - this being now the most popular name for male babies born in Britain. If you don't like that, there's "Jesus".

Denmark, Spain, and Germany also each have lists of accepted names for babies born and registered there. Did Celia or you think that Argentina's culture would be closer to Britain's than countries in the EU? Did Argentina owe you to be?

I found aggressive and shocking Celia saying to that government employee, "I asked why can't you understand a word of what I'm saying.". It's important to separate the frustrations posed by bureaucratic red tape from the bureaucrat you're asking for help. If Celia doesn't speak Spanish or Castallano fluently yet, no matter, but it is her problem. Try pronouncing "ball" and "bowl" in English in the US and Canada and see how well they can make you out.

I'm curious to know why Celia left her 'good British manners' at home and why she and/or you moved to Argentina. Was it done under duress, in exasperation with life at home, or so the two of you could be better off financially? They're fine reasons to relocate but as forums like this one show, moving and being happy somewhere else require more than merely tolerating locals' culture and language while the clock ticks. I doubt that Celia would have received a good response in any foreign country once she asked that accusatory question. Why should she? I think that the bureaucrat laughing at it speaks to how nice portenos are. I can’t think of a more polite way for a person who didn’t speak English to have defused Celia’s insult that portenos don’t like foreigners.

 

[steveinbsas]

Sorry, I'm a local. Can I also post here? Should I ask you for authorization?

If you trash talk people, people will take offense. It you don't want anyone to discuss with you, you probably should try a blog instead of a forum. Or perhaps a private forum where you can discuss with whoever you want to discuss.
Really, nothing personal but your original posts where quite aggressive.

What's a local?

Does that mean that you are a citizen of Argentina?

If not, how long have you lived here?

And how long does Celia have to live here before she can also be considered a local?

Perhaps I should ask how many babies she has to "produce" on Argentine soil before she achieves that distinction as well.

 

[Celia]

I never insulted the secretary, it was they who laughed at me & said they couldn't understand a word I was saying. I merely asked why.....
So save your energy and your personal digs and your outpouring of hatred at the little foreign woman. Surely I'm not worth this much fuss.

 

[Guillo]

What's a local?

As local resident born here?

And how long does Celia have to live here before she can also be considered a local?

I don't know, I guess as long as it takes to have fluency with the language and the customs.
I was just answering to her post complaining about locals being here and posting on the forum, and asking who were we working for. So I really don't understand your point.

I must add: noone hates you here, but you seem to hate it all, really. I'll just refrain from posting in whinny posts like this, have a good life.